FL-SEN: Is Rubio about to bungle it?
       |           

Welcome, Guest. Please login or register.
Did you miss your activation email?
March 29, 2024, 08:24:10 AM
News: Election Simulator 2.0 Released. Senate/Gubernatorial maps, proportional electoral votes, and more - Read more

  Talk Elections
  Other Elections - Analysis and Discussion
  Congressional Elections (Moderators: Brittain33, GeorgiaModerate, Gass3268, Virginiá, Gracile)
  FL-SEN: Is Rubio about to bungle it?
« previous next »
Pages: 1 ... 4 5 6 7 8 [9] 10 11 12 13 14 ... 43
Author Topic: FL-SEN: Is Rubio about to bungle it?  (Read 103536 times)
The Other Castro
Castro2020
Atlas Icon
*****
Posts: 11,230
United States


Show only this user's posts in this thread
« Reply #200 on: May 07, 2015, 05:52:21 PM »

Quote
You must be logged in to read this quote.

Amen! Amen. The DSCC should learn from the Debbie Wasserman Schultz. We want a primary, not a coronation.

I also assumed that you wanted to win. I guess not.
Logged
Attorney General, LGC Speaker, and Former PPT Dwarven Dragon
Dwarven Dragon
Atlas Politician
Atlas Superstar
*****
Posts: 31,580
United States


Political Matrix
E: -1.42, S: -0.52

P P P

Show only this user's posts in this thread
« Reply #201 on: May 07, 2015, 06:04:28 PM »

Quote
You must be logged in to read this quote.

Amen! Amen. The DSCC should learn from the Debbie Wasserman Schultz. We want a primary, not a coronation.

I also assumed that you wanted to win. I guess not.
Nothing wrong with a primary, it's good preparation for the GE. As long as Murphy wins the primary, I don't  really care about Grayson being in the race.
Logged
Flake
Flo
Junior Chimp
*****
Posts: 8,688
United States


Show only this user's posts in this thread
« Reply #202 on: May 07, 2015, 07:26:58 PM »

Fun fact: the Republican Senate candidate in Florida has never gotten more than 50% of the vote since 1994.
Logged
LeBron
LeBron FitzGerald
Sr. Member
****
Posts: 2,906
United States


Show only this user's posts in this thread
« Reply #203 on: May 07, 2015, 07:52:24 PM »

Quote
You must be logged in to read this quote.

Amen! Amen. The DSCC should learn from the Debbie Wasserman Schultz. We want a primary, not a coronation.

I also assumed that you wanted to win. I guess not.
Nothing wrong with a primary, it's good preparation for the GE. As long as Murphy wins the primary, I don't  really care about Grayson being in the race.
That's the problem though. The FDP (apparently) is backing Grayson which opens the possibility he sinks Murphy in cash (or worse) he pulls an upset on him in the primary. Everything is being setting in place for Murphy to pickup this seat for Democrats next year in Florida. It would be stupid to blow it.
Logged
Maxwell
mah519
Atlas Star
*****
Posts: 28,459
Germany


Political Matrix
E: -6.45, S: -6.96

Show only this user's posts in this thread
« Reply #204 on: May 07, 2015, 07:56:01 PM »

Fun fact: the Republican Senate candidate in Florida has never gotten more than 50% of the vote since 1994.

That's just because silly Charlie Crist decided to run third party. Marco Rubio would've been closing in on 60% otherwise.
Logged
Beet
Atlas Star
*****
Posts: 28,806


Show only this user's posts in this thread
« Reply #205 on: May 07, 2015, 07:56:41 PM »

Quote
You must be logged in to read this quote.

Amen! Amen. The DSCC should learn from the Debbie Wasserman Schultz. We want a primary, not a coronation.

I also assumed that you wanted to win. I guess not.

Electing a Republican isn't victory.
Logged
Flake
Flo
Junior Chimp
*****
Posts: 8,688
United States


Show only this user's posts in this thread
« Reply #206 on: May 07, 2015, 08:25:07 PM »

Quote
You must be logged in to read this quote.

Amen! Amen. The DSCC should learn from the Debbie Wasserman Schultz. We want a primary, not a coronation.

I also assumed that you wanted to win. I guess not.

Electing a Republican isn't victory.

Choosing Grayson would be the Democrats accepting Senator DeSantis with open arms.
Logged
Maxwell
mah519
Atlas Star
*****
Posts: 28,459
Germany


Political Matrix
E: -6.45, S: -6.96

Show only this user's posts in this thread
« Reply #207 on: May 07, 2015, 08:34:15 PM »

Beet is someone who takes half a loaf unless the rest of Atlas is willing to take half a loaf, then he just wants to piss on the half a loaf.
Logged
Beet
Atlas Star
*****
Posts: 28,806


Show only this user's posts in this thread
« Reply #208 on: May 07, 2015, 08:40:55 PM »

Murphy is further to the right than any Dem I've ever supported. I'd support someone like Murphy in a red state like Georgia or Mississippi, but Florida can do better.
Logged
Dereich
Moderators
YaBB God
*****
Posts: 4,893


Show only this user's posts in this thread
« Reply #209 on: May 07, 2015, 08:43:38 PM »

Murphy is further to the right than any Dem I've ever supported. I'd support someone like Murphy in a red state like Georgia or Mississippi, but Florida can do better.

