Winter is Coming (GoT is back)

[Mr. Morden]

Maybe I just have a weird sense of humor, but I found the Preston Jacobs recap of this episode to be hilarious:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4JxoX0Y59yQ

[Mr. Morden]

On the "Making of Game of Thrones" blog, they show the prop letter that was used for the scene where Doran receives a message from King's Landing:



Apparently Jaime can't spell "nieces".

[Chancellor Tanterterg]

Some more thoughts:

- The scene with the Boltons was excellent.  The stuff with Ramsay mourning Myranda was dumb, but that last line about what to do with the body was hilarious.  The conversation between Roose and Ramsay was what I really liked here though.  

- In defense of the Dorne scene: I think they're just killing off all the Dorne characters, which is for the best.  It didn't work in the books and it was a disaster on the show. I expect the Sand Snakes and Ellaria will die pretty quickly.  Also I just realized House Martell has been completely wiped out.  The Sand Snakes borrowing LF's teleporter was dumb, but Doran's death worked better than anything else in Dorne (I don't consider Oberyn as part of the Dornish storyline so it's a pretty low bar, but still).  It made no sense from a political standpoint, but if they're just putting the Dorne storyline out of its misery, I suppose we might as well get a surprising and semi-entertaining death scene out of it.    
____________________________________________________________________
Predictions for episode two:

- Winterfell: Ramsay suggests attacking Castle Black b/c Sansa and Theon are going there and Roose agrees

- Pyke: Euron kills Balon *Maybe, I'm not sure about this one just because IDK if there will be room in the episode

- Castle Black: Thorne and co. break down the door, Edd and the Wildlings arrive and kill the mutineers.  Thorne gets killed in a boss battle with Tormund and Ghost turns Olly into a Kid's Meal.  The episode ends with Jon being resurrected somehow (maybe Melisandre kills herself in a "only death can pay for life" type thing).  If this happens, the last shot will be Jon's eyes opening...and then Castle Black probably won't be in episode three at all (a good way to build suspense and HBO seems to enjoy that sort of weapons grade trolling).  As with the Pyke prediction, I'm not as confident about Jon coming back b/c there may not be room in the episode.  

- We briefly see Bran and Max von Sydow gives him a quick talk about his Super Bran powers

- Arya fights the Waif again (who has already shot to the top of my sh!t list) and loses really badly, but does better than last time (maybe at least is swinging her stick in the general right direction).  A third Jaqen lets her return to the House of Black and White.  I hope she wargs into Nymeria and think she will this season, but it seems a bit too early.

- Brienne tells Sansa that Arya is alive, but she couldn't find her after the fight with the Hound.  Sansa gives Brienne a new mission: Go back to the Riverlands, find Arya, and bring her back to a safe part of the North.

- Tommen confines Cersei to her chambers, but the men guarding her collectively crap their pants at the sight of FrankenGregor and get out of the way when she wants to leave.  

-Jaime convinces Tommen to let him confront the High Sparrow.  They have a tense, well-acted confrontation in the Sept of Baelor, but no one dies or anything like that.  The High Sparrow drops his "Every one of us is poor and powerless, and yet together, we can overthrow an empire" line from the teaser.  

- Meereen is still a mess, so Tyrion decides to try releasing the two imprisoned dragons, but he changes his mind when they try to barbecue him.  This is laying the groundwork for when he actually frees them either late this season (or more likely, sometime next season).  We get the "That's what I do.  I drink and I know things" line from the second trailer.

Thoughts?  Agree?  Disagree?  Anyone have their own predictions for the next episode?

[Mr. Morden]

- Castle Black: Thorne and co. break down the door, Edd and the Wildlings arrive and kill the mutineers.  Thorne gets killed in a boss battle with Tormund and Ghost turns Olly into a Kid's Meal.  The episode ends with Jon being resurrected somehow (maybe Melisandre kills herself in a "only death can pay for life" type thing).  If this happens, the last shot will be Jon's eyes opening...and then Castle Black probably won't be in episode three at all (a good way to build suspense and HBO seems to enjoy that sort of weapons grade trolling).  As with the Pyke prediction, I'm not as confident about Jon coming back b/c there may not be room in the episode.

Kill the mutineers?  Don't the mutineers consist of all but about 5 Nightswatchmen?  So will the NW be completely done once this battle is over?  Castle Black will then be occupied by....the 5 or so NW left, plus a bunch of Wildlings?

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Wait, you mean send Brienne away right now?  Wouldn't she want to keep Brienne around until she (Sansa) is somewhere a bit safer?  Also, wouldn't she think that Arya was in the Vale rather than the Riverlands?  The Brienne vs. Hound fight was in the Vale, right?

