Was unbanning Libertas the correct decision?

[Filuwaúrdjan]

I don't understand why people have nostalgia for NYC in the 1970s. I get nostalgia for previous decades (of course), but the 70s? Due to the property booms of that general era it was actually in the 1970s that bohemia was finally priced out of its historic haunts in Manhattan. I guess that it might seem odd that this happened at the same time as urban blight got worse and crime spiraled out of control (the bizarre idea that this is ever a good thing is screamingly, nay, howlingly, bourgeois. In certain circles nothing gives away a trust fund and a private education quite as reliably as a hard-on for for urban misery), but that was the 70s for you. Same thing happened in a lot of other big cities. Bizarre decade that one, and that's before we consider the clothes...

[Sol]

I don't understand why people have nostalgia for NYC in the 1970s. I get nostalgia for previous decades (of course), but the 70s? Due to the property booms of that general era it was actually in the 1970s that bohemia was finally priced out of its historic haunts in Manhattan. I guess that it might seem odd that this happened at the same time as urban blight got worse and crime spiraled out of control (the bizarre idea that this is ever a good thing is screamingly, nay, howlingly, bourgeois. In certain circles nothing gives away a trust fund and a private education quite as reliably as a hard-on for for urban misery), but that was the 70s for you. Same thing happened in a lot of other big cities. Bizarre decade that one, and that's before we consider the clothes...

I actually rather like the 70s fashion...

[Filuwaúrdjan]

I actually rather like the 70s fashion...

Seek immediate psychiatric help.

[Sol]

Well, I have curly hair. So that aspect plays in my favor. And wacky color combos are cool, and big glasses.

In any case, yeah, Snowstalker is being is rather bigoted in this particular instance, although he's far from the only one (see the response to flirting between Retromike and Adam). So yeah.

[Oakvale]

(see the response to flirting between Retromike and Adam).

Really, it's bigoted now to be creeped out by grooming?

To pay homage to Libertas of old:

[Sol]

(see the response to flirting between Retromike and Adam).

Really, it's bigoted now to be creeped out by grooming?

To pay homage to Libertas of old:

[traininthedistance]

(the bizarre idea that this is ever a good thing is screamingly, nay, howlingly, bourgeois. In certain circles nothing gives away a trust fund and a private education quite as reliably as a hard-on for for urban misery)

Oh, man, I remember getting into that with opebo back in the day.  Think that was the moment when I realized what an awful human being he was.

(To be perfectly honest, there are certain of opebo's sins that I see in myself.  But that's sure not one of them, and at least I have a proper sense of shame about the whole thing.)

[Marokai Backbeat]

What Oakvale said is more or less right. I don't give a f**k about Libertas' new political views and think it's transparently shallow that so many people are now defending the guy just because he came back, with nothing else to show for his alleged personal evolution other than "hey guys, I'm a liberal now! and I've been checking my privilege so hard!" and then a bunch of people here started eating it up. Libertas' general behavior is no less disruptive, his attitude no less unhinged, than it ever was before, and if he hadn't made some transformation to generic young gay leftist I would wager half the people that are defending him wouldn't be either.

Even the thought process that led to his unbanning continues to elude me. Like, why? Did someone on the team just wake up one day and feel like unbanning someone so they just threw a dart at the wall? Even if we're going to accept the idea behind unbanning people (which I don't, it seems completely pointless, there is no net-gain here) why him, of all people?

And all the accusations of bigotry and prudery are so ridiculous at this point so as to not even be worth responding to. You do a disservice to the weight behind those words by using them so wantonly.

[IceSpear]

(see the response to flirting between Retromike and Adam).

Really, it's bigoted now to be creeped out by grooming?

Grooming? Isn't Adam in college?

[Boris]

"Creepy" and "socially awkward" are better terms than "grooming." Can you imagine if Adam were a woman? Retromike would have been banned instantly.

[traininthedistance]

Even if we're going to accept the idea behind unbanning people (which I don't, it seems completely pointless, there is no net-gain here) why him, of all people?

The unbannings of Simfan and Aizen (and, Dave willing, Mechaman) are most certainly net gains.

[Thomas D]

Sure

[IceSpear]

"Creepy" and "socially awkward" are better terms than "grooming." Can you imagine if Adam were a woman? Retromike would have been banned instantly.

Well, that's an understatement. The term grooming isn't even remotely similar to creepy or socially awkward, and is a pretty serious accusation to throw out.

[Obnoxiously Slutty Girly Girl]

I don't understand why people have nostalgia for NYC in the 1970s. I get nostalgia for previous decades (of course), but the 70s? Due to the property booms of that general era it was actually in the 1970s that bohemia was finally priced out of its historic haunts in Manhattan. I guess that it might seem odd that this happened at the same time as urban blight got worse and crime spiraled out of control (the bizarre idea that this is ever a good thing is screamingly, nay, howlingly, bourgeois. In certain circles nothing gives away a trust fund and a private education quite as reliably as a hard-on for for urban misery), but that was the 70s for you. Same thing happened in a lot of other big cities. Bizarre decade that one, and that's before we consider the clothes...

I don't have nostalgia for an era I never lived through, and I would not wish to live in 1970s New York. Thankfully lead was banned from American fuel in the 70s leading to the eventual drop in crime that happened to coincide with the Giuliani years. However Times Square was basically turned from an adult playground into a children's playground, while Manhattan as a whole was turned into a playground for the wealthy and tourists by Bloomberg. In the process NYC has lost a lot of the 'edge' it once had, so I do seek out vestiges of what once made NYC a unique, edgy, 'adult' destination. I don't think parties involving consenting adults engaging in sexual behavior were what made 1970s NYC an unpleasant place to live.