That is exactly the same frame of mind that the FDP has had since the 90s.
Logged
Beet
Atlas Star
*****
Posts: 28,806


Show only this user's posts in this thread
« Reply #210 on: May 07, 2015, 08:44:44 PM »

Murphy is further to the right than any Dem I've ever supported. I'd support someone like Murphy in a red state like Georgia or Mississippi, but Florida can do better.

That is exactly the same frame of mind that the FDP has had since the 90s.

... And they're right. The FDP has made a lot of tactical screw ups, but nominating Murphy would just be another in a long line of them, not a break from pattern.
Logged
Maxwell
mah519
Atlas Star
*****
Posts: 28,459
Germany


Political Matrix
E: -6.45, S: -6.96

Show only this user's posts in this thread
« Reply #211 on: May 07, 2015, 08:47:45 PM »

Murphy is further to the right than any Dem I've ever supported. I'd support someone like Murphy in a red state like Georgia or Mississippi, but Florida can do better.

To me, Murphy doesn't sound like someone with a coherent ideology. He seems like someone who would be puddy in the hands of Democratic Leadership.
Logged
Beet
Atlas Star
*****
Posts: 28,806


Show only this user's posts in this thread
« Reply #212 on: May 07, 2015, 09:04:06 PM »

I don't understand why there seems to be such an overwhelming rush to push the Democrats to coronate a guy who votes with Republicans more than Democrats on crucial votes without even a primary, yet when it comes to the national election, the 11th most liberal Senator is somehow too centrist according to many people here. Florida and America aren't that different. In 2012, Obama did only 1.11% better in America than in Florida. I think I'm being the rational and consistent one here.
Logged
Donerail
Atlas Icon
*****
Posts: 15,345
Show only this user's posts in this thread
« Reply #213 on: May 07, 2015, 09:27:26 PM »

Quote
You must be logged in to read this quote.

Amen! Amen. The DSCC should learn from the Debbie Wasserman Schultz. We want a primary, not a coronation.

I also assumed that you wanted to win. I guess not.
Nothing wrong with a primary, it's good preparation for the GE. As long as Murphy wins the primary, I don't  really care about Grayson being in the race.
That's the problem though. The FDP (apparently) is backing Grayson which opens the possibility he sinks Murphy in cash (or worse) he pulls an upset on him in the primary. Everything is being setting in place for Murphy to pickup this seat for Democrats next year in Florida. It would be stupid to blow it.

This is not true. Most of the FDP (at least the parts that matter - Crist, Sink, a majority of state legislators) is backing Murphy. Grayson is independently wealthy, but he's unlikely to sink Murphy in cash - Murphy's not a bad fundraiser himself.
Logged
Attorney General, LGC Speaker, and Former PPT Dwarven Dragon
Dwarven Dragon
Atlas Politician
Atlas Superstar
*****
Posts: 31,580
United States


Political Matrix
E: -1.42, S: -0.52

P P P

Show only this user's posts in this thread
« Reply #214 on: May 07, 2015, 09:47:30 PM »

I don't understand why there seems to be such an overwhelming rush to push the Democrats to coronate a guy who votes with Republicans more than Democrats on crucial votes without even a primary, yet when it comes to the national election, the 11th most liberal Senator is somehow too centrist according to many people here. Florida and America aren't that different. In 2012, Obama did only 1.11% better in America than in Florida. I think I'm being the rational and consistent one here.
Did you even look at the results before making your assertion Huh

Florida 2012: Obama +0.9%
America 2012: Obama +3.9%

That's a three point difference, not a one point difference.
Logged
Zioneer
PioneerProgress
Junior Chimp
*****
Posts: 7,451
United States


Show only this user's posts in this thread
« Reply #215 on: May 07, 2015, 11:39:33 PM »

Quote
You must be logged in to read this quote.

Amen! Amen. The DSCC should learn from the Debbie Wasserman Schultz. We want a primary, not a coronation.

I also assumed that you wanted to win. I guess not.

Electing a Republican isn't victory.