I haven't read the books, but I understand that San/San is kind of a thing in the books.  Do you think Sansa will have any reaction to the fact that Brienne (apparently) killed the Hound?

[Chancellor Tanterterg]

- Castle Black: Thorne and co. break down the door, Edd and the Wildlings arrive and kill the mutineers.  Thorne gets killed in a boss battle with Tormund and Ghost turns Olly into a Kid's Meal.  The episode ends with Jon being resurrected somehow (maybe Melisandre kills herself in a "only death can pay for life" type thing).  If this happens, the last shot will be Jon's eyes opening...and then Castle Black probably won't be in episode three at all (a good way to build suspense and HBO seems to enjoy that sort of weapons grade trolling).  As with the Pyke prediction, I'm not as confident about Jon coming back b/c there may not be room in the episode.

Kill the mutineers?  Don't the mutineers consist of all but about 5 Nightswatchmen?  So will the NW be completely done once this battle is over?  Castle Black will then be occupied by....the 5 or so NW left, plus a bunch of Wildlings?

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Wait, you mean send Brienne away right now?  Wouldn't she want to keep Brienne around until she (Sansa) is somewhere a bit safer?  Also, wouldn't she think that Arya was in the Vale rather than the Riverlands?  The Brienne vs. Hound fight was in the Vale, right?

I haven't read the books, but I understand that San/San is kind of a thing in the books.  Do you think Sansa will have any reaction to the fact that Brienne (apparently) killed the Hound?

- I think that there were about 50 night's watchmen, IIRC.  Only like 12 seem to have been outright mutineers, the rest seemed kinda apathetic at the end of Thorne's speech.  In any event, yeah, I don't think most of the Night's Watch is in it for the long haul.  Dolorous Edd probably becomes Lord Commander, imo.  

- Logically, the Vale might make more sense, but narratively the Riverlands probably make more sense since a lot of stuff will be happening there this season and some of it will likely involve Jaime, especially since basically nothing is happening in the Vale and a bunch probably will in the Riverlands given that HBO already made it known that the Freys, Edmure, and the Blackfish will be back this season.  

- San/San isn't really a thing in the books either.  It isn't really a thing anywhere in book or show cannon, tbh.  It's basically a creepy (the age difference alone... *shudder*) cracked pairing that seems to have become extremely popular because a bunch of people looked at Sansa and the Hound's ACoK/Season 2 storylines and came to the conclusion that there were romantic feelings between the two.  Now Sansa is arguably a reminder to the Hound of the innocence he lost when his brother burned his face and his father lied about what happened and he definitely behaves protectively toward her *at times,* but that's about it.  I don't think Sansa will care about the Hound's fate, tbh (*hides under desk*).  She'll probably be more focused on the fact that Arya is still alive and on figuring out how to find her/get her somewhere safe.

- Yeah, Brienne and Poderick (and Theon, for that matter, he'll decide to head to the Iron Islands any episode now imo) probably won't be with Sansa much longer.  Narratively speaking, Theon needs to have a confrontation with his family and we're really running out of time for that.  It's like how Sam needs to confront Randyll or Arya needs to leave the Faceless Men either mid-to-late season (thinking episode 7 or 8, but we'll see).  Are there other entirely plausible courses of action open to the characters?  Sure.  But when predicting GoT, I try to ask "does it make narrative sense?"  That often narrows things down somewhat, at least in terms of broad strokes.


Edit: Actually, I think Mr. Morden might be right regarding Brienne leaving.  Narratively speaking, the important thing is that she reaches the Riverlands before the last few episodes of the season so that she's there for whatever goes down when the Freys and Jaime presumably face off with the Blackfish at Riverrun.  That wouldn't necessarily require her to leave this episode.

[Blue3]

Has anyone read GRRM's original 3-page outline of the series?

This is back when he had only written under half of the first book. And the second book would have been Daenerys with her Dothraki invasion, and the third book the invasion of the Others (White Walkers).

There are multiple changes, but it gives you an idea of where some plot threads still might go.

Like Jaime taking the Iron Throne, Arya and Jon falling in love with each other and that being a problem until his true parentage is revealed (maybe Sansa will play that role now?), Tyrion in love with Arya, and the 5 characters who survive: Jon, Bran, Arya, Daenerys, Tyrion.

