How would you have voted for TARP (by party)?
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  How would you have voted for TARP (by party)?
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Poll
Question: ?
#1
Aye (R)
 
#2
Nay (R)
 
#3
Aye (D)
 
#4
Nay (D)
 
#5
Aye (I/O)
 
#6
Nay (I/O)
 
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Partisan results

Total Voters: 75

Author Topic: How would you have voted for TARP (by party)?  (Read 1656 times)
Ebsy
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« Reply #25 on: May 19, 2015, 01:56:38 PM »

Should have definitely broken the banks up, but I would have voted Aye.
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Atlas Has Shrugged
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« Reply #26 on: May 19, 2015, 01:57:36 PM »

No (R). If we all are going to eat s[INKS]t in another great depression, the banksters should be eating it with us.

So your logic is "we should have let the banking system collapse and caused a second Depression so that the bankers would suffer"?
If we're going to suffer either way (which the middle class certainly did), then yes, we might as well all go down together.
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Oakvale
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« Reply #27 on: May 19, 2015, 02:01:05 PM »

No (R). If we all are going to eat s[INKS]t in another great depression, the banksters should be eating it with us.

So your logic is "we should have let the banking system collapse and caused a second Depression so that the bankers would suffer"?
If we're going to suffer either way (which the middle class certainly did), then yes, we might as well all go down together.

Do you understand how bonkers this is?

Let me use an analogy. Someone burns your house down, so you suffer. A better alternative by your logic is that you instead set off an atomic bomb and end all life on earth because it's only fair that he suffer too.
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Atlas Has Shrugged
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« Reply #28 on: May 19, 2015, 02:06:49 PM »

No (R). If we all are going to eat s[INKS]t in another great depression, the banksters should be eating it with us.

So your logic is "we should have let the banking system collapse and caused a second Depression so that the bankers would suffer"?
If we're going to suffer either way (which the middle class certainly did), then yes, we might as well all go down together.

Do you understand how bonkers this is?

Let me use an analogy. Someone burns your house down, so you suffer. A better alternative by your logic is that you instead set off an atomic bomb and end all life on earth because it's only fair that he suffer too.
The analogy is false. Setting off an atomic bomb would destroy the property of others, after all. Now, if the arsonist burnt down every other home in the area, then sure, blow the whole thing apart and rebuild from the ground up.

It's not like TARP helped the working class out, on the whole. Millions lost their jobs and their homes. It wasn't a depression, but it wasn't your average recession either, and the affects of it will linger for a generation.
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RINO Tom
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« Reply #29 on: May 19, 2015, 02:09:49 PM »

Aye (don't let "principles" destroy the global economy)
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Atlas Has Shrugged
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« Reply #30 on: May 19, 2015, 02:12:55 PM »

Aye (don't let "principles" destroy the global economy)
If you don't have principles, what is the point of anything? The global economy relies on a set of basic principles that were routinely violated leading up to the recession. The banks gave loans to everybody and their brother, and then folded on everyone else. I'm not advocating for their lynching like some in this thread, but something had to be done.
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Oakvale
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« Reply #31 on: May 19, 2015, 02:13:07 PM »

No (R). If we all are going to eat s[INKS]t in another great depression, the banksters should be eating it with us.

So your logic is "we should have let the banking system collapse and caused a second Depression so that the bankers would suffer"?
If we're going to suffer either way (which the middle class certainly did), then yes, we might as well all go down together.

Do you understand how bonkers this is?

Let me use an analogy. Someone burns your house down, so you suffer. A better alternative by your logic is that you instead set off an atomic bomb and end all life on earth because it's only fair that he suffer too.
The analogy is false. Setting off an atomic bomb would destroy the property of others, after all. Now, if the arsonist burnt down every other home in the area, then sure, blow the whole thing apart and rebuild from the ground up.

YES AND LETTING THE BANKING SYSTEM COLLAPSE WOULD AFFECT EVERYONE FAR, FAR WORSE THAN THE ACTUAL RECESSION DID. Why is this is a difficult point to understand? Is your solution seriously to plunge the global economy into ruin so that we can "rebuild from the ground up"? Is this some kind of primitivist thing?

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I'd argue that not having a second Great Depression helped the working class out quite a lot, actually.
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Beet
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« Reply #32 on: May 19, 2015, 05:44:04 PM »

Unfortunately I have to agree with Oakvale here; of course, TARP tends to be overrated as the singular bill that represented the governments assistance to the financial system, when in fact the dozens of never-voted-on actions by the Federal Reserve had a much greater impact.