A Republican beat Allen West? That's news to me.
Logged
henster
YaBB God
*****
Posts: 4,976


Show only this user's posts in this thread
« Reply #216 on: May 11, 2015, 01:13:03 AM »

I still hi I Kathy Castor would've been the stronges candidate here she doesn't have the blue dog issues Murphy has.
Logged
publicunofficial
angryGreatness
Junior Chimp
*****
Posts: 8,010
United States


Show only this user's posts in this thread
« Reply #217 on: May 11, 2015, 03:26:56 PM »

I don't think the Florida Democrats losing streak has anything to do with how liberal or conservative the candidates they run are. Bad campaigns are bad campaigns. And Grayson is much more likely to run a bad campaign than Murphy is.


There's a very annoying contingent of posters on Atlas: Hillary supporters who are constantly buttmad that people call her liberalism into question, and to counteract that they whine and moan any time a conservative Democrat is getting support.
Logged
IceSpear
Atlas Superstar
*****
Posts: 31,841
United States


Political Matrix
E: -6.19, S: -6.43

Show only this user's posts in this thread
« Reply #218 on: May 11, 2015, 03:42:56 PM »

There's a very annoying contingent of posters on Atlas: Hillary supporters who are constantly buttmad that people call her liberalism into question, and to counteract that they whine and moan any time a conservative Democrat is getting support.

I'm sorry pointing out hypocrisy annoys you. There's no logic whatsoever in bitching about Hillary being a "neoliberal right winger" or whatever then supporting Patrick Murphy who is objectively to her right on basically every issue. Florida is not that different from the country as a whole in terms of the D-R margin, so that excuse can't be used like it could be for someone like Manchin.

Granted, Clinton1996 made a good point in that Grayson would likely run a destructive scorched earth campaign whereas Hillary's opponents won't, but that would explain anti-Grayson views, not so much pro-Murphy views. Secondly, many of the Hillary haters would love it if a candidate ran an intensively negative campaign against her, so it's still an inconsistency.
Logged
Beet
Atlas Star
*****
Posts: 28,806


Show only this user's posts in this thread
« Reply #219 on: May 11, 2015, 04:12:34 PM »

There's no logic whatsoever in bitching about Hillary being a "neoliberal right winger" or whatever then supporting Patrick Murphy who is objectively to her right on basically every issue.

Precisely. Patrick Murphy is a far right winger who donated $2,300 to Romney in 2008. And remember that Romney ran to the right of McCain in that election.

Also let's not forget Murphy literally would not have a political career at all if he was not born into a filthy rich family. Even all of his sickening political positions aside, his entire career is the epitome of privilege.
Logged
Attorney General, LGC Speaker, and Former PPT Dwarven Dragon
Dwarven Dragon
Atlas Politician
Atlas Superstar
*****
Posts: 31,580
United States


Political Matrix
E: -1.42, S: -0.52

P P P

Show only this user's posts in this thread
« Reply #220 on: May 11, 2015, 04:15:02 PM »

There's no logic whatsoever in bitching about Hillary being a "neoliberal right winger" or whatever then supporting Patrick Murphy who is objectively to her right on basically every issue.

Precisely. Patrick Murphy is a far right winger who donated $2,300 to Romney in 2008. And remember that Romney ran to the right of McCain in that election.

Also let's not forget Murphy literally would not have a political career at all if he was not born into a filthy rich family. Even all of his sickening political positions aside, his entire career is the epitome of privilege.
So, you'd take CLC/DeSantis over Murphy? Grayson is not winning statewide, period.
Logged
Beet
Atlas Star
*****
Posts: 28,806


Show only this user's posts in this thread
« Reply #221 on: May 11, 2015, 04:17:00 PM »

There's no logic whatsoever in bitching about Hillary being a "neoliberal right winger" or whatever then supporting Patrick Murphy who is objectively to her right on basically every issue.

Precisely. Patrick Murphy is a far right winger who donated $2,300 to Romney in 2008. And remember that Romney ran to the right of McCain in that election.

Also let's not forget Murphy literally would not have a political career at all if he was not born into a filthy rich family. Even all of his sickening political positions aside, his entire career is the epitome of privilege.
So, you'd take CLC/DeSantis over Murphy? Grayson is not winning statewide, period.

I'm not supporting Murphy period. No that it matters.
Logged
publicunofficial
angryGreatness
Junior Chimp
*****
Posts: 8,010
United States


Show only this user's posts in this thread
« Reply #222 on: May 11, 2015, 04:18:42 PM »

There's a very annoying contingent of posters on Atlas: Hillary supporters who are constantly buttmad that people call her liberalism into question, and to counteract that they whine and moan any time a conservative Democrat is getting support.

I'm sorry pointing out hypocrisy annoys you. There's no logic whatsoever in bitching about Hillary being a "neoliberal right winger" or whatever then supporting Patrick Murphy who is objectively to her right on basically every issue. Florida is not that different from the country as a whole in terms of the D-R margin, so that excuse can't be used like it could be for someone like Manchin.

