Huckabee defends admitted child molester

[Ebsy]

He could just be ignoring it like all the sane Republicans.

[Sprouts Farmers Market ✘]

Believing in redemption is scandalous.  It has always been thus.

It's fine to believe in redemption, but Huckabee goes out of his way to defend these people solely because of their Christianity. I don't believe he would be talking about redemption if this were some random child molester.


Yes, there is nothing wrong with redemption.  Being a Christian means hoping that all might one day be redeemed.  When it comes to child sex crimes and premeditated murderers, however, the perpetrators will have to seek redemption in the next world.  Not because they are inherently irredeemable, but because of public safety.    

Redemption doesn't mean that you don't have to face legal penalties.  It means that you are not defined by what you did, that you are not forever judged for it as being unworthy of respect and incapable of goodness.  If you do not believe that people can change and learn and grow from what they did in their youth, then you do not believe in redemption.

Redemption is not without a price -- namely, taking the worldly penalties (including shame, pain, imprisonment, and financial ruin) that one accepts if redemption is genuine.

A murderer is still a murderer in our world. A thief is still a thief in our world. A rapist is still a rapist in our world. If one accepts Christianity as true, then even being burned at the stake is a minor payment for eternal salvation.

What kind of weird theology claims that being burned at the stake could be payment for salvation?  The idea that a person cannot be redeemed from sin if they do not suffer criminal penalties, or that they should live their entire lives being shamed by those around them for what they did completely misses the role of grace. Christianity is not "you deserve forgiveness if you suffer enough or what you did isn't that bad."

For the unbeliever, Christ is nothing more than a new Kevin Trudeau, promising something too good to be true.  Works-based plans of salvation make more sense to people at one level, and I include many folks who profess to be "Christians" in this because it seems unfair that a murderer/child molester, or someone as awful as a Hitler or a Stalin could have a deathbed revelation and truly accept Christ and receive an eternal reward and be forever in the same Heaven that a "good person" goes to.  The real attraction to works-based plans of salvation is that it seems to offer folks some control over their eternity.  ("I can be good and make the cut!") 

I recall seeing an account an incident related to the trial of Adolf Eichmann. A Christian evangelist went to Jerusalem. A Jew asked what the evangelist was there to save, and the evangelist replied "Eichmann".

The same Jew asked, "but what of all my relatives that he killed?"

The evangelist said, "They are in Hell for not accepting Jesus as Lord and Savior".

Another Jew said, "So I will be content to go to Hell where my relatives are, and you can be with your pervert forever!"

... All in all I find the Jewish promise of Heaven to all righteous people far more satisfying for humanity as a whole than any credal toadying limited to any single culture. That is a far better hope than almost any other religion can offer.

1. This never happened
2. This is a total misrepresentation of Christianity
3. This is actually a disgusting post on the level of Snowstalker

Lol, don't flatter pbrower by elevating him several tiers to the level of Snowstalker.

[Fuzzy Bear]

(Huckabee) could just be ignoring it like all the sane Republicans.

Huckabee can't ignore this because he knows the Duggars; they are friends and allies.  I suspect he concluded, friendship aside, that it was better to get his comments out early, rather than have this thing hashed out 2 days before meaningful voting starts.  It's a lot better that Huckabee, himself, addresses this issue.  If he didn't, it would be addressed for him, and then he wouldn't look good no matter what was said or done.

[pbrower2a]

Believing in redemption is scandalous.  It has always been thus.

It's fine to believe in redemption, but Huckabee goes out of his way to defend these people solely because of their Christianity. I don't believe he would be talking about redemption if this were some random child molester.


Yes, there is nothing wrong with redemption.  Being a Christian means hoping that all might one day be redeemed.  When it comes to child sex crimes and premeditated murderers, however, the perpetrators will have to seek redemption in the next world.  Not because they are inherently irredeemable, but because of public safety.    

Redemption doesn't mean that you don't have to face legal penalties.  It means that you are not defined by what you did, that you are not forever judged for it as being unworthy of respect and incapable of goodness.  If you do not believe that people can change and learn and grow from what they did in their youth, then you do not believe in redemption.

Redemption is not without a price -- namely, taking the worldly penalties (including shame, pain, imprisonment, and financial ruin) that one accepts if redemption is genuine.

A murderer is still a murderer in our world. A thief is still a thief in our world. A rapist is still a rapist in our world. If one accepts Christianity as true, then even being burned at the stake is a minor payment for eternal salvation.

What kind of weird theology claims that being burned at the stake could be payment for salvation?  The idea that a person cannot be redeemed from sin if they do not suffer criminal penalties, or that they should live their entire lives being shamed by those around them for what they did completely misses the role of grace. Christianity is not "you deserve forgiveness if you suffer enough or what you did isn't that bad."

For the unbeliever, Christ is nothing more than a new Kevin Trudeau, promising something too good to be true.  Works-based plans of salvation make more sense to people at one level, and I include many folks who profess to be "Christians" in this because it seems unfair that a murderer/child molester, or someone as awful as a Hitler or a Stalin could have a deathbed revelation and truly accept Christ and receive an eternal reward and be forever in the same Heaven that a "good person" goes to.  The real attraction to works-based plans of salvation is that it seems to offer folks some control over their eternity.  ("I can be good and make the cut!") 

I recall seeing an account an incident related to the trial of Adolf Eichmann. A Christian evangelist went to Jerusalem. A Jew asked what the evangelist was there to save, and the evangelist replied "Eichmann".

The same Jew asked, "but what of all my relatives that he killed?"

The evangelist said, "They are in Hell for not accepting Jesus as Lord and Savior".

Another Jew said, "So I will be content to go to Hell where my relatives are, and you can be with your pervert forever!"

