The Madeleine & Anvi Gallery of Excellent Effortposts

[Mr. Smith]

I don't know who the people in this title are.  Does Anvi have a indy IL avatar?

Seen anvi a few times but I can't vouch for him, but you might know Madeleine better as his former name of Nathan.

No matter what side of the fence you sit, it's impossible to deny that Maddy tends to have very well executed arguments and not only that, but she does posts very sincerely with diddly-squat for sarcasm. She tends to be very respectful of other viewpoints as well when she feels need to rebut.

There truly is not a better honor title than hers for a thread of this intention (It's a different story if this actually manages to hold.)

No way, no how.

[Mr. Smith]

Very good poster certainly, although I don't completely agree with some of his interpretations of history and sometimes his "New England Irishphobic Puritan Republican Federalists" type posts get a bit repetitive.

Granted.

I do admit on the subject I do have a bit of a chip my shoulder.  This might not seem the way to others but all too often I feel like a lot of people act like the only reason our ancestors were strongly Democratic was because they hated blacks (see blatant example here: https://uselectionatlas.org/FORUM/index.php?topic=204846.msg4444968#msg4444968 which as far as I am concerned is barely masked bigotry under the guise and excuse of historical facts ) and not because they lived in areas populated by people who literally viewed them as vermin (and further, as has been noted by me several times earlier, the Irish were voting heavily Democratic (and extra emphasis on the word "heavily") since the times of Jefferson, it was not some thing that happened because of the Civil War draft).  It is almost as if the several hundred years of anti-Celtic prejudice, both in the Great Britain and in the largely Anglo and protestant parts of the colonies, suddenly vanished overnight when America became a country.  Given how often the former is stressed by ill educated people I find it necessary to bring this up whenever it is applicable.

The point is largely that the point of history is to learn from it, not to defend it.  The guys who "freed the slaves" were no saints just like many of the anti-Chinese Irish railroad workers in the west were no saints.  I guess I just feel that when actually examining the past and considering the issues many perceive New England Federalists, Whigs, and Republicans to somehow be faultless and good moral people just because they opposed slavery (so did the British Empire. . . . . ).  They tend to leave out things like the repeatedly mentioned anti-Irish bigotry, the anti-Jewish bigotry (of which even I don't cover as much as I should), the anti-Italian bigotry, the anti-Polish bigotry, hell most anti-ethnic white bigotry, the classism, support for what basically amounted to protestant supremacy in the form of moralistic legislation, the support for regressive tax and tariff policies with the main intent to fatten the pocketbooks of robber barons, as well as the indifference and cruelty of the Protestant Work Ethic ^TM to actually address issues like wage slavery and living conditions in the poor neighborhoods of urban areas.

The goal of modern liberalism should be to learn from those past mistakes and use those lessons to advance a more egalitarian and equal society.  We should no longer have to choose between racists and elitists.  We should no longer have to choose between moralists and corrupt urban bosses.  We should no longer have to choose between slavers and bankers.  The people of the past need no defense, they were extremely flawed people.  Which is why you often hear such clichés as "judge them in the context of their times!" even by far left people like myself (though I generally believe that the more accurate saying would be "judge them in the context of where you would be in the times").  People often act like when talking about the past one side has to be completely right.  Well, especially in the case of American History, this is wrong.  Winning the Civil War didn't prevent the GOP from being blamed for the Great Depression.  Being on the side of the "common man" didn't prevent the Democrats from being on the wrong side of the Civil War.  And etcetera etcetera.

And further, the lesson from the bigotry of the New England elites, which is largely whitewashed to protect the agenda of financial elitists and others, is that racism goes far beyond skin color and is more about the dominance and privilege of elite groups (this is also very true of the Southern planters and their slaves).  In other words, knowledge of such history is knowledge of exactly why elitism (which is openly embraced by many Democrats nowadays without any knowledge or care of the roots of cultural elitism in the country) is horrible and the party needs to embrace more economic populism (note, I mean that as in being advocates of the poor, not "muh fiscally liberal and socially conservative") to advance a liberal agenda.

I make no apologies, just like a Jew makes no apologies for bashing Hitler.

