Slovenia referendum on teh gays, Dec 20th

[🦀🎂🦀🎂]

Most Europeans, being  a continent  of serial proud adulterers, would look pretty silly talking about the sanctity of marriage.

[DavidB.]

I was successful in identifying the type of attitude you portrayed, kataak, I only thought you were being serious...

My own invention, although I am using it only on that forum as in Polish it doesn't sound well.
:I

This is my very real struggle with the amazing word left-leftist. "Linkslinkse" is simply not going to fly in the Netherlands...

[Iannis]

A little bit offtopic, but I've always thought it interesting that in gay adoption in Europe seems to be so controversial considering that it's basically always been the opposite in the US. Why is that so?

You mean that in USA the issue is about gay marriages and there is no objection to gay adoption? Ot that there is no relevant difference between % in favour of gay marriages and gay adoption?

In North America, gay adoption was usually 20% more popular than gay marriage. I seen no number since the huge change in SSM fortunes in USA, though.

Gay adoption is not considered as a controversial subject by most people (There has been an huge debate in some states whether private adoption providers (usually churches) could decide to exclude gays from being potential parents).

Really? In Italy about 50-60% of people are in favour of gay civil union, but only 30% are for gay adoption.
Regardless my personal opinion on these matters, I find more reasonable to have doubts when there is the involvement of third person rather than when it's just a matter of personal choices between two adult persons.

[ingemann]

Tbh I think it's more likely the ECHR forces them to accept it, tbh

Not going to happen, the only people who want ECHR to push on social issues are liberals in the more conservative countries, the more liberal countries will do anything to avoid opening that Pandora's Box.

[ingemann]

A little bit offtopic, but I've always thought it interesting that in gay adoption in Europe seems to be so controversial considering that it's basically always been the opposite in the US. Why is that so?

You mean that in USA the issue is about gay marriages and there is no objection to gay adoption? Ot that there is no relevant difference between % in favour of gay marriages and gay adoption?

In North America, gay adoption was usually 20% more popular than gay marriage. I seen no number since the huge change in SSM fortunes in USA, though.

Gay adoption is not considered as a controversial subject by most people (There has been an huge debate in some states whether private adoption providers (usually churches) could decide to exclude gays from being potential parents).

Really? In Italy about 50-60% of people are in favour of gay civil union, but only 30% are for gay adoption.
Regardless my personal opinion on these matters, I find more reasonable to have doubts when there is the involvement of third person rather than when it's just a matter of personal choices between two adult persons.

Yes it's quite natural, it's not because people think that gay people are evil (or pedophile) necessary, but more that people think that children are better off with a mom and dad (and honestly it's not because there's a major surplus of children to adopt in Europe). I myself became pro-gay adoption 10 years ago, when I read up on children raised by gay parents (and found there was no real difference from children raised by heterosexual parents), but I think the belief that children are better off being raised by a male and female role model is quite natural.