... All in all I find the Jewish promise of Heaven to all righteous people far more satisfying for humanity as a whole than any credal toadying limited to any single culture. That is a far better hope than almost any other religion can offer.

1. This never happened
2. This is a total misrepresentation of Christianity
3. This is actually a disgusting post on the level of Snowstalker

I read the story... I forget where.

It's the evangelist who almost certainly misrepresented Christianity.

If there really is a hell, it is not so horrible because of any climatic extremes, offensive scenery, vile smells, or cacophonous sounds. It would be the souls there. Who'd want to be where Geoffrey Dahmer is?

 

[Maxwell]

I believe that if Mike Huckabee had done the opposite of what he did; if he had lambasted Josh Duggar for his actions, and lambasted his father for not reporting this matter to authorities immediately upon discovery, he'd be lambasted by the same people for not being forgiving.  There would be references as to how "hypocritical" he was and how "judgmental" he was by the same people pillorying him now.  They'd be pointing out Scripture on forgiveness and painting Huckabee as a judgmental, condemning religious fanantic.

Not true. If Huckabee condemned Josh Duggar, then he'd be doing what everyone else is - calling out a child molester for molesting children. That's totally outside of reality.

[○∙◄☻¥tπ[╪AV┼cVê└]

Doesn't the body just shut down when it's legitimate child molestation?

[Mechaman]

He does have a history of defending deplorable figures. The article describes a perfect case where he wanted a rapist free and, sure enough, he raped and murdered someone else. He seems to show compassion for, in particular, males who commit horrible sexual acts.

Joke candidate.

Yes, mostly this.

I don't think the issue is really about how we should view the Duggar kid (some peeps on here seem to forget the BUT DO NOT FORGET part of that saying about forgiveness), but about Huckabee's not so good history of character judgements.

If I were the GOP I'd get the hell away from the Huck.

[pbrower2a]

Child molestation is damnable and inexcusable. Children need to develop some wholesome trust in humanity as a whole, and child sexual abuse utterly destroys such trust.

Children of a certain age (latency) have no interest in sex. Sex can only hurt them; they cannot enjoy it. I think that we can all agree on this: adults must repress any urge to mess with a child sexually. This is an absolute, and there are no excuses.  Not alcohol or drugs, and certainly not religion.

[Mechaman]

For the Arkansas politicos out there, apparently Jim Holt, twice candidate for Senate and Republican nominee against good 'ole Blanche Lincoln in 2004 knew about the molestation and blamed Josh Duggar's sinfulness for his defeat in 2004. Apparently Holt's daughter is the same age as Josh, and they were betrothed at the time at the ripe age of 14. The betrothal was obviously broken off at some point. This story is just so f [Inks]ed up.

Ftr, I lold

[Sprouts Farmers Market ✘]

Child molestation is damnable and inexcusable. Children need to develop some wholesome trust in humanity as a whole, and child sexual abuse utterly destroys such trust.

Children of a certain age (latency) have no interest in sex. Sex can only hurt them; they cannot enjoy it. I think that we can all agree on this: adults must repress any urge to mess with a child sexually. This is an absolute, and there are no excuses.  Not alcohol or drugs, and certainly not religion.

I'm probably digging myself into a hole here considering this forum, but it's a bit excusable for a 14 year old, especially one who was growing up in a household like this that doesn't know any better because of how closed off some topics must be. And honestly that goes for probably anyone of that age. Not denying the results can be horrific, but we're not talking about a 27 year old man doing this.

[Fuzzy Bear]

Child molestation is damnable and inexcusable. Children need to develop some wholesome trust in humanity as a whole, and child sexual abuse utterly destroys such trust.

Children of a certain age (latency) have no interest in sex. Sex can only hurt them; they cannot enjoy it. I think that we can all agree on this: adults must repress any urge to mess with a child sexually. This is an absolute, and there are no excuses.  Not alcohol or drugs, and certainly not religion.

I'm probably digging myself into a hole here considering this forum, but it's a bit excusable for a 14 year old, especially one who was growing up in a household like this that doesn't know any better because of how closed off some topics must be. And honestly that goes for probably anyone of that age. Not denying the results can be horrific, but we're not talking about a 27 year old man doing this.

http://www.criminaldefenselawyer.com/resources/expunging-or-sealing-a-juvenile-court-record-arkansas

I think that Jim Bob Duggar was in a real "Sophie's Choice" situation, and, yes, I agree that the fact that Josh Duggar was 14 years old at the time is relevant in determining the right and wrong here of the response.  If it's true that what has been revealed is the extent of such activities by Josh Duggar and that there have not been any other instances or any other victims, then Jim Bob Duggar was able to both protect his daughters from further harm and save his son from Draconian penalties that may well not have been appropriate in his case.

In retrospect, Jim Bob would have been better off calling the cops right away.  Josh would have had an expunged record by now, according to Arkansas law.  Now, of course, his deeds will live on forever in the media, and no one, not even the victims, will have any control of the media frenzy over this.

I'm not going to pretend I know how this would have been handled in a perfect world.  In a perfect world, these awful events would not have happened.  But I will note that very few of those who are excoriating Jim Bob Duggar and Mike Huckabee here could care less about the victims.  They are mainly concerned with politics and with their resentments toward Fundamentalist Christianity.  In that respect, Jim Bob Duggar gave folks a hammer that he, his son, and his Presidential candidate can all be beaten over the head with.  If this is therapeutic for the victims, I'm all for it, but somehow, I suspect that it may not be so.

[Fuzzy Bear]

Child molestation is damnable and inexcusable. Children need to develop some wholesome trust in humanity as a whole, and child sexual abuse utterly destroