UK General Discussion Thread: mayy lmao
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  UK General Discussion Thread: mayy lmao
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Author Topic: UK General Discussion Thread: mayy lmao  (Read 139806 times)
All Along The Watchtower
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« Reply #1200 on: April 13, 2017, 05:46:07 AM »

Is this the right thread for this?

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Not good!

 http://www.independent.co.uk/student/news/student-loan-fees-increase-brexit-graduates-tuition-fees-university-monthly-payments-leave-eu-a7680396.html



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Clyde1998
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« Reply #1201 on: April 13, 2017, 08:11:31 AM »

Another huge kick in the teeth for the young. Not only do English students have the highest tuition fees in the EU, but they're debt is going up about three times the rate of wage growth. Especially at a time when the UK starts needing to train nurses to assist with the potential reduction of EU migrants following Brexit.

My advice for anyone thinking about going to university would be to look into English language universities in Europe. They would save you a lot of money and you can learn a new language at the same time.

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« Reply #1202 on: April 13, 2017, 09:01:12 AM »

The EU should try and push through a continental graduate tax to make all universities tuition free, if it really wants to embarrass us.

mfw I'm doing a four year course
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DC Al Fine
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« Reply #1203 on: April 13, 2017, 09:12:01 AM »

Wouldn't living costs be greater than tuition savings? Or do most UK students go away to university?
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Filuwaúrdjan
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« Reply #1204 on: April 13, 2017, 09:46:05 AM »

Note for people who aren't British: the tuition fees aren't really fees exactly and the 'debt' that results isn't technically debt.* Essentially it is a deferred tax that goes by another name - which incidentally is why charging commercial rates of interest is totally unjustifiable - and you only start paying back once you earn over a certain amount of taxable income. To a significant extent it is a Potemkin system; it is widely anticipated that a very high proportion of the 'debt' due from students will never be collected. Essentially it is surreal and Kafkaesque in a low key way rather than eye-poppingly horrific. I actually don't approve of people - whether journalist or NUS hacks - trying to pretend it is the latter because doing so doesn't actually help...

*Rather nastily this fact isn't pointed out to students themselves.
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Filuwaúrdjan
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« Reply #1205 on: April 13, 2017, 09:53:43 AM »

Additional strange (and not very pleasant actually) detail: the 'Student Loans Company' (the state corporation that oversees the entire tottering edifice) is based in Glasgow. I.e. the people who send out nasty letters (which are usually phrased in a misleading style implying that i.e. it is real debt that you SCUM have not paid back WHY NOT) to graduates have mostly not had to pay into the system themselves/neither have their children.
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afleitch
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« Reply #1206 on: April 13, 2017, 10:38:36 AM »

Additional strange (and not very pleasant actually) detail: the 'Student Loans Company' (the state corporation that oversees the entire tottering edifice) is based in Glasgow. I.e. the people who send out nasty letters (which are usually phrased in a misleading style implying that i.e. it is real debt that you SCUM have not paid back WHY NOT) to graduates have mostly not had to pay into the system themselves/neither have their children.

And as someone who knows people who work at the SLC there is no joy nor revelling in irony on their part. And Scottish students still take out loams that they pay back through SLC. And I'm still paying back after 10 years as is my friend who works there Smiley
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parochial boy
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« Reply #1207 on: April 13, 2017, 12:30:50 PM »
« Edited: April 13, 2017, 01:23:07 PM by parochial boy »

As an interesting aside, the expected level of default on student loans in the UK is such that, as things stand, it was only just worth raising the fees from £3k. Of course, you wander if the government isnt being ever so slightly optimistic with its estimates in order to hide the fact that the new fee system will be a net loss.
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« Reply #1208 on: April 13, 2017, 12:50:08 PM »

I know several students who didn't vote Labour in 2015 because of the policy of cutting fees to 6k. Their reasoning was little more than "I had to pay 9k, so why should the next lot have it cheaper."
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Filuwaúrdjan
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« Reply #1209 on: April 13, 2017, 12:50:48 PM »

And as someone who knows people who work at the SLC there is no joy nor revelling in irony on their part. And Scottish students still take out loams that they pay back through SLC. And I'm still paying back after 10 years as is my friend who works there Smiley

Oh for sure (I'm guessing that isn't a particularly pleasant place to work at either), but it really does add to the sense of surreal unpleasantness; like there's a joke somewhere and you're probably the punchline.
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Filuwaúrdjan
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« Reply #1210 on: April 13, 2017, 12:54:23 PM »

As an interesting aside, the expected level of default on student loans in the UK is such that, as things stand, it was only just worth raising the fees from £3k. Of course, you wander if the government isnt being ever so slightly optimistic with its estimates in order to hide the fact that the new fee systdm will be a net loss.

Basically they went All In with the new system because David Cameron always thought that David Willetts was a frightfully clever chap who knew what he was doing. Alas.

