Which of the following countries would you rather live in?
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  Which of the following countries would you rather live in?
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Poll
Question: Which of the following countries would you rather live in?
#1
Elezabastan
 
#2
The People's Republic of the Lower Midlands
 
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Partisan results

Total Voters: 23

Author Topic: Which of the following countries would you rather live in?  (Read 2142 times)
they don't love you like i love you
BRTD
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« on: April 22, 2005, 10:47:07 PM »

both made up:

Elezabastan - a semi-democratic predominantely Muslim country. Despite being semi-democratic, Islam makes it a very conservative and repressive society. No alcohol, strip clubs or pornography is allowed. Homosexuality is very shunned and almost completely underground. Women almost always cover their heads in public and are generally treated as property by their husbands. They only recentely received the right to vote and their right is still much more restricted. While free speech exists de jure, it is very restricted, a TV producer was murdered because his show showed women in rather modest westernized clothing without headscarves. Women rarely get jobs or post-8th grade educations and are treated like property of their husbands or families. Other religions are allowed de jure but are very repressed de facto and often forced underground.

The People's Republic of the Lower Midlands - a one party communist state. Elections are in no way democratic and the government tightly controls the media and restricts free speech and opposition political activity. While most of the economy is government run however, it still tolerates the sex industry. Prostitution flourishes in the red light districts of urban centers and largely goes unignored, strip clubs and porn magazines are very common and alcohol is freely and easily available. The society is otherwise rather egalitarian. Women occupy man high positions in the government and military, in fact one of the top heads of the secret police that squash political dissent is a women. The military is over 30% female. Women have equal employment, receive equal education and are paid equal wages. The society is also home to a thriving nightlife with the government tends to ignore. Outside of banning political opposition and keeping a hold on the country, they don't care abou any further restrictions.
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John Dibble
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« Reply #1 on: April 22, 2005, 10:50:57 PM »

Both crappy options. Does either of them allow firearms(I highly doubt the second one does)?
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BRTD
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« Reply #2 on: April 22, 2005, 10:52:07 PM »

Both ban them, but they can be somewhat easily obtained and held in the rural areas.
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BRTD
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« Reply #3 on: April 22, 2005, 10:53:53 PM »

I think a more interesting question is: Would opebo prefer the second country to the US?
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John Dibble
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« Reply #4 on: April 22, 2005, 10:58:35 PM »

Ok, well, I'd probably pick the first one then - since they don't have a secret police(they probably rely more on fanatical mobs to enforce things). Also I like to eat, and communism typically doesn't do well at providing food. I'll assume the first has a more free market, so it will keep my belly at least somewhat satisfied. Can't plan a rebellion on an empty stomach, you know.

My rebellion might involve creating a new religion - get myself, or probably someone who shares most of my views who is a better actor, to be a 'prophet' and start a less oppressive religion that could easily catch on, perhaps just a revised Islam to make it easier for others to accept. Even if it's underground, it can still grow until it doesn't have to be. If killed, the prophet becomes a martyr and it'll probably spread like wildfire.
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BRTD
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« Reply #5 on: April 22, 2005, 11:10:40 PM »

Well it is semi-democratic so you wouldn't neccesarily need a revolution, if you could get a more reform-minded government elected making it more democratic so you could elect a government more to your liking. However that is very unlikely to happen in such a society. Your revolution wouldn't be too succesful either for this reason, even if you somehow succeeded you couldn't stay in power without a secular dictatorship like the Shah's Iran.

But do you agree with me opebo would take the second over the US in a heartbeat?
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Lunar
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« Reply #6 on: April 22, 2005, 11:44:07 PM »

in fact one of the top heads of the secret police that squash political dissent is a women.

Another fetish?

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hmmm..
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bgwah
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« Reply #7 on: April 22, 2005, 11:58:09 PM »

Communism sucks.

But it's better than living in a Muslim country!
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BRTD
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« Reply #8 on: April 23, 2005, 12:01:21 AM »

in fact one of the top heads of the secret police that squash political dissent is a women.

Another fetish?

same thing really, girls with guns. You also are getting an idea of how my "Republic of Minnesota" would be run. I'd probably put a female as chief officer over the seizure of Wal-Mart.

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hmmm..
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Are you implying this is contradictory? The first statement is from the second country, the second from the first.
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Lunar
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« Reply #9 on: April 23, 2005, 12:15:17 AM »

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I was noting your emphasis on strip clubs for what country you'd want to live in.  I find this amusing thing to include since its impact is minimal, even on your own live.  As soon as you settle down, lap dances from someone other than your partner become a big no-no.
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Rob
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« Reply #10 on: April 23, 2005, 12:24:02 AM »

Option 1.
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John Dibble
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« Reply #11 on: April 23, 2005, 12:31:56 AM »

Well it is semi-democratic so you wouldn't neccesarily need a revolution, if you could get a more reform-minded government elected making it more democratic so you could elect a government more to your liking. However that is very unlikely to happen in such a society. Your revolution wouldn't be too succesful either for this reason, even if you somehow succeeded you couldn't stay in power without a secular dictatorship like the Shah's Iran.

