Do you support unbanning Libertas and/or Einzige?

[Filuwaúrdjan]

Most of his more offensive posts were deleted. But, whatever. He's not coming back.

[RosettaStoned]

 Both. They were great trolls who need to come back. Straha too, but he hates the Atlas Forum.

[I spent the winter writing songs about getting better]

Inks as I explained a repentant murderer certainly would have that taken into consideration for eligibility for parole.

What about someone who turns to Allah, or the teachings of Buddha? Or should only one specific sky daddy count?

I missed this last time, sorry, I was also in a bit of a hurry. But if you'll notice, Einzige is not a Christian and has certainly not become, yet he has unquestionably changed and become repentant hence my lobbying for his unbanning. I'm sure this can happen to those turning to other religions too of course as well.

Inks as I explained a repentant murderer certainly would have that taken into consideration for eligibility for parole.

So if you therefore "turn the other cheek" why do you oppose the extending of grace to the repentant?

Because there are rules, written down for all to see that say they shouldn't get that grace?  There is no rule saying I must report posts I think break the rules.

Then those rules clearly contradict the will of God.

The Biblical principles of God's grace do not apply to an Internet forum.  That's like trying to argue that a murderer who receives life in prison should be let out early under the auspices of grace if he turns to Jesus and truly changes his heart.

Care to respond, Father Zack?

Surely 'Father' is RC? Maybe he can be the Reverend Zack. Or the Very Reverend Zack; I've always liked 'Very Reverend' as a title. Is there also a Quite Reverend? Maybe that is the ideal title.

We don't really use those titles at the type of church I'd go to (just like something like "follower of Jesus" is usually used instead of "Christian".) The pastors just go by their first names.

But you're advocating for the unbanning of these people simply on their word they've changed.  What evidence have you seen that they've actually changed?  Would you parole people simply for saying they've changed?

No we have actual evidence that they have. Einzige behaved himself upon his returns and Libertas did too in his comeback post.

[Queen Mum Inks.LWC]

Inks as I explained a repentant murderer certainly would have that taken into consideration for eligibility for parole.

What about someone who turns to Allah, or the teachings of Buddha? Or should only one specific sky daddy count?

I missed this last time, sorry, I was also in a bit of a hurry. But if you'll notice, Einzige is not a Christian and has certainly not become, yet he has unquestionably changed and become repentant hence my lobbying for his unbanning. I'm sure this can happen to those turning to other religions too of course as well.

Inks as I explained a repentant murderer certainly would have that taken into consideration for eligibility for parole.

So if you therefore "turn the other cheek" why do you oppose the extending of grace to the repentant?

Because there are rules, written down for all to see that say they shouldn't get that grace?  There is no rule saying I must report posts I think break the rules.

Then those rules clearly contradict the will of God.

The Biblical principles of God's grace do not apply to an Internet forum.  That's like trying to argue that a murderer who receives life in prison should be let out early under the auspices of grace if he turns to Jesus and truly changes his heart.

Care to respond, Father Zack?

Surely 'Father' is RC? Maybe he can be the Reverend Zack. Or the Very Reverend Zack; I've always liked 'Very Reverend' as a title. Is there also a Quite Reverend? Maybe that is the ideal title.

We don't really use those titles at the type of church I'd go to (just like something like "follower of Jesus" is usually used instead of "Christian".) The pastors just go by their first names.

But you're advocating for the unbanning of these people simply on their word they've changed.  What evidence have you seen that they've actually changed?  Would you parole people simply for saying they've changed?

No we have actual evidence that they have. Einzige behaved himself upon his returns and Libertas did too in his comeback post.

He had VERY limited posts... So, 20 sentences or so from a convict convinces you they've changed?  That's ridiculous.

I'm not saying I'm saying he should be permabanned, I'm just saying your logic is  flawed.

[Queen Mum Inks.LWC]

Inks as I explained a repentant murderer certainly would have that taken into consideration for eligibility for parole.

What about someone who turns to Allah, or the teachings of Buddha? Or should only one specific sky daddy count?

I missed this last time, sorry, I was also in a bit of a hurry. But if you'll notice, Einzige is not a Christian and has certainly not become, yet he has unquestionably changed and become repentant hence my lobbying for his unbanning. I'm sure this can happen to those turning to other religions too of course as well.

Inks as I explained a repentant murderer certainly would have that taken into consideration for eligibility for parole.

So if you therefore "turn the other cheek" why do you oppose the extending of grace to the repentant?

Because there are rules, written down for all to see that say they shouldn't get that grace?  There is no rule saying I must report posts I think break the rules.

Then those rules clearly contradict the will of God.

The Biblical principles of God's grace do not apply to an Internet forum.  That's like trying to argue that a murderer who receives life in prison should be let out early under the auspices of grace if he turns to Jesus and truly changes his heart.

