Just when I thought Cuomo couldn't stoop any lower... (user search)
       |           

Welcome, Guest. Please login or register.
Did you miss your activation email?
May 01, 2024, 02:04:55 AM
News: Election Simulator 2.0 Released. Senate/Gubernatorial maps, proportional electoral votes, and more - Read more

  Talk Elections
  General Politics
  U.S. General Discussion (Moderators: The Dowager Mod, Chancellor Tanterterg)
  Just when I thought Cuomo couldn't stoop any lower... (search mode)
Pages: [1]
Author Topic: Just when I thought Cuomo couldn't stoop any lower...  (Read 4497 times)
emailking
Atlas Icon
*****
Posts: 14,406
« on: January 28, 2015, 10:59:08 AM »

8 inches of snow was clearly the most devastating blizzard in the 110 history of the subway.
Weird how De Blasio found out the same time as everyone else.

And sheesh 8 inches? We still run our BUSES at well over that. The one blizzard this century that had the busses pulled was 29 inches.

They got 2 feet 40 miles away. That's within the error bars of the simulations. The models can't discriminate that kind of a difference in snowfall over that distance. It was believed the 2 feet was likely to hit NYC. You can blame physics, math, and computer science if you don't like how that works I guess. Or maybe you can make the argument that buses should run in 2 feet of snow. But as far as I can tell, the officials were acting on the best information they had.
Logged
emailking
Atlas Icon
*****
Posts: 14,406
« Reply #1 on: January 28, 2015, 03:34:24 PM »


Because by then you might be screwed?


Well you said buses in your post.

The "best information they had" would have been to listen to the actual professionals at the MTA, who knew that shutting things down this far in advance (when trains and buses can in fact run in a fair amount of snow)

But 2 feet? Even if you could get the buses running, someone still has to get there to drive it. I'm not talking about underground subway trains that run automatically. Although I imagine people still have to be there to oversee it? People that should probably be home if there's that much snow.
Logged
emailking
Atlas Icon
*****
Posts: 14,406
« Reply #2 on: January 30, 2015, 09:04:56 AM »

As far as the subways go... they don't care about snow!  Much of the system is underground, and most of the aboveground portions actively prefer to keep the trains running– not just because of the insane headache that is shutting down and starting up again– because that's the best way to clear snow off the tracks!  They would have shut down those tracks that are in depressed open cuts, but that's a very small portion of the system.

In point of fact, as far as the snow-clearing goes, SEPTA in Philly kept running trains overnight when they don't usually otherwise, for that exact reason.

The MTA knows this, because they are professionals that understand operations, so when the surprise dictum from Cuomo came down, remember that they kept the ghost trains running and keeping most of the system running would have been the right thing even had 2-3 feet of snow fallen.  I mean, the subways didn't shut down for the Blizzard of '96, as pointed out above.

But of course, Cuomo is above the degrading gruntwork of listening to people who know what they're talking about.

But what I'm saying is, if they keep the trains running overnight, aren't there employees who have to be at their work stations and oversee that whole process? E.g. to handle any problems that arise?
Logged
emailking
Atlas Icon
*****
Posts: 14,406
« Reply #3 on: February 09, 2015, 02:46:33 PM »

As far as the subways go... they don't care about snow!  Much of the system is underground, and most of the aboveground portions actively prefer to keep the trains running– not just because of the insane headache that is shutting down and starting up again– because that's the best way to clear snow off the tracks!  They would have shut down those tracks that are in depressed open cuts, but that's a very small portion of the system.

In point of fact, as far as the snow-clearing goes, SEPTA in Philly kept running trains overnight when they don't usually otherwise, for that exact reason.

The MTA knows this, because they are professionals that understand operations, so when the surprise dictum from Cuomo came down, remember that they kept the ghost trains running and keeping most of the system running would have been the right thing even had 2-3 feet of snow fallen.  I mean, the subways didn't shut down for the Blizzard of '96, as pointed out above.

But of course, Cuomo is above the degrading gruntwork of listening to people who know what they're talking about.

But what I'm saying is, if they keep the trains running overnight, aren't there employees who have to be at their work stations and oversee that whole process? E.g. to handle any problems that arise?

I guess this isn't going to get a response. But so the post isn't left hanging out there, my point is that it is a possible safety issue if employees have to show up to work to oversee the subway.

I'm assuming the trains cannot be kept running without any employees at all at the various stations to make sure everything is running properly. If that's wrong, then OK. But I'm going on that assumption, and it seems like a reasonable one to me.

Now given that people have to show up to work for this purpose, there are various logistical complications that arise. For one, it is a safety issue for the people who have the get to work in the predicted 20 inches of snow. Some of them might have issues or get stuck. This creates complications for snow removal because their vehicle may be in the way (even if that's out in the suburbs). That could also create obstacles for emergency vehicles. Moreover, if they get stuck and need to be rescued, that's more resources that have to be diverted. Not to mention that this requires a huge effort and is a major pain for the employees even if they can managed to show up with no complications.

If you shut down the subway entirely none of that is an issue. So there are certainly benefits to shutting the system down entirely. The cons are that: 1. It will be harder to clear the snow from the tracks and 2. It is a headache to start the system up again. Do the pros outweigh the cons? Cuomo apparently decided the answer is yes. So the MTA had a different opinion, but the MTA doesn't have the same set of responsibilities as the governor.

You're assuming he made a knee jerk political decision, but there may have been a lot of substantive thought that went into the decision concerning the public safety and what is best for the region as the whole. The MTA may know the best way to clear the snow from the tracks, but that's not the only consideration. In the end the system got back up and running and while it may have been a pain for them, it apparently was not a disaster or we would have heard something by now.

Philly was not projected to get as much snow so I can entirely understand that a different conclusion was reached about whether the trains should be kept running.
Logged
Pages: [1]  
Jump to:  


Login with username, password and session length

Terms of Service - DMCA Agent and Policy - Privacy Policy and Cookies

Powered by SMF 1.1.21 | SMF © 2015, Simple Machines

Page created in 0.026 seconds with 12 queries.