Well, like I said, I think my best chance for success is to work with religion rather than politics. Reform that and you'll reform everything else in such a society. If it came to violent revolution, I'd probably have to install myself as a dictator for a couple decades, making gradual reforms that would affect each new generation, eventually allowing for a more democratic state.

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Probably.
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SamuelBerger
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« Reply #12 on: April 23, 2005, 12:37:19 AM »

It sounds like in Elezabastan you could get a democratic election that could reform the system. So Elezabastan.
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opebo
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« Reply #13 on: April 23, 2005, 05:56:51 AM »

But do you agree with me opebo would take the second over the US in a heartbeat?

Of course I would!  It would not be an entirely ideal place in my opinion, but it would have the important things right.  I wonder what prices for a 'short time' would be like in an economy like that...
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Middle-aged Europe
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« Reply #14 on: April 23, 2005, 11:55:17 AM »
« Edited: April 23, 2005, 12:00:02 PM by Old Europe »

Lower Midlands


Explanation: Elazabastanīs repressive nature seems to originate from a rather conservative view of Islam, which is held by the majority of the population. In the Lower Midlands however, the communst system is not more than a type of government. The type of government of a country is much easier to change than its culture.

In the Lower Midlands a revolution could turn the country into a democracy within a few weeks, while Elazabastan will need at least a whole generation (20 to 30 years?) of slow societal modernization to show significant improvement. You can easily change the governmental structure, but not the people.
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DanielX
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« Reply #15 on: April 23, 2005, 02:24:36 PM »

NOTA.
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Emsworth
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« Reply #16 on: April 23, 2005, 02:30:09 PM »

Elezabastan - a semi-democratic predominantely Muslim country. Despite being semi-democratic, Islam makes it a very conservative and repressive society
...
The People's Republic of the Lower Midlands ... While most of the economy is government run however, it still tolerates the sex industry.
As far as I can see, the only difference is that in the former, you get stoned if you commit adultery, whereas in the latter, you commit adultery when you get stoned :-)
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Joe Republic
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« Reply #17 on: April 23, 2005, 08:56:23 PM »

This poll seems like just another communism vs. Islam thread, but with different wording and a scenario thrown in.
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Bandit3 the Worker
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« Reply #18 on: April 23, 2005, 09:08:22 PM »

in fact one of the top heads of the secret police that squash political dissent is a women.

Another fetish?

WalterMitty would probably enjoy it if there was bubble gum involved.
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Bandit3 the Worker
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« Reply #19 on: April 23, 2005, 09:10:27 PM »

I vote for the People's Republic.

Even though the other option is described as "semi-democratic", democracy isn't a good thing when it ends up in the hands of fanatics.
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Citizen James
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« Reply #20 on: April 24, 2005, 01:25:43 AM »

Ok, well, I'd probably pick the first one then - since they don't have a secret police(they probably rely more on fanatical mobs to enforce things). Also I like to eat, and communism typically doesn't do well at providing food. I'll assume the first has a more free market, so it will keep my belly at least somewhat satisfied. Can't plan a rebellion on an empty stomach, you know.

My rebellion might involve creating a new religion - get myself, or probably someone who shares most of my views who is a better actor, to be a 'prophet' and start a less oppressive religion that could easily catch on, perhaps just a revised Islam to make it easier for others to accept. Even if it's underground, it can still grow until it doesn't have to be. If killed, the prophet becomes a martyr and it'll probably spread like wildfire.

Ah, the holy Dibble empire.  That sounds better than either of the others.   Yes, the secondhand smoke may get annoying, but at least the fascists are exiled.
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they don't love you like i love you
BRTD
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« Reply #21 on: May 09, 2005, 10:51:57 AM »

This was an interesting poll. I wonder what the Islam apologists will vote for now.
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Lunar
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« Reply #22 on: May 10, 2005, 06:40:25 PM »

This was an interesting poll. I wonder what the Islam apologists will vote for now.

You notice most people voted based on what government was easier to overthrow?

These polls don't justify your beliefs, heh.
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they don't love you like i love you
BRTD
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« Reply #23 on: May 10, 2005, 09:46:41 PM »

so, how did you vote?
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Jake
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« Reply #24 on: May 10, 2005, 09:51:52 PM »

Elezabastan, easy
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