Electoral Reform Debate - Commentary Thread (user search)
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  Electoral Reform Debate - Commentary Thread (search mode)
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Author Topic: Electoral Reform Debate - Commentary Thread  (Read 2977 times)
Adam Griffin
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Posts: 20,088
Greece


Political Matrix
E: -7.35, S: -6.26

« on: April 28, 2015, 09:01:08 PM »

I'm still just as neutral as ever. Clyde's doing a great job at keeping me there, to be honest.
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Adam Griffin
Atlas Star
*****
Posts: 20,088
Greece


Political Matrix
E: -7.35, S: -6.26

« Reply #1 on: April 29, 2015, 09:14:27 PM »

So is the Labor Party planning to pass this to gerrymander the other parties out of existence or fail it to undermine their President? I'm confused.

Both, obviously!
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Adam Griffin
Atlas Star
*****
Posts: 20,088
Greece


Political Matrix
E: -7.35, S: -6.26

« Reply #2 on: April 29, 2015, 11:50:26 PM »
« Edited: April 29, 2015, 11:55:18 PM by RG Griff »

 

IMPORTANT ANNOUNCEMENT: Something of interest that I just noticed - even if this bill is ratified by the regions, it will not go into effect until after the August elections. As a person who revised or added to a lot of the clauses toward the end of debate and is therefore familiar with the provisions (and also the intent), this is why I brought up the subject in the thread last week that expedited the passage of the amendment.  Unfortunately, it wasn't enough to meet the schedule.

Just pooping in here to remind Senators that based on the schedule outlined in the current text, this process would need to be completed - along with ratification - by May 3rd in order to go into effect for the August elections. This means that the bill would need to clear the Senate no later than the 26th to allow for seven-day voting periods in the regions.

Technically I think the date would be May 4th looking at it now, but that meant that 4/5 regions had to open their booths on or before April 27th for the 7-day window (or 3 regions + the South, which ratifies through the legislature and doesn't necessarily require 7 days). Only 2 regions + the South opened their booths on or before the 27th, so there is no way for the amendment to be ratified in time to be in compliance with the following clause:

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Technically, "redistricting schedule" could be stretched to mean the entire period between elections (since the beginning of it is based on a period of time elapsing from the end of the at-large elections), but excluding a BK-style interpretation, it seems pretty straightforward that the "redistricting schedule" in this case begins at 1:00 AM ET on May 4th. This means that 4 out of 5 regions (or the South + 3 other regions) would have needed to open their voting booths no later than 1:00 AM on April 27th (plus all would actually have to ratify it). I suppose you could stretch the definition based on the classic "hours versus days" argument, which could allow up to the end of the 27th for the booths to be opened, but in either case, we didn't meet the prerequisites.

Latest Time By Which 4/5 Regions Must Ratify for August Timeline:
5/4 @ 1 AM ET ("Hours" interpretation)
5/4 @ 11:59 PM ET* ("Days" interpretation)

Earliest Time At Which a Region Could Ratify Based on Voting Booths Opening:
Pacific: May 1, 4:53 PM ET (OPENED IN TIME)
Northeast: May 2, Midnight (OPENED IN TIME)

IDS: Anytime* (POTENTIALLY OPENED IN TIME)
Mideast: May 5, 8:10 PM ET (DID NOT OPEN IN TIME)
Midwest: May 7, 12:09 AM ET (DID NOT OPEN IN TIME)


This means that the redistricting process will begin in September and the first election with districts will occur in December if it is ratified, since only the Northeast and the Pacific (plus the South, although it was opened "late" in a sense as well) opened their booths in enough time to ensure this amendment had a chance of going into effect this cycle.
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Adam Griffin
Atlas Star
*****
Posts: 20,088
Greece


Political Matrix
E: -7.35, S: -6.26

« Reply #3 on: April 29, 2015, 11:57:59 PM »

You cannot blame the Governors for wanting to leave time enough for the debate to occur before their citizens were voting on it. This is a big change and the people deserved a public discourse. Regardless of the implementation, I think it is more important that all sides are heard on this.

Well I'm not blaming anyone: I'm just detailing what happened and what will be.
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Adam Griffin
Atlas Star
*****
Posts: 20,088
Greece


Political Matrix
E: -7.35, S: -6.26

« Reply #4 on: April 30, 2015, 04:07:38 PM »

OK, first of all, some historical context: the system isn't inherently broken because the Federalists haven't won a special at-large in two years. Either the system has always been skewed against them or the Right just can't win at-large elections.

The organized Right (RPP/FED) didn't win a single at-large special Senate election from 2007-2012. The Populares won one and Jbrase (Independent) one another, but not the bulk of what comprises the Right. This means the organized Right has won 2 special at-large elections in seven years.

Even if it is the former situation, I wouldn't support changing the method of election just so the Right can be given an additional handicap in order to win elections, and I honestly don't think anyone who would advocate for the system using this justification would feel that way either. The Right needs to man up.
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Adam Griffin
Atlas Star
*****
Posts: 20,088
Greece


Political Matrix
E: -7.35, S: -6.26

« Reply #5 on: April 30, 2015, 11:21:24 PM »

OK, first of all, some historical context: the system isn't inherently broken because the Federalists haven't won a special at-large in two years. Either the system has always been skewed against them or the Right just can't win at-large elections.

The organized Right (RPP/FED) didn't win a single at-large special Senate election from 2007-2012. The Populares won one and Jbrase (Independent) one another, but not the bulk of what comprises the Right. This means the organized Right has won 2 special at-large elections in seven years.

Even if it is the former situation, I wouldn't support changing the method of election just so the Right can be given an additional handicap in order to win elections, and I honestly don't think anyone who would advocate for the system using this justification would feel that way either. The Right needs to man up.

More recently when Tmth resigned we conceded a seat to the Progressive Union for the sake of keeping a conservative in and a certain crazy laborite out (Tongue) and he later joined us a few months later anyway.

How'd that work out for you in the end?

60% certainty it didn't work very well
60% chance of the end of the world

Tongue
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