Workers get the shaft in Wisconsin (user search)
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  Workers get the shaft in Wisconsin (search mode)
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Author Topic: Workers get the shaft in Wisconsin  (Read 1910 times)
Beet
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« on: February 26, 2015, 02:29:49 PM »

It sounds like people are jealous that union workers make more and get plum benefits, but instead of that inspiring them to see the benefits of unionization for workers and imagine that they, too, might be able to get better working conditions, their answer is to tear down the union worker. Sad.
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Beet
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« Reply #1 on: February 26, 2015, 05:07:50 PM »

It's Right to Work laws that tie the hands of companies. They prohibit companies from entering into agreements they might otherwise enter into.

Unions have nothing to do with assemblies of speech. The purpose of a union is to equalize the bargaining power of employees with that of employers. You or I or anyone is free to, for example, apply for a job at Microsoft, but we would be one individual negotiating for his sole income against a multi-billion dollar corporation, a negotiating disadvantage. If all the employees of Microsoft could organize, just as Microsoft itself is organized, then it would be two equally balanced entities negotiating a single contract, rather than thousands of very unequal entities negotiating thousands of contracts. What "organization" means is a way to overcome the collective action problem. This is inseparable from enforcing that all employees must be members of the union. In other words, this is the whole point of the union.

If you want a Right to Work law, I want a Right to Donate law. The website Kickstarter is in gross violation of the Right to Donate. They allow people to set up projects that I can only donate to, if I pay Kickstarter a fee and so do all the other donors. I can only donate to these projects through Kickstarter - essentially by signing an enforced agreement with Kickstarter. That should be optional. We're just a group of people who want to peaceably assemble and give away money. Why can't we do that? Kickstarter should be illegal.
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Beet
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« Reply #2 on: February 26, 2015, 05:25:15 PM »

Kickstarter should not be illegal - you are using something as an example that has little relevance but adds to my point. If one wants to donate, why not donate directly and bypass middlemen that take part of your money? Would it not be better to donate 100% of the funds to the charity as opposed to say 80 or 90% minus overhead?

Okay, so why does anyone donate to Kickstarter?

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How would one do collective bargaining without 'coercive tactics'?

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Who said anything about governments enforcing or promoting anything? What Microsoft does should be up to Microsoft. They should be allowed to run their hiring policies how they want with regard to collective bargaining. That's my position.
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Beet
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« Reply #3 on: February 26, 2015, 05:52:53 PM »

They see it as an easier alternative but it still is a middleman

Why do they see it as an easier alternative?

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Why do you need a union to do that? I can think of fair arguments and develop business acumen myself.

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What does collective bargaining have to do with my race? I don't care about the race of my coworkers. I can collectively bargain together equally with blacks, whites, or hispanics.
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Beet
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« Reply #4 on: February 26, 2015, 06:04:07 PM »

This has been an interesting discussion but it's time to say you don't know what you're talking about, and my clumsy attempts to lead you in the right direction aren't being met by very much success... it shouldn't be too hard for you to figure out where I was going with my questions, if you do a little reading... But that's all for now.
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