manning to get access to hormone replacement therapy
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Author Topic: manning to get access to hormone replacement therapy  (Read 5224 times)
Antonio the Sixth
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« Reply #25 on: February 16, 2015, 08:49:52 AM »

Languages have basic rules. You can't pick and choose which ones apply to you. Proper writing/speaking is the basis of all civilized discourse.
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SUSAN CRUSHBONE
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« Reply #26 on: February 16, 2015, 09:22:42 AM »

Languages have basic rules. You can't pick and choose which ones apply to you. Proper writing/speaking is the basis of all civilized discourse.

yes, you can, when you're speaking in an informal context. writing without capital letters is widely enough used in informal contexts that throwing a fit about it just makes you look spiteful.

it should be noted, also, that the current strictness of capitalisation rules is very much a historical aberration.
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Sol
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« Reply #27 on: February 16, 2015, 11:20:59 AM »

Languages have basic rules. You can't pick and choose which ones apply to you. Proper writing/speaking is the basis of all civilized discourse.

Yes, but what is allowed in communication in any language is almost always more extensive than what prescriptivists will say.

For example, imagine say a native English speaker says:

"Yinz done did what yinz been told?[1]"

Even if you weren't very familiar with the use of yinz (although it's easier to understand in speech, given that it'll sound a bit like you+ones), you'd be able to comprehend the general sentiment, especially if you were even a little bit familiar with Pittsburghese or other Appalachian dialects.

This is at the core of language comprehension and usage; we are capable of understanding enormous linguistic variation within our own language. This cognitive ability has been taken advantage of by speakers of all languages, since at least the dawn of recorded history[2].

But there is such a thing as a sentence which would be wrong in English. I hesitate to include an example here, mostly because I frankly don't know much about non-North American English dialects, but I doubt that a sentence like "We are bites pizza and we have swallows the it" or something of the sort would be grammatical in any English dialect spoken by a native speaker. So yes, language has rules, but those rules are a lot more inclusive then one would expect based on the pronouncements of grammarians, and that goes for any language.

And language is a fundamentally oral business; the written form is a mere substitute for those funny noises you make on a everyday basis. There is no such thing as a capital letter when you talk. That's not to say that Evergreen shouldn't use capital letters, rather it is to say that you could understand them quite fine, given that the gap in understanding non-capital written English is much less than between GA, and say, AAVE [3] or Estuary English. And do we really want to exclude speakers of other dialects from our civilized discourse?


[1]This is actually a sentence I have heard someone say, for reference. The use of yinz as a 2nd person plural is mostly a Pittsburgh thing, but it has some peripheral presence in the rural Appalachians, including Western North Carolina, although it is being replaced by y'all. I remember this particular sentence in retrospect because the kid who produced it regularly used yinz, but was teased mercilessly for it and stopped using it by the end of the school year.
[2] Look up the history of the English word "like" for some fun variation; in Shakespeare's day it meant both "to like" and "to be pleasing to."
[3] Sometimes it seems like 50% of complaints about incorrect usage is people being racist about AAVE.
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Brittain33
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« Reply #28 on: February 16, 2015, 11:40:11 AM »

A traitor gets this cosmetic surgery courtesy of the taxpayer. We are one screwed up place.  Why do WE have to pay for it?

Not sure that Internet parody accounts pay taxes...
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Filuwaúrdjan
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« Reply #29 on: February 16, 2015, 11:43:03 AM »

Essentially it's total nonsense to suggest that there is a 'pure' form of any given language and that any and all dialects are perversions and distortions of it. In reality the 'pure' form of the language in question is itself a dialect.
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Antonio the Sixth
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« Reply #30 on: February 16, 2015, 11:52:52 AM »
« Edited: February 16, 2015, 11:54:30 AM by Antonio V »

Essentially it's total nonsense to suggest that there is a 'pure' form of any given language and that any and all dialects are perversions and distortions of it. In reality the 'pure' form of the language in question is itself a dialect.

That's obviously not what I was saying.

The point is that if you don't even bother hitting the shift key when writing a post on an internet forum, you're not being "creative" and inventing a new dialect or slang. You're just a lazy f**k.
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Sol
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« Reply #31 on: February 16, 2015, 11:59:13 AM »

Essentially it's total nonsense to suggest that there is a 'pure' form of any given language and that any and all dialects are perversions and distortions of it. In reality the 'pure' form of the language in question is itself a dialect.

That's obviously not what I was saying.

The point is that if you don't even bother hitting the shift key when writing a post on an internet forum, you're not being "creative" and inventing a new dialect or slang. You're just a lazy f**k.

Are Hebrew script writers lazy to not have capital letters at all?

Capital letters are not necessary. That is not to say that they shouldn't be used, but it doesn't damage communication in any real way to drop them.
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Badger
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« Reply #32 on: February 16, 2015, 12:12:43 PM »

And over half this thread has now degenerated into an argument over grammer and capitalization. Well done Forum, well done.
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Antonio the Sixth
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« Reply #33 on: February 16, 2015, 12:14:58 PM »

Essentially it's total nonsense to suggest that there is a 'pure' form of any given language and that any and all dialects are perversions and distortions of it. In reality the 'pure' form of the language in question is itself a dialect.