Granted, Clinton1996 made a good point in that Grayson would likely run a destructive scorched earth campaign whereas Hillary's opponents won't, but that would explain anti-Grayson views, not so much pro-Murphy views. Secondly, many of the Hillary haters would love it if a candidate ran an intensively negative campaign against her, so it's still an inconsistency.

For the record, I am a Hillary supporter who also supports Sanders run. I want to see Hillary challenged not because I dislike her or want someone else, but because the presidential primaries are very important events in which many issues get attention that wouldn't otherwise. There's a big difference between state primaries and national ones, I know you know that.

Also, equating Florida to the nation at large and saying they are just about equally liberal is misleading. Surely you recognize the difference being willing to vote for Barack Obama or Hillary Clinton, who while liberal are also restrained and pragmatic, and electing just any old Democrat.

And I cannot stress this enough: Alan Grayson will not lose because he's too liberal. Does everyone forget that he's involved in a messy divorce? That he called his opponent a member of the Taliban? If Alan Grayson were a Republican, I'd be salivating for him to get in the race. And at the same time, if Murphy were a Republican I'd be very scared of him.

I'm responding to you and not to Beet, because you seem more honest in your complaints whereas Beet is mostly a contrarian troll.
Logged
Beet
Atlas Star
*****
Posts: 28,806


Show only this user's posts in this thread
« Reply #223 on: May 11, 2015, 04:48:56 PM »

I'm not a contrarian, everyone else is a contrarian. Tongue

Seriously, I don't get why people think I'm a contrarian when I frequently agree with most people on all sorts of issues. It's the few cases when I disagree with the majority that are somehow deemed unacceptable. Plus, I always lay out my reasons in a rational manner.

It's undeniable that many Sanders supporters don't just support Sanders to broaden the debate, but they actually want him to win the nomination, even though he has virtually no chance in the General. In fact, I was chewed out by a Sanders supporter just last week, for suggesting that he was in the race for any other reason than winning.

In any case, no one has been saying that Alan Grayson is the best candidate in the world. But at least he has shown the ability to energize people. Nominating a uber-centrist after years of defeat isn't a recipe for revival, its a recipe for locking in a mentality of inferiority for even longer.
Logged
IceSpear
Atlas Superstar
*****
Posts: 31,841
United States


Political Matrix
E: -6.19, S: -6.43

Show only this user's posts in this thread
« Reply #224 on: May 11, 2015, 04:59:40 PM »

There's a very annoying contingent of posters on Atlas: Hillary supporters who are constantly buttmad that people call her liberalism into question, and to counteract that they whine and moan any time a conservative Democrat is getting support.

I'm sorry pointing out hypocrisy annoys you. There's no logic whatsoever in bitching about Hillary being a "neoliberal right winger" or whatever then supporting Patrick Murphy who is objectively to her right on basically every issue. Florida is not that different from the country as a whole in terms of the D-R margin, so that excuse can't be used like it could be for someone like Manchin.

Granted, Clinton1996 made a good point in that Grayson would likely run a destructive scorched earth campaign whereas Hillary's opponents won't, but that would explain anti-Grayson views, not so much pro-Murphy views. Secondly, many of the Hillary haters would love it if a candidate ran an intensively negative campaign against her, so it's still an inconsistency.

For the record, I am a Hillary supporter who also supports Sanders run. I want to see Hillary challenged not because I dislike her or want someone else, but because the presidential primaries are very important events in which many issues get attention that wouldn't otherwise. There's a big difference between state primaries and national ones, I know you know that.

Also, equating Florida to the nation at large and saying they are just about equally liberal is misleading. Surely you recognize the difference being willing to vote for Barack Obama or Hillary Clinton, who while liberal are also restrained and pragmatic, and electing just any old Democrat.

And I cannot stress this enough: Alan Grayson will not lose because he's too liberal. Does everyone forget that he's involved in a messy divorce? That he called his opponent a member of the Taliban? If Alan Grayson were a Republican, I'd be salivating for him to get in the race. And at the same time, if Murphy were a Republican I'd be very scared of him.

I'm responding to you and not to Beet, because you seem more honest in your complaints whereas Beet is mostly a contrarian troll.

Well then in that case, I'm not referring to you specifically.

As for your second point, I'm not really sure what you mean by that. Can you elaborate?

And yes, I agree Grayson is an awful candidate in many ways. For the record, I do support Murphy, simply because he seems most electable and I don't think Grayson/DWS could win statewide barring a miracle or a huge wave. I tend to agree with the guy who said Castor would be a decent statewide candidate without the blue dog baggage, but she's probably not running.
Logged
Pages: 1 ... 4 5 6 7 8 [9] 10 11 12 13 14 ... 43  
« previous next »
Jump to:  


Login with username, password and session length

Terms of Service - DMCA Agent and Policy - Privacy Policy and Cookies

Powered by SMF 1.1.21 | SMF © 2015, Simple Machines

Page created in 0.056 seconds with 12 queries.