Deal Reached on Fast-Track Authority for TPP

[Deus Naturae]

The idea that "free" trade helps the average American much is hysterical. The government has certainly not been trying to help American businesses, either. It's cheaper to mail some one ounce thing from China to the United States, with USPS delivering it than it is to mail the same one ounce thing from the US to the US. The USPS clearly has favored Chinese businesses over American businesses.

Yes, of course, US government and both parties have sold America to China, Mexico and all the other non-white peoples too numerous to mention. TREASON!

I love it how the "left" becomes jingoist whenever trade  comes up.

LOL, it's jingoist to point out that it's cheaper to ship from China to the US than from US to the US?

No, but suggesting that's it's part of a conspiracy to destroy American businesses and support foreigners kind of is.

I'm against the TPP though. Tariff reduction may reduce the cost of goods, but the IP provisions will do just the opposite while also cracking down on online freedom.

[Deus Naturae]

Yeah, the export of the United States' hitherto almost uniquely terrible intellectual property regime all over the Pacific Rim really is the most intolerable and indefensible part of this, and it's (obviously) one for which this country has nobody but itself to blame.

Exactly. In any case, it will do no further harm inside the US: all the harm has already been done.

It will do harm to American consumers of goods from other signatory nations. And, even if it would do no harm to the US, that still isn't an argument in favor of US participation in it. If a war harmed other countries but made no difference or benefitted to the US, that wouldn't be an argument in favor of US participation in the conflict.

[Deus Naturae]

Yeah, the export of the United States' hitherto almost uniquely terrible intellectual property regime all over the Pacific Rim really is the most intolerable and indefensible part of this, and it's (obviously) one for which this country has nobody but itself to blame.

Exactly. In any case, it will do no further harm inside the US: all the harm has already been done.

It will do harm to American consumers of goods from other signatory nations. And, even if it would do no harm to the US, that still isn't an argument in favor of US participation in it. If a war harmed other countries but made no difference or benefitted to the US, that wouldn't be an argument in favor of US participation in the conflict.

The other countries are willing to take this sh**t, because US repays them with market access. If you do not want these IP provisions, just fight against them domestically - everybody else would be happy. We are willing to take this even in package with the IP sh**t - we would be much happier without. But saying that you are against an agreement because of the provisions YOUR GOVERNMENT insists upon, and so you will fight against the agreement, rather than against your government insisting on those provisions - is, at best, strange.

Correction: The governments of the other countries are willing to take this sh**t. That doesn't mean it's good for their citizens, many of whom oppose this treaty. Plus, I already pointed out that Americans are affected by the foreign adoption of these laws this as well.

I find it strange how you emphasize "your government" as if I personally have some sort of connection with its positions on these matters. I already advocate the repeal of these measures here; it only makes sense that I would oppose efforts by MY GOVERNMENT to extend them to foreign countries as well.

[Deus Naturae]

You live in a democracy, don´t you?

Well, as a citizen of Mexico, I would like to have as many of these treaties as possible. Because free trade is good for us.

I don't know what point this post is trying to make.

[Deus Naturae]

snip

LOL @ "the need for secrecy." We need to be secretive because...someone might attempt to reveal what we're doing to the public. That truly would be a disaster. We need to respect the privacy of those who would restrict the online freedom of millions without their knowledge!