That's obviously not what I was saying.

The point is that if you don't even bother hitting the shift key when writing a post on an internet forum, you're not being "creative" and inventing a new dialect or slang. You're just a lazy f**k.

Are Hebrew script writers lazy to not have capital letters at all?

Capital letters are not necessary. That is not to say that they shouldn't be used, but it doesn't damage communication in any real way to drop them.

Your previous post was interesting, but now you're just being clever by half. In most everyday occurrences people are expected to follow the regular rules that are codified in the language they're speaking. If "a person" was writing poetry, it would have been a different issue altogether. If you just want to communicate your thoughts, do it the way you were taught at school.
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Sol
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« Reply #34 on: February 16, 2015, 12:21:15 PM »

But there's also a register issue there, Antonio.

A good buddy of mine and I regularly communicate largely by text message since he lives in Boston. When we first started texting, I wrote I do here--capitals, periods, all of that. That actually put him off a little bit--I was coming off as overly stuffy and informal. Now when we message, I never use periods or capitalize.

There's nothing wrong with using a more informal register in a more informal context. Sometimes it's even the proper thing to do.
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Grumpier Than Uncle Joe
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« Reply #35 on: February 16, 2015, 12:31:02 PM »

Was Manning undergoing treatment prior to incarceration?
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Antonio the Sixth
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« Reply #36 on: February 16, 2015, 12:32:29 PM »

But there's also a register issue there, Antonio.

A good buddy of mine and I regularly communicate largely by text message since he lives in Boston. When we first started texting, I wrote I do here--capitals, periods, all of that. That actually put him off a little bit--I was coming off as overly stuffy and informal. Now when we message, I never use periods or capitalize.

There's nothing wrong with using a more informal register in a more informal context. Sometimes it's even the proper thing to do.

If the register of the conversation is defined by the rules adopted by the majority of its participants (and how else would you define it?), then the register of this forum includes capitalizing sentences.
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Zioneer
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« Reply #37 on: February 17, 2015, 01:29:21 AM »

I like how a echo chamber of "TRAITOR!!1!" has turned into a heated debate on grammar.
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ingemann
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« Reply #38 on: February 17, 2015, 03:13:46 PM »

As for Manning who care one way or another. I'm not happy aboout what USA have done, did and do, but that doesn't make him less of a traitor.

As for the language issue, I'm disappointed in Antonio V, he may be in a position where he doesn't need too train his english, but for many of us other non-English speakers, these forums serve as a way to train our skills in the English language, and the expertation that you need to be perfect write English perfectly, to write on a English board, are just a way to reduce the user to a small privileged elite in the very real meaning of the word.
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H.E. VOLODYMYR ZELENKSYY
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« Reply #39 on: February 17, 2015, 03:14:30 PM »

As for Manning who care one way or another. I'm not happy aboout what USA have done, did and do, but that doesn't make him her less of a traitor.

Fixed.
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ingemann
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« Reply #40 on: February 17, 2015, 03:19:08 PM »

As for Manning who care one way or another. I'm not happy aboout what USA have done, did and do, but that doesn't make him her less of a traitor.

Fixed.

Fine, I don't care one way or another.
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SteveRogers
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« Reply #41 on: February 17, 2015, 03:45:47 PM »

As for Manning who care one way or another. I'm not happy aboout what USA have done, did and do, but that doesn't make him less of a traitor.

As for the language issue, I'm disappointed in Antonio V, he may be in a position where he doesn't need too train his english, but for many of us other non-English speakers, these forums serve as a way to train our skills in the English language, and the expertation that you need to be perfect write English perfectly, to write on a English board, are just a way to reduce the user to a small privileged elite in the very real meaning of the word.

Did you place that landmine in there on purpose?
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ingemann
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« Reply #42 on: February 17, 2015, 04:19:17 PM »

As for Manning who care one way or another. I'm not happy aboout what USA have done, did and do, but that doesn't make him less of a traitor.

As for the language issue, I'm disappointed in Antonio V, he may be in a position where he doesn't need too train his english, but for many of us other non-English speakers, these forums serve as a way to train our skills in the English language, and the expertation that you need to be perfect write English perfectly, to write on a English board, are just a way to reduce the user to a small privileged elite in the very real meaning of the word.

Did you place that landmine in there on purpose?

him/her? not really, through I can't say I care much about the gender of Manning, it's really rather irrelevant, it have nothing to do with why she's in prison, and if I was trans, I wouldn't really use her as representant of transsexuality and become angry every time someone mispronounce her gender (in fact I would be happy, because I would hope they didn't connect transsexuality with a traitor).
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Antonio the Sixth
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« Reply #43 on: February 17, 2015, 04:31:24 PM »

As for the language issue, I'm disappointed in Antonio V, he may be in a position where he doesn't need too train his english, but for many of us other non-English speakers, these forums serve as a way to train our skills in the English language, and the expertation that you need to be perfect write English perfectly, to write on a English board, are just a way to reduce the user to a small privileged elite in the very real meaning of the word.