When I told my psychologist about my 'orgy' parties, he compared it to the old Plato's Retreat swingers club of the late 70s/early 80s (except a gay version of course). There is nothing wrong with a little sexual exploration.

And besides, I am a Classics major; despite not having practiced any of the languages I've studied in years, Latin remains my strongest non-English language. The ancient Romans were quite famous for their orgy parties, so it was also like experiencing the ancient Rome I studied firsthand.

Snowstalker is not even a New Yorker, so I'm not sure why he has nostalgia for 1970s New York.

[Obnoxiously Slutty Girly Girl]

What Oakvale said is more or less right. I don't give a f**k about Libertas' new political views and think it's transparently shallow that so many people are now defending the guy just because he came back, with nothing else to show for his alleged personal evolution other than "hey guys, I'm a liberal now! and I've been checking my privilege so hard!" and then a bunch of people here started eating it up. Libertas' general behavior is no less disruptive, his attitude no less unhinged, than it ever was before, and if he hadn't made some transformation to generic young gay leftist I would wager half the people that are defending him wouldn't be either.

Even the thought process that led to his unbanning continues to elude me. Like, why? Did someone on the team just wake up one day and feel like unbanning someone so they just threw a dart at the wall? Even if we're going to accept the idea behind unbanning people (which I don't, it seems completely pointless, there is no net-gain here) why him, of all people?

And all the accusations of bigotry and prudery are so ridiculous at this point so as to not even be worth responding to. You do a disservice to the weight behind those words by using them so wantonly.

I've never said "hey guys I'm a liberal now", nor is my change in political outlook the reason why I sought to be unbanned. Abandoning libertarianism and becoming active in local Democratic politics was part of my organic political growth as I aged and graduated from college.

While you and Oakvale might still hate me for whatever reason, to pretend that I am the same old 'bad' Libertas with a red avatar is nonsense, and many posters old and new appreciate what I contribute to the forum now.

[Obnoxiously Slutty Girly Girl]

"Creepy" and "socially awkward" are better terms than "grooming." Can you imagine if Adam were a woman? Retromike would have been banned instantly.

I don't know what the story is between Adam and Retromike, other than that the 3 of us have joked about becoming roommates together.

I'm 24, Adam is 20, I don't think there is anything 'creepy' about us joking around like that. The half-plus-seven rule for a 24-year-old like myself is 12+7=19, which makes 20-year-old Adam a year older than the acceptable minimum age for dating, but we're not dating, all we've done is joke about being roommates over the internet. (Yeah Adam and I have called each other "cute", but I still can't imagine that being seen as 'creepy' although maybe some might cringe at the corniness)

I do think Snowstalker should apologize to Adam for describing him as "slack-jawed" in this thread. Having become friends with him, I think Adam is an intelligent 20-year-old young man who is nice to everybody and doesn't deserve to be insulted like that.

[Simfan34]

"Creepy" and "socially awkward" are better terms than "grooming." Can you imagine if Adam were a woman? Retromike would have been banned instantly.

I think that applies to retromike, who falls afoul of the half-plus-seven rule.

[Mr. Smith]

Given the way this has gone, and the Lief vs oakvale thread...I'm starting to lean towards no.

[TheDeadFlagBlues]

No.

Not because I care about the sex stories or whatever. Libertas needs to get a Xanax prescription and relax. He defends himself against his detractors like he's on trial or something.

[Flake]

He definitely has the potential to be a good poster, but right now he just comes off as self-centered (and the whole retromike-fitzgerald-libertas thing is super creepy and should stop).

[Snowstalker Mk. II]

He definitely has the potential to be a good poster, but right now he just comes off as self-centered (and the whole retromike-fitzgerald-libertas thing is super creepy and should stop).

You have not seen his original incarnation. Other than now being politically and sexually agreeable to Atlas he has not significantly changed.

[Obnoxiously Slutty Girly Girl]

No.

Not because I care about the sex stories or whatever. Libertas needs to get a Xanax prescription and relax. He defends himself against his detractors like he's on trial or something.

Um yeah that's about the complete opposite of what I need right now.

[Obnoxiously Slutty Girly Girl]

He definitely has the potential to be a good poster, but right now he just comes off as self-centered (and the whole retromike-fitzgerald-libertas thing is super creepy and should stop).

You have not seen his original incarnation. Other than now being politically and sexually agreeable to Atlas he has not significantly changed.

Um, neither have you.

And the few who have who are criticizing me in this thread claiming I haven't changed either are simply absurd (Oakvale was friendly toward the 'original incarnation' of me, not one of the people calling for my head when I actually deserved it) or people who personally hated me then and still hold a grudge (Marokai).

Meanwhile I have heard from people who hated the 'original incarnation' of me for being a trollish asshole, were against my unbanning fearing I was the same old Libertas, but who have recognized that I have really changed and welcomed me to the forum.

[🐒Gods of Prosperity🔱🐲💸]

No.

Not because I care about the sex stories or whatever. Libertas needs to get a Xanax prescription and relax. He defends himself against his detractors like he's on trial or something.

There are some posters here who are obsessed with putting him on trial before the moderators to get him rebanned. They need to chill out  (no prescription necessary) and give Libertas a chance.

[Bacon King]

I'm increasingly disliking both sides of this

Also windjammer Wtf please don't repost my old tmi posts