Care to respond, Father Zack?

Surely 'Father' is RC? Maybe he can be the Reverend Zack. Or the Very Reverend Zack; I've always liked 'Very Reverend' as a title. Is there also a Quite Reverend? Maybe that is the ideal title.

We don't really use those titles at the type of church I'd go to (just like something like "follower of Jesus" is usually used instead of "Christian".) The pastors just go by their first names.

But you're advocating for the unbanning of these people simply on their word they've changed.  What evidence have you seen that they've actually changed?  Would you parole people simply for saying they've changed?

No we have actual evidence that they have. Einzige behaved himself upon his returns and Libertas did too in his comeback post.

I can accept the logic with Einzige.  But Libertas hardly had any posts at all.  And doesn't the mere attempt to "escape from prison"/circumvent the ban show something about their old personality not changing?

[Insula Dei]

Inks as I explained a repentant murderer certainly would have that taken into consideration for eligibility for parole.

So if you therefore "turn the other cheek" why do you oppose the extending of grace to the repentant?

Because there are rules, written down for all to see that say they shouldn't get that grace?  There is no rule saying I must report posts I think break the rules.

Then those rules clearly contradict the will of God.

The Biblical principles of God's grace do not apply to an Internet forum.  That's like trying to argue that a murderer who receives life in prison should be let out early under the auspices of grace if he turns to Jesus and truly changes his heart.

Care to respond, Father Zack?

Surely 'Father' is RC? Maybe he can be the Reverend Zack. Or the Very Reverend Zack; I've always liked 'Very Reverend' as a title. Is there also a Quite Reverend? Maybe that is the ideal title.

We don't really use those titles at the type of church I'd go to (just like something like "follower of Jesus" is usually used instead of "Christian".) The pastors just go by their first names.

Do the pastors wear coat and ties at your church, or just an open shirt like Pastor Rick Warren?

The latter, sometimes even a T-shirt. And jeans too obviously. I've never seen anyone in a tie, congregation or staff.

Serious question; have you ever been tested for an autistic spectrum disorder?

You have been diagnosed (correct?) with Asperger's. And yet I've never seen you fail to detect irony on here....  

(That's not a personal attack or a 'suggestion' of any kind, btw.)

Has afleitch been diagnosed with Asperger's? Or am I misreading your post?

[Phony Moderate]

Inks as I explained a repentant murderer certainly would have that taken into consideration for eligibility for parole.

So if you therefore "turn the other cheek" why do you oppose the extending of grace to the repentant?

Because there are rules, written down for all to see that say they shouldn't get that grace?  There is no rule saying I must report posts I think break the rules.

Then those rules clearly contradict the will of God.

The Biblical principles of God's grace do not apply to an Internet forum.  That's like trying to argue that a murderer who receives life in prison should be let out early under the auspices of grace if he turns to Jesus and truly changes his heart.

Care to respond, Father Zack?

Surely 'Father' is RC? Maybe he can be the Reverend Zack. Or the Very Reverend Zack; I've always liked 'Very Reverend' as a title. Is there also a Quite Reverend? Maybe that is the ideal title.

We don't really use those titles at the type of church I'd go to (just like something like "follower of Jesus" is usually used instead of "Christian".) The pastors just go by their first names.

Do the pastors wear coat and ties at your church, or just an open shirt like Pastor Rick Warren?

The latter, sometimes even a T-shirt. And jeans too obviously. I've never seen anyone in a tie, congregation or staff.

Serious question; have you ever been tested for an autistic spectrum disorder?

You have been diagnosed (correct?) with Asperger's. And yet I've never seen you fail to detect irony on here....  

(That's not a personal attack or a 'suggestion' of any kind, btw.)

Has afleitch been diagnosed with Asperger's? Or am I misreading your post?

I think he's said as such on here in the past.

[I spent the winter writing songs about getting better]

Inks as I explained a repentant murderer certainly would have that taken into consideration for eligibility for parole.

What about someone who turns to Allah, or the teachings of Buddha? Or should only one specific sky daddy count?

I missed this last time, sorry, I was also in a bit of a hurry. But if you'll notice, Einzige is not a Christian and has certainly not become, yet he has unquestionably changed and become repentant hence my lobbying for his unbanning. I'm sure this can happen to those turning to other religions too of course as well.

Inks as I explained a repentant murderer certainly would have that taken into consideration for eligibility for parole.

So if you therefore "turn the other cheek" why do you oppose the extending of grace to the repentant?

Because there are rules, written down for all to see that say they shouldn't get that grace?  There is no rule saying I must report posts I think break the rules.

Then those rules clearly contradict the will of God.