But there were definitely changes. Like originally Catlyn being killed by and becoming a White Walker (after taking Arya back with her to Winterfell, and Arya and Bran with her to Castle Black and then further north). Sansa having Joffrey's son and choosing them over her family but later regretting it (and presumably her and her son being killed by Jaime). Daenerys wanting revenge for her brother and killing Khal Drogo. Robb dies in battle, after maiming Joffrey who's later deposed by Tyrion after Tyrion destroys Winterfell. Uncle Benjen staying around longer. Ned's death seem the same.

http://www.businessinsider.com/game-of-thrones-was-supposed-to-be-a-trilogy-2015-2

[Chancellor Tanterterg]

Has anyone read GRRM's original 3-page outline of the series?

This is back when he had only written under half of the first book. And the second book would have been Daenerys with her Dothraki invasion, and the third book the invasion of the Others (White Walkers).

There are multiple changes, but it gives you an idea of where some plot threads still might go.

Like Jaime taking the Iron Throne, Arya and Jon falling in love with each other and that being a problem until his true parentage is revealed (maybe Sansa will play that role now?), Tyrion in love with Arya, and the 5 characters who survive: Jon, Bran, Arya, Daenerys, Tyrion.

But there were definitely changes. Like originally Catlyn being killed by and becoming a White Walker (after taking Arya back with her to Winterfell, and Arya and Bran with her to Castle Black and then further north). Sansa having Joffrey's son and choosing them over her family but later regretting it (and presumably her and her son being killed by Jaime). Daenerys wanting revenge for her brother and killing Khal Drogo. Robb dies in battle, after maiming Joffrey who's later deposed by Tyrion after Tyrion destroys Winterfell. Uncle Benjen staying around longer. Ned's death seem the same.

http://www.businessinsider.com/game-of-thrones-was-supposed-to-be-a-trilogy-2015-2

I have and I'd argue that it really doesn't tell you anything about where things are headed.  Note that some parts of the outline are blacked out.  From this we can infer that the parts of the outline that are available to us are only those that were essentially scrapped.

- Additionally, it does not say that Arya, Jon, Dany, Tyrion, and Bran all survive, it only suggests that they are the core central characters.  In fact, I'd bet money that Tyrion dies in the last book (he basically checks all the boxes for someone who would bite it in a story like this imo) and I'd be shocked if Dany and Jon survive the battle with the Others (especially Dany, characters with messiah/savior complexes tend not to survive stories with bittersweet endings).  If Tyrion, Jon, and Dany are the three heads of the dragon (per Word of God, one of the might not be a Targaryen) then my guess is they and the dragons somehow die while successfully stopping the Others in some sort of better than it sounds manner.  Bran, Arya, and Sansa are probably safe though.  And Samwell Tarly, I'm pretty sure he survives too.

- As for Sansa/Jon and Arya/Jon if either of those pairings happen, I will eat my hat (or I would if I had one ).  Not sure which one makes me cringe more.  Probably Arya/Jon due to the age disparity.  Then again, it's not like Martin has ever missed a chance for incest in ASOIAF.  Btw, as the great Steven Attwell has noted on racefortheironthrone https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Westermarck_effect is a thing.

[The Other Castro]

I read the books so I'm pretty excited to finally see how the rez scene occurs.
From the trailer, we know we're finally getting a Bran scene, so I'm guessing the episode starts with that, probably taking place at Winterfell in the past. Other events I think will happen:
-Balon + Euron + bridge scene
-Ramsey kills Roose or Walda or her baby (he kills probably at least 1 person)
-Jamie + High Sparrow scene from the trailer
-Wildlings come back, capture Thorne (maybe some NW die)
-Arya accidentally wargs into a cat, fights off the Waif
-Tyrion frees the dragons!
-Mel rezzes Jon, and possibly sacrifices herself/Ghost/nobody at all. (last shot of episode)
-ToJ scene with Bran happens either this episode, next episode, or episode 4. If rez scene happens this episode, I think ToJ is the start of the next episode.

[Enduro]

I'm thinking that the high sparrow is going to die in this episode or the next.

[Blue3]

[Chancellor Tanterterg]

Seconded.  Also Cersei is totally going to burn KL to the ground with wildfire.  Cersei probably sends FrankenGregor to kill Margaery and Tommen being Tommen, tries to save her which goes about as well as that picture suggests and then Cersei completely snaps.

[Lumine]

Now that was an episode I throughly enjoyed!

Above all, the anti-climax that Roose Bolton's death represents felt particularly satisfying to me, but there really was a lot to enjoy.

[The Other Castro]

AHHHHHHHHHH

[dead0man]

Lots of good stuff and one horrible thing.  I was like, "please cut away" over and over...and they just drug it out......come on....I know where this is going....."please cut away, please cut away".



...



At least they didn't "show" anything and they didn't add a baby cry sound effect in.  I always have a hard time with kid death, even in a show as hardcore as this.

