Public non binding consultations Amendment (Failed)
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Author Topic: Public non binding consultations Amendment (Failed)  (Read 2798 times)
bore
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« on: January 23, 2015, 01:53:38 PM »
« edited: February 06, 2015, 06:19:21 AM by Senator bore »
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Sponsored by: Cris
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Senator Cris
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« Reply #1 on: January 23, 2015, 02:24:26 PM »
I thank the Speaker for putting this on the floor.

The Senators are elected by the people and I think that on the most important issues (bicameralism or consolidation, for example), the people should indicate to us the way to follow.
This is a public non binding consultation. Not binding, but the Senate should morally be obliged to follow the results of that federal consultation.

I think that this is a good proposal, and I'm opening to all thoughts of the Senators.

Also... Now I noticed that there is an error in the point 5) on "the passage of the proposal" and it should be modified in order to have the Speaker informing the SoFE of the achievement of 4 Senators. I'll present an amendment on this in the next days.
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HagridOfTheDeep
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« Reply #2 on: January 23, 2015, 03:54:39 PM »
« Edited: January 24, 2015, 12:57:16 PM by HagridOfTheDeep »
I support the sentiment behind the proposal, but do we really need more unbinding laws on the books? If it's unbinding, what do we need legislation for? Good senators will know to consult the public, and active citizens will know to speak with their senators.

I mean, if you can rebut these points, I'd be supportive, but right now I just don't know if we need this bill.

(Also, I apologize for being a sort of vote-less senator, but I might as well participate. Tongue)
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Cranberry
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« Reply #3 on: January 24, 2015, 06:19:57 AM »
Well, I for one do think that such consultations might be a good idea; they'd be similar to existing ballot initiatives in the US, I'd say, just that they are not binding.
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TNF
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« Reply #4 on: January 24, 2015, 07:49:58 AM »
What's the point? If something is non-binding, it's irrelevant.
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Senator Cris
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« Reply #5 on: January 24, 2015, 08:29:52 AM »
Do you think that binding consultations are better?
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Bacon King
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« Reply #6 on: January 24, 2015, 01:02:20 PM »
Quote from: Senator Cris on January 24, 2015, 08:29:52 AM
Do you think that binding consultations are better?

No, but there's no sense in going through a formal procedure and an official vote if it doesn't change anything.
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Senator Cris
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« Reply #7 on: January 26, 2015, 04:42:24 PM »
My amendment:

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bore
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« Reply #8 on: January 27, 2015, 06:33:36 AM »
Senators have 36 hours to object to Cris's amendment
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Fmr President & Senator Polnut
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« Reply #9 on: January 27, 2015, 06:54:28 AM »
I won't be supporting this amendment. It's an interesting process, but one without any real purpose in the end.
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TNF
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« Reply #10 on: January 27, 2015, 07:19:20 AM »
Quote from: Senator Polnut on January 27, 2015, 06:54:28 AM
I won't be supporting this amendment. It's an interesting process, but one without any real purpose in the end.
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Southern Senator North Carolina Yankee
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« Reply #11 on: January 27, 2015, 03:03:23 PM »
I sympathize wtih the idea but wonder how it would be practically implemented.
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Southern Senator North Carolina Yankee
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« Reply #12 on: January 27, 2015, 03:04:25 PM »
Quote from: Senator Cris on January 24, 2015, 08:29:52 AM
Do you think that binding consultations are better?

What would that look like?

Senators should consult with the people but they also have to be able to decide what is the best course and some times that can require an action that isn't popular in the present moment.
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windjammer
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« Reply #13 on: January 28, 2015, 01:21:32 PM »
Can someone explain me the goal of this bill?
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Senator Cris
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« Reply #14 on: January 29, 2015, 04:21:46 PM »
« Edited: January 29, 2015, 04:28:22 PM by Senator Cris »
On thorny issues (bicameralism and consolidation now, for example), the Senate, first to legislate, should listen what the people want. The Senate is not obliged to follow the results of consultations, but it should be morally obliged.
But if you think that a binding consultation is better, I'm open to this change! Smiley
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Lief 🗽
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« Reply #15 on: January 29, 2015, 04:40:26 PM »
If I understand it correctly, I think this has potential as an interesting idea. Worst case scenario, it ends up being pointless and no one ever sends any non-binding consultations to the people and the status quo is basically preserved.
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windjammer
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« Reply #16 on: January 29, 2015, 06:49:26 PM »
I tend to agree with lief.
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Fmr President & Senator Polnut
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« Reply #17 on: January 29, 2015, 06:50:43 PM »
So... best case scenario, there's a process which doesn't mean anything. Worst case scenario it's a total waste of time?
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Lief 🗽
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« Reply #18 on: January 29, 2015, 11:21:44 PM »
Quote from: Senator Polnut on January 29, 2015, 06:50:43 PM
So... best case scenario, there's a process which doesn't mean anything. Worst case scenario it's a total waste of time?

Best case scenario it's a venue for the people to give input to the Senate and be more involved in the legislative process.
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windjammer
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« Reply #19 on: January 30, 2015, 03:01:19 AM »
I will vote for it.
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Oakvale
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« Reply #20 on: January 30, 2015, 07:41:50 AM »
Why are you guys trying to legislate for what's currently accomplished by someone simply making a poll?
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Senator Cris
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« Reply #21 on: January 30, 2015, 08:17:36 AM »
Quote from: oakvale on January 30, 2015, 07:41:50 AM
Why are you guys trying to legislate for what's currently accomplished by someone simply making a poll?
Poll = 20/30 voters.
Consultation = more than 30 voters.
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Fmr President & Senator Polnut
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« Reply #22 on: January 30, 2015, 08:39:39 AM »
Quote from: Senator Cris on January 30, 2015, 08:17:36 AM
Quote from: oakvale on January 30, 2015, 07:41:50 AM
Why are you guys trying to legislate for what's currently accomplished by someone simply making a poll?
Poll = 20/30 voters.
Consultation = more than 30 voters.

Respectfully - I genuinely don't see the point of this mechanism.
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TNF
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« Reply #23 on: January 30, 2015, 11:55:53 AM »
Motion to table and save us all a lot of time.
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Senator Cris
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« Reply #24 on: January 30, 2015, 02:59:48 PM »
Quote from: Senator TNF on January 30, 2015, 11:55:53 AM
Motion to table and save us all a lot of time.
The same argument can be made for many of your proposals.


I object.
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