Hasn't been a better post explaining the fault of how history often tends to be looked at here, which generally does tend to be given some good 'ol narrative painting which all of us are a little guilty of [including Mecha himself].

[Mr. Smith]

I believe this qualifies for both the  Good Post thread, and this.

First and most importantly, things would not be better if you were dead.  That's not just my opinion, Clint, it's a fact.  Your family and many others would be devastated and the world would be a worse place without you in it.  Retromike is absolutely right that if the folks you mentioned were real friends, they'd have understood.  They might've joked around a bit about the "whipped" thing (and that's normal), but they wouldn't have done it in a harassing sort of way and certainly wouldn't have stopped being your friend because of it if they were ever real friends.  You'll start with a blank slate in college and meet plenty of new people, some of whom may very well end up becoming real and life-long friends.  Another thing to keep in mind is that some of the your former friends may get over whatever they're mad at you about (whether you'd be willing to forgive their behavior if this happens is another story and something only you can decide).  The end of high school has a way of healing grudges and old wounds.  Senior classes often come together as the end approaches and everyone wants to leave with good memories about each other in the last few months (at least, that was how it was at my high school).

As for the the girl, that's gonna hurt for awhile, there's no getting around that.  Ultimately, however, the best thing you can do is to try to move on.  It won't happen over night, but as someone who went through a pretty devastating situation of my own involving a girl whom I was in love with (and actually in a serious relationship with), I can promise you that time will gradually heal all wounds.  I'm not gonna get into the details of what I went through because this isn't about me, but I will say that I know from first hand experience that things will get better (even if the healing process is slow and this hurts like a son of a b!tch in the meantime).  

Right now, it may seem like there couldn't possibly be anyone else who can make you feel the way this girl did, but in time you'll find that there are other girls (and some may even be interested in having a serious relationship if you play your cards right).  Think of it this way: Realistically, there have to be a number of people out there for everyone, otherwise no one would ever have a happy relationship (let alone a happy marriage).  If there was just one "right" person for everyone, there'd be too many people for anyone to ever find the "right" person for them.  So statistically speaking, the idea that there is one "right" person for you or anyone else is simply not grounded in reality.

From what you described, it sounds like what may've happened in this situation was that the girl wasn't ever interested in being anything more than friends (if so, the use of terms like "us" certainly wouldn't have helped matters) and that when she said stuff like "I don't know" or "I haven't thought about it," she was trying to tell you that without hurting your feelings.  Many girls genuinely think they're softening the blow by saying stuff like "I don't know," "I haven't really thought about it," or "let's just be friends."  Ironically, that can sometimes send mixed signals and actually make it a more drawn out, uncomfortable, and painful process for everyone involved (whether inadvertently giving the impression that they really do want to still be friends or by causing someone to essentially have a "so you're saying there's a chance?" type reaction).  I obviously wasn't there, so I don't know, but from what you described, it sounds like that may've been what happened.  In other words, you may well have simply misunderstood the signals she was trying to give you causing her to get increasingly irritated with you.  

Incidentally, I should note that it is never a good idea to try to start a relationship with a girl if she already has a boyfriend (for a wide variety of reasons, some pertaining to moral issues and others to practical considerations).  It's something that probably won't end well for whoever does it and will almost inevitably leave at least one person (and quite possibly everyone involved) feeling serious emotional pain.

I know you may not want to hear this, but he truth is that the best thing you can do is to give her space and begin the slow process of moving on both intellectually and emotionally.  I'm not saying that she'll want to be with you if you do that, but it'll both allow the healing process to begin and reduce the chances of her feeling like you're harassing her and refusing to accept that her answer is no.  At the end of the day, the best thing you can do (for a variety of reasons) is to slowly stand back up, dust yourself off, climb back in the arena, and focus trying to move on at both an intellectual and emotional level.  

For better or worse, life has ups, downs, and everything in between.  No one gets through for free, we all have our struggles, challenges, and demons.  Things may feel pretty bleak today and maybe even tomorrow, but I promise that sooner or later the sun will come up again.

One other thing: Cathcon is absolutely right that you should ignore Deus' terrible advice!

Given how detailed, how empathetic it is, and generally well-meant, it's near impossible to deny a lot of effort was put in to it.