[dead0man]

oh, which head smash was better?  The giant and the crossbowman, or the Zombie Mountain vs big talker?  Sure the giant smash was more....insanely awesome, but the Zombie Mountain's casualness and ease earned a lot of points.  Still, I think the edge goes to the big guy up north.

[Enduro]

That was one of the best episodes since Jofferey's death.

[Citizen (The) Doctor]

Lots of good stuff and one horrible thing.  I was like, "please cut away" over and over...and they just drug it out......come on....I know where this is going....."please cut away, please cut away".



...



At least they didn't "show" anything and they didn't add a baby cry sound effect in.  I always have a hard time with kid death, even in a show as hardcore as this.

I think the only thing that makes the incident at the end of last season worse than this episode was the screaming going silent. It's absolutely horrifying.

[Mr. Morden]

The next three episodes are titled:

Oathbreaker
Book of the Stranger
The Door

I know they like to use titles that have multiple meanings, but I’m going to guess right now that one of the meanings for “The Door” will be the door between the 3-eyed raven’s cave and the outside world.  The door leading into the room where the dragons are kept is another possibility.  Those would both be literal doors, but there'll presumably be a metaphorical meaning as well.

Also, I feel like something’s gone off the rails with regard to which story threads the show is following in King’s Landing.  Isn’t Kevan supposed to be Hand of the King now?  We haven’t seen him in a single scene in which he has dialog since he last returned from Casterly Rock, even though he’s supposed to kind of be in charge now.  And AFAIK, Olenna should still be in town trying to get her grandchildren out of jail, but we haven’t seen her in ages either.  What is the disposition of Kevan towards the Sparrows, and is Olenna also trying to talk to Kevan about the Sparrows, etc.?  What is going on with regard to who has power now in KL?  I wish we’d get a scene or two clarifying that.

[Mr. Morden]

Also, if enough time has passed since last season for Walda to go through an entire 9 month pregnancy, then shouldn't we start seeing Gilly's baby graduate from "baby" to "toddler" pretty soon?  That kid was born about three years ago!

[Chancellor Tanterterg]

The more I think about that episode, the more I dislike it (although the Pyke stuff, the Arya scene, and the scene with Sansa, Theon, and Brienne were good).  The Tyrion/Meereen subplot is fast becoming the Dorne of this season.  More importantly, Jon's resurrection was pretty silly and Tormund, Davos and Roose were all acting pretty out of character in various ways.

[MasterJedi]

Love how they trolled the fans for a week about Jon Snow.

Either way we need George RR Martin to get off his fat lazy ass and write the next two books. He's gotten caught up in his own fame and worthless blogging, every normal person would have been fired long ago. Send out the goon squads and beat him until he finishes it.

[Chancellor Tanterterg]

Love how they trolled the fans for a week about Jon Snow.

Either way we need George RR Martin to get off his fat lazy ass and write the next two books. He's gotten caught up in his own fame and worthless blogging, every normal person would have been fired long ago. Send out the goon squads and beat him until he finishes it.

He doesn't owe you or me anything.  The man has a right to enjoy his life too.

[dead0man]

Love how they trolled the fans for a week about Jon Snow.

Either way we need George RR Martin to get off his fat lazy ass and write the next two books. He's gotten caught up in his own fame and worthless blogging, every normal person would have been fired long ago. Send out the goon squads and beat him until he finishes it.

and it's got nothing to do with fame, he took forever to write sh**t before the fame too.

[MasterJedi]

Love how they trolled the fans for a week about Jon Snow.

Either way we need George RR Martin to get off his fat lazy ass and write the next two books. He's gotten caught up in his own fame and worthless blogging, every normal person would have been fired long ago. Send out the goon squads and beat him until he finishes it.

and it's got nothing to do with fame, he took forever to write sh**t before the fame too.

First 3 books written in 4 years, then they became popular and he started slacking. Next 2 books 11 years, up to 5 years now, likely a year or two more before the next book, it's pathetic.

There are better authors who can put out a book every year or every other year. That's because they treat writing as their job and write 8 hours a day instead of blogging.

As for Malcolm X, yes he does owe us. He signed a contract and is supposed to do his job and write the book. Last year he said he "put away all his side projects and conventions to write seriously" meaning he's been faffing about for the last few years not caring. Any regular person would be fired a long time ago. He's also doesn't care about the story either, said if he does he will make it so no one can finish his books.

[Blue3]

Who said it... the High Sparrow, or Bernie Sanders?



https://aboveaverage.com/who-said-it-bernie-sanders-or-the-high-sparrow-from-game-of-thrones/