What the hell does this have to do with anything?

A Person has a good command of English. I've never seen him make any of the mistakes you see from non-native English speakers. The point is that he knows perfectly what the rules are, he's just to f**king lazy to apply them. And besides, capitalization isn't even a specificity of the English language. German (which I assume would be his native language) also capitalizes sentences. So there is absolutely no excuses you can make for him.

I have no problem if someone makes mistakes because they are new. Hell, go dig into my early posts and see what a horrible mess they were. I basically learned English on this forum! But since I did, I make an effort to follow its rules to the best of my knowledge and ability. I owe that to my interlocutors.
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SUSAN CRUSHBONE
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« Reply #44 on: February 17, 2015, 05:00:21 PM »
« Edited: February 17, 2015, 05:53:33 PM by ⑪ (evergreen) »

As for the language issue, I'm disappointed in Antonio V, he may be in a position where he doesn't need too train his english, but for many of us other non-English speakers, these forums serve as a way to train our skills in the English language, and the expertation that you need to be perfect write English perfectly, to write on a English board, are just a way to reduce the user to a small privileged elite in the very real meaning of the word.

What the hell does this have to do with anything?

A Person has a good command of English. I've never seen her make any of the mistakes you see from non-native English speakers. The point is that she knows perfectly what the rules are, she's just to f**king lazy to apply them. And besides, capitalization isn't even a specificity of the English language. German (which I assume would be her native language) also capitalizes sentences. So there is absolutely no excuses you can make for her.

I have no problem if someone makes mistakes because they are new. Hell, go dig into my early posts and see what a horrible mess they were. I basically learned English on this forum! But since I did, I make an effort to follow its rules to the best of my knowledge and ability. I owe that to my interlocutors.

she's just to f**king lazy to apply them.

gosh
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Antonio the Sixth
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« Reply #45 on: February 17, 2015, 06:17:45 PM »

Typo mistakes happen. I don't see how that invalidates my point in any way.
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SUSAN CRUSHBONE
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« Reply #46 on: February 18, 2015, 01:33:15 AM »

Typo mistakes happen. I don't see how that invalidates my point in any way.

i wasn't using it to refute your point (there's nothing to refute) but people going on a righteous crusade about grammar while themselves making elementary grammatical mistakes themselves will never not be funny.
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World politics is up Schmitt creek
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« Reply #47 on: February 18, 2015, 02:26:19 AM »

As for Manning who care one way or another. I'm not happy aboout what USA have done, did and do, but that doesn't make him less of a traitor.

As for the language issue, I'm disappointed in Antonio V, he may be in a position where he doesn't need too train his english, but for many of us other non-English speakers, these forums serve as a way to train our skills in the English language, and the expertation that you need to be perfect write English perfectly, to write on a English board, are just a way to reduce the user to a small privileged elite in the very real meaning of the word.

Did you place that landmine in there on purpose?

him/her? not really, through I can't say I care much about the gender of Manning, it's really rather irrelevant, it have nothing to do with why she's in prison, and if I was trans, I wouldn't really use her as representant of transsexuality and become angry every time someone mispronounce her gender (in fact I would be happy, because I would hope they didn't connect transsexuality with a traitor).

What the [Inks] is wrong with you?
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SUSAN CRUSHBONE
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« Reply #48 on: February 18, 2015, 02:57:53 AM »

As for Manning who care one way or another. I'm not happy aboout what USA have done, did and do, but that doesn't make him less of a traitor.

As for the language issue, I'm disappointed in Antonio V, he may be in a position where he doesn't need too train his english, but for many of us other non-English speakers, these forums serve as a way to train our skills in the English language, and the expertation that you need to be perfect write English perfectly, to write on a English board, are just a way to reduce the user to a small privileged elite in the very real meaning of the word.

Did you place that landmine in there on purpose?

him/her? not really, through I can't say I care much about the gender of Manning, it's really rather irrelevant, it have nothing to do with why she's in prison, and if I was trans, I wouldn't really use her as representant of transsexuality and become angry every time someone mispronounce her gender (in fact I would be happy, because I would hope they didn't connect transsexuality with a traitor).

What the [Inks] is wrong with you?

"hey if you do something wrong we're kicking you out of the demographic"
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Antonio the Sixth
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« Reply #49 on: February 18, 2015, 07:05:59 AM »

Typo mistakes happen. I don't see how that invalidates my point in any way.

i wasn't using it to refute your point (there's nothing to refute) but people going on a righteous crusade about grammar while themselves making elementary grammatical mistakes themselves will never not be funny.

There is a point, you just seem to be unable (or unwilling) to address it.

And capitalization isn't even grammar. It's syntax.
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