It's true that Obama could have tacked further towards reform in the spring of 2009 than he did; nationalizing, replacing the management and then breaking up the banks would have entirely been consistent with the direction of TARP, and could have been done with much the same financial stabilization that actually occurred. Of course, men like Geithner and Summers (especially Geithner) would not have been the ones inclined to carry it out. Obamas economic progressivism has always been exaggerated.
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Ebsy
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« Reply #33 on: May 19, 2015, 06:02:23 PM »

This thread shows us why Rand Paul supporters are the WORST.
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Sprouts Farmers Market ✘
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« Reply #34 on: May 19, 2015, 06:06:48 PM »

TARP might be the single bill that caused the Republican Party to go off the deep-end regarding economic thought. (Sure Obama's election aided in it, but this is where it started with McCain getting angry about it to pander/test the electorate before ultimately voting for it anyway.)
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The Mikado
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« Reply #35 on: May 19, 2015, 06:26:17 PM »

TARP is an issue I'm more familiar with than most issues, and it was definitely the right thing to do, despite being rather...unseemly. I supported it at the time and in retrospect I think that's been borne out as the right call.
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Boston Bread
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« Reply #36 on: May 19, 2015, 06:30:42 PM »

Aye (dislikes financial collapse, depressions)
We still should have regulated them more, obviously.
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Fubart Solman
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« Reply #37 on: May 22, 2015, 12:10:21 AM »

Honestly, I'm not sure how I would have voted at the time, but (like the auto bailouts), hindsight says that it was a good move at least in terms of preventing a second Great Depression.
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jfern
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« Reply #38 on: May 22, 2015, 12:14:57 AM »

Against the bank bailouts, but for the auto bailouts. And I don't even really like cars.
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Mr. Smith
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« Reply #39 on: May 22, 2015, 12:22:32 AM »

Against the bank bailouts, but for the auto bailouts. And I don't even really like cars.
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Attorney General, LGC Speaker, and Former PPT Dwarven Dragon
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« Reply #40 on: May 22, 2015, 12:37:32 AM »

Aye, reluctantly. I would have pushed for a bill that would have broken up the banks and forced firing all of the chief executives, no exceptions. But TARP as passed was better than nothing.
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bedstuy
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« Reply #41 on: May 22, 2015, 08:58:54 AM »

No (R). If we all are going to eat s[INKS]t in another great depression, the banksters should be eating it with us.

So your logic is "we should have let the banking system collapse and caused a second Depression so that the bankers would suffer"?
If we're going to suffer either way (which the middle class certainly did), then yes, we might as well all go down together.

Do you understand how bonkers this is?

Let me use an analogy. Someone burns your house down, so you suffer. A better alternative by your logic is that you instead set off an atomic bomb and end all life on earth because it's only fair that he suffer too.
The analogy is false. Setting off an atomic bomb would destroy the property of others, after all. Now, if the arsonist burnt down every other home in the area, then sure, blow the whole thing apart and rebuild from the ground up.

It's not like TARP helped the working class out, on the whole. Millions lost their jobs and their homes. It wasn't a depression, but it wasn't your average recession either, and the affects of it will linger for a generation.

You don't understand what you're talking about bud.

When we had to pass TARP, the credit markets were frozen.  That is unbelievably serious.  GE couldn't finance their day-to-day operations with commercial paper.  Think about that.  If the biggest corporations couldn't function, how does the economy keep going?

Without TARP, all the investment banks go under.  Goldman Sachs, Citigroup, Morgan Stanley, Barclays, all of them.  All of the major commercial banks follow.  The big insurance companies go, obviously AIG.  At that point, we're in uncharted territory.  That wouldn't be the Great Depression, it would be far worse.

So, it's a choice between 10% unemployment and 30% or 40% or 50% unemployment.  I guarantee you the average American would feel that difference.
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politicallefty
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« Reply #42 on: May 23, 2015, 12:07:29 PM »

Aye, at the time (D). There should have been considerably more strings attached to the deal, not the least of which should have been criminal and civil charges against those that caused the financial crisis.
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Snowstalker Mk. II
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« Reply #43 on: May 23, 2015, 12:17:31 PM »

Hang the bankers and paedos
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ElectionsGuy
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« Reply #44 on: May 23, 2015, 12:29:57 PM »

I see anybody who opposes it gets verbally sh**tted on here...
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TJ in Oregon
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« Reply #45 on: May 23, 2015, 01:58:26 PM »


Why? That seems like an odd position to hold. Why the auto bailout more necessary even if it was executed better?
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SATW
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« Reply #46 on: May 23, 2015, 02:48:49 PM »

Aye.
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Phony Moderate
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« Reply #47 on: May 23, 2015, 04:22:18 PM »

No.
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jfern
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« Reply #48 on: May 23, 2015, 04:35:53 PM »


Why? That seems like an odd position to hold. Why the auto bailout more necessary even if it was executed better?

They actually make things. The banks just lend people money at higher interest rates than the government lent the banks money.
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Türkisblau
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« Reply #49 on: May 23, 2015, 05:29:34 PM »

Of course I'm against it.
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