US pressured Germany into not giving asylum to Snowden

[politicus]

According to Deputy Chancellor Sigmar Gabriel the US government threatened to stop sharing intelligence about - among other things - terror plots if Germany gave asylum to Edward Snowden:

“They told us they would stop notifying us of plots and other intelligence matters”

https://firstlook.org/theintercept/2015/03/19/us-threatened-germany-snowden-vice-chancellor-says/

[Antonio the Sixth]

Awful, but not surprising.

[Oakvale]

The Greek strategy!

[Franzl]

As is demonstrated so often, being an "ally" of the United States requires total obedience.

[Frodo]

As is demonstrated so often, being an "ally" of the United States requires total obedience.

Is that why Turkey is no longer an ally after denying us the use of its bases in preparation for the invasion of Iraq? 

[Cory]

It turns out foreign policy is real and cynical. News at 11.

Or Intro to Real Life 101.

[TJ in Oregon]

Obama should just pardon him and be done with it.

[Bacon King]

Obama should just pardon him and be done with it.

that's more of a "last day in office" sort of move

[dead0man]

As is demonstrated so often, being an "ally" of the United States requires total obedience.

Exactly, which is why all of our allies do exactly what we want 100% of the time

[Franzl]

As is demonstrated so often, being an "ally" of the United States requires total obedience.

Exactly, which is why all of our allies do exactly what we want 100% of the time

Yeah it's hyperbole, but is this the way to treat an "ally"? Is it worth letting potentially many die over a political disagreement?

[Velasco]

As is demonstrated so often, being an "ally" of the United States requires total obedience.

Is that why Turkey is no longer an ally after denying us the use of its bases in preparation for the invasion of Iraq? 

In the case of certain countries, geostrategic reasons weigh more than other considerations such as "cooperation" or "full obedience". Pakistan is a clear example of that.

[Adam Griffin]

Germany should've bombed Ramstein (and claimed it was a plot they couldn't tell them about prior).

[dead0man]

As is demonstrated so often, being an "ally" of the United States requires total obedience.

Exactly, which is why all of our allies do exactly what we want 100% of the time

Yeah it's hyperbole, but is this the way to treat an "ally"? Is it worth letting potentially many die over a political disagreement?

Exactly!  How serious was Germany about letting the traitor in?

[Franzl]

As is demonstrated so often, being an "ally" of the United States requires total obedience.

Exactly, which is why all of our allies do exactly what we want 100% of the time

Yeah it's hyperbole, but is this the way to treat an "ally"? Is it worth letting potentially many die over a political disagreement?

Exactly!  How serious was Germany about letting the traitor in?

Just for the record, you support the American way of going about this? That's fine if you do, but don't give me any bullsh**t about friendship and partnership if you do.

A matter of political asylum for someone who acted in the immediate German national interest while doing no harm except as to expose American violations of German law (which I understand you don't give a sh**t about) is not something anybody interested in friendship would use to withhold information on terrorist attacks.

[Stand With Israel. Crush Hamas]

This is why the idea of Obama pardoning Manning or Snowden is absurd. He HATES leakers who humiliate him.

Way too far, although I would say that harboring a damaging hacker from an ally is not something an ally would do either.

[dead0man]

Just for the record, you support the American way of going about this?

Perhaps they could have worded the threat differently/less harshly, but if Germany was serious about letting him.....well obviously that wouldn't have done our relationship any favors.

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One can argue that the entire act was overall good or bad, but it's silly to say "no harm" came from it.

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Agreed.  That crossed a line.  Probably a worse line that letting a traitor from a friendly country seek asylum in your country (which obviously crosses a line too).

[Beet]

I don't really get the butthurt over countries spying on one another when countries spy on each other all the time. Israel spies on the U.S. regularly and it's still an ally. The safe thing to assume is that everyone spies on everyone else.

[Antonio the Sixth]

muh traitor

[Middle-aged Europe]

I don't really get the butthurt over countries spying on one another when countries spy on each other all the time. Israel spies on the U.S. regularly and it's still an ally. The safe thing to assume is that everyone spies on everyone else.

Well, as a German citizen I can say that I don't really care whether the American government is spying on the German government.

It's more of an issue of the American government potentially spying (or collecting data) on me.

[Simfan34]

Obama should just pardon him and be done with it.

that's more of a "last day in office" sort of move

Then I pray to God someone shoots Snowden, the hypocrite. That would be an utterly awful thing for Obama to do.

[Stand With Israel. Crush Hamas]

Obama should just pardon him and be done with it.

that's more of a "last day in office" sort of move

Then I pray to God someone shoots Snowden, the hypocrite. That would be an utterly awful thing for Obama to do.

He won't. Obama has never shown an iota of leniency to leakers.

There's this impression on line that Obama is a true leftist. He's not. He's a fairly standard left-wing Democrat with an authoritarian streak.

[Sumner 1868]

Obama should just pardon him and be done with it.

that's more of a "last day in office" sort of move

Then I pray to God someone shoots Snowden, the hypocrite. That would be an utterly awful thing for Obama to do.

I really don't understand the right's hatred for Snowden.

[Atlas Has Shrugged]

Obama should just pardon him and be done with it.

that's more of a "last day in office" sort of move

Then I pray to God someone shoots Snowden, the hypocrite. That would be an utterly awful thing for Obama to do.

I really don't understand the right's hatred for Snowden.

I don't understand the lefts hatred of him for that matter. It all has to do with "muh security" or "muh Obama" depending on the poster.

[Beet]

I don't really get the butthurt over countries spying on one another when countries spy on each other all the time. Israel spies on the U.S. regularly and it's still an ally. The safe thing to assume is that everyone spies on everyone else.

Well, as a German citizen I can say that I don't really care whether the American government is spying on the German government.

It's more of an issue of the American government potentially spying (or collecting data) on me.

Fair enough.

Of course, there is a school of thought that says actions against governments are more serious than actions against private individuals. If someone were to steal my property, that would be a crime. But if someone were to steal the government's property, that would be an even bigger crime. If someone were to murder me, that would be a terrible crime, but if someone were to murder a government official carrying out his duties, that would be an even bigger crime. The idea is that government is a stand-in and representative of the people, so any action against the government carries with it not only the harms of the action in itself, but the effect of those arms against an entire people. Hence, spying against governments is actually a more serious offense than spying against private parties. So if spying between governments is considered normal, than private parties cannot really expect safety from such spying.

Then there is the fact that private entities are spying on each other all the time now. The average worker and consumer now has dozens of different companies spying on their personal behavior. So if there is no problem with that, why not governments? It's really just an extension of the same thing. The idea that you can have Google, Facebook, Apple, etc. with mountains of personal data, and somehow keep that data sacrosanct and walled off from governments is just a complete fantasy.

Spying hasn't changed and governments haven't changed. What's changed is the technology and the way that we as human beings are migrating our lives onto technology.