Actually already it isn't working out as Willetts intended; his intention was to create a competitive market in university admissions (with different universities offering widely different ranges of fees) and he really did seem to believe that it would happen, forgetting that for a university to charge less than £9k would be an admission of inferiority and that if there's one thing universities will never do...
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IceAgeComing
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« Reply #1211 on: April 13, 2017, 03:20:27 PM »

The student loan company also get very annoying when you're working outside the UK: when I told them I had a traineeship in Brussels they kept on trying to take money out of my (empty) UK account even though I continually told them and provided them with proof of the fact that my income was below the statutory minimum, and that technically my income wasn't really a "wage" but a "scholarship" (I think that's a thing that's used in a few traineeships so they can get around some laws regarding social security payments and the like).  I think the fact that my Strasbourg expenses technically put me above the limits by like £20 for a month confused them a bit: eventually we worked out that didn't count (even though I'm pretty sure I gained a hundred quid from the deal, since its the EU and they don't ask for receipts and such pay a fixed amount to everyone, apparently it actually works out cheaper than policing everyone strictly considering the fact that they send tonnes of people there every month) and I was good - luckily the attempts to take money out just failed, if I'd gone overdrawn then getting the money back with enough to cover the fees wouldn't have been an interesting experience...
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Blair
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« Reply #1212 on: April 14, 2017, 03:42:39 PM »

Note for people who aren't British: the tuition fees aren't really fees exactly and the 'debt' that results isn't technically debt.* Essentially it is a deferred tax that goes by another name - which incidentally is why charging commercial rates of interest is totally unjustifiable - and you only start paying back once you earn over a certain amount of taxable income. To a significant extent it is a Potemkin system; it is widely anticipated that a very high proportion of the 'debt' due from students will never be collected. Essentially it is surreal and Kafkaesque in a low key way rather than eye-poppingly horrific. I actually don't approve of people - whether journalist or NUS hacks - trying to pretend it is the latter because doing so doesn't actually help...

*Rather nastily this fact isn't pointed out to students themselves.

To bore most people to death, I've heard (although it sounded like Hearsay) that your student loan can be used in relation to getting a mortgage, and that banks can hold it against you when deciding.

The only blessing I can take is that I'm leaving before the cap goes completely; considering that 10 years ago you only had 3K fees a year, the grant and other perks, I don't want to imagine what it will be like in 2027
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Filuwaúrdjan
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« Reply #1213 on: April 14, 2017, 05:55:31 PM »

To bore most people to death, I've heard (although it sounded like Hearsay) that your student loan can be used in relation to getting a mortgage, and that banks can hold it against you when deciding.

They can now be included in mortgage affordability calculations (the justification being that it counts as a committed expenditure; it was one of a bundle of changes pushed through recently to tighten up lending) but it does not have any affect on your credit rating. Mind you, for most people under 35 or so the idea of 'getting a mortgage' is turning in to quite the fantasy...
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« Reply #1214 on: April 18, 2017, 04:51:46 AM »

May to make an unscheduled statement from Downing Street at 11:15AM (i.e. within the next half an hour), with speculation that she could be calling a snap general election.
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« Reply #1215 on: April 18, 2017, 05:03:39 AM »

Snap general election on June 8th according to multiple sources.
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Silent Hunter
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« Reply #1216 on: April 18, 2017, 05:13:16 AM »

Confirmed.
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MASHED POTATOES. VOTE!
Kalwejt
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« Reply #1217 on: April 18, 2017, 05:32:04 AM »

Given Labour's defeat is very likely, I really hope they will finally toss Corbyn overboard after.
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LabourJersey
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« Reply #1218 on: April 18, 2017, 06:07:43 AM »

I don't think there is a chance that the Tories will win less than 350, much less actually lose their majority. Sad, really the state of Corbyn-era labour
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True Federalist (진정한 연방 주의자)
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« Reply #1219 on: April 18, 2017, 06:56:39 AM »

I'm disappointed. If she had to call an early election, it should've been a May election, not June. 😁
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Kalwejt
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« Reply #1220 on: April 18, 2017, 07:35:05 AM »

I don't think there is a chance that the Tories will win less than 350, much less actually lose their majority. Sad, really the state of Corbyn-era labour

There's been a lot of Michael Foot-Jeremy Corbyn comparisons, but I don't think these are fair. Foot was truly laboring under a curse and it's actually to his credit the Labour haven't imploded with Benn trolling from the left and SDP leaving on the right.

Corbyn? Oh come on, dude, there's no rational reason for Labour to do so poorly other than having a s**ty leader.
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Barnes
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« Reply #1221 on: April 18, 2017, 10:49:48 AM »

I'm disappointed. If she had to call an early election, it should've been a May election, not June. 😁

But, but, May say she was rock solid against an election, it was only that fickle opposition that changed her mind! Grin

Also, the election wouldn't be on my birthday then! Haha.
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Angel of Death
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« Reply #1222 on: April 18, 2017, 01:51:30 PM »

Theresa May was almost guaranteed to have nearly two terms as PM, so why likely shorten that time by calling an early election? A very plausible explanation, which the markets seem to be rooting for, is that she's (finally?) facing reality on Brexit and wants to go for a soft(ish) Brexit and have a comfortable majority without any troublesome rebel backbenchers.
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Phony Moderate
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« Reply #1223 on: April 18, 2017, 02:08:02 PM »

Theresa May was almost guaranteed to have nearly two terms as PM, so why likely shorten that time by calling an early election? A very plausible explanation, which the markets seem to be rooting for, is that she's (finally?) facing reality on Brexit and wants to go for a soft(ish) Brexit and have a comfortable majority without any troublesome rebel backbenchers.

Another one is that she is worried about certain investigations regarding expenses in the 2015 election.
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Barnes
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« Reply #1224 on: April 18, 2017, 02:29:36 PM »
« Edited: April 18, 2017, 05:48:44 PM by Barnes »

Dennis Skinner will be the Father of the House after this election. Haha
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