The Biblical principles of God's grace do not apply to an Internet forum.  That's like trying to argue that a murderer who receives life in prison should be let out early under the auspices of grace if he turns to Jesus and truly changes his heart.

Care to respond, Father Zack?

Surely 'Father' is RC? Maybe he can be the Reverend Zack. Or the Very Reverend Zack; I've always liked 'Very Reverend' as a title. Is there also a Quite Reverend? Maybe that is the ideal title.

We don't really use those titles at the type of church I'd go to (just like something like "follower of Jesus" is usually used instead of "Christian".) The pastors just go by their first names.

But you're advocating for the unbanning of these people simply on their word they've changed.  What evidence have you seen that they've actually changed?  Would you parole people simply for saying they've changed?

No we have actual evidence that they have. Einzige behaved himself upon his returns and Libertas did too in his comeback post.

I can accept the logic with Einzige.  But Libertas hardly had any posts at all.  And doesn't the mere attempt to "escape from prison"/circumvent the ban show something about their old personality not changing?

Unlike a certain resident of Bakersfield, they didn't come back to cause trouble. Not that I'd approve of it, but they could be rebanned too if they caused trouble, which I doubt. I believe in the goodness of people and that I don't have the right to pass judgement or ban.

Here's a little anecdote I've told before: I knew a guy who was not a Christian in a metalcore band. They were very much not a Christian band. However to get booked at a Christian venue that was one of the few places in town booking all ages shows, they lied and said they were. They played all their songs and lyrics unedited, and no one noticed. But they never got booked again and the venue probably found out. Is that wrong and un-Christian? Absolutely. Would Jesus refuse to associate with someone like that again? That's an action similar to the Pharisees. So is banning people and not giving them another chance and refusing grace.

[Queen Mum Inks.LWC]

I'm not saying they should be permabanned, just saying that your logic that it's like we're imprisoning them and not allowing for mostly blind grace is un-Godlike is flawed.

[Badger]

Neither. Libby's banning was in the top two most warranted and overdue in my time here, and the Forum has unquestionably been better for it since. His overture was all sweetness and light, but I give it months, if not weeks, before he was back to form. His repeated anti-semitism and holocaust denial was particularly nasty and excelled in our history only by Stark. We don't need that coming up on search engines.

As for Ziggy, any sympathy I had for his return dissapated with his lame sock puppets.

He never denied the holocaust. This is like the 2nd or third time we've argued over this.

Don't you understand, Minty?  "Facts" are not as important as feelings!

He did, and likewise showed a great "empathy" for professionals.  I collected the posts in multiple prior threads. Go look them up. Or just continue with the fan club.

I looked up "Libertas Holocaust" under the user Badger in the search and found only one of the multiple collections, which was this one: https://uselectionatlas.org/FORUM/index.php?topic=80405.msg2257786#msg2257786

Seriously, that is the lamest attempt at guilt-by-association I have seen in my entire life.  He uses an image as a signature (presumably for ironic or humorous effect) created by a man who has also created different images that portray people who have denied the Holocaust in a positive light, therefore by your brilliant powers of deduction you have determined that Libertas is a Holocaust denier via mind-control image osmosis.

<sigh> you are reporting at best half the story, but admittedly you weren't here at the time. There were many a post on a deleted (or at least locked) thread or two (can those be searched too?) He talked about how much he "loved" Dees' work (a verbatim term).

Try looking up Libby and anti-semitism or Jews, and include other posters (including Holocaust).

There was MORE than a trend there, Wormy, but shame on his Paultard fun club for not being able to distinguish that and opposition to Likud's foreign policy.

[I spent the winter writing songs about getting better]

Whoa. This is interesting in hindsight.

[Lankester Merrin]

Cool.

[Simfan34]

Well my vote was embarrassing.

Also BRTD wants a theocracy or something?!

[Grumpier Than Uncle Joe]

Well my vote was embarrassing.

Yeah, I voted for Einzige only and stuck up for that prick far too many times.  Good riddance.

[I spent the winter writing songs about getting better]

Well my vote was embarrassing.

Also BRTD wants a theocracy or something?!

Well think about this, opebo of all people, plus a guy who was primarily posting about engaging in gay orgies, would be better off under my "theocratic" rule of the forum if I was admin. I suppose things are never all that simple.

[Associate Justice PiT]

Well my vote was embarrassing.

Yeah, I voted for Einzige only and stuck up for that prick far too many times.  Good riddance.

     I voted for both, and now I can see that neither was the correct choice. It's amazing how much things can change.

[Simfan34]

Back in June when he petitioned to be unbanned I wrote that

He's apparently claimed to have become a gay Jew. I never was around when he posted but if that's his defense I don't see any good that can come of it. I mean, I just recoil thinking of the sort of posts I can imagine this would engender.

The post was deleted for being a "personal attack". I seem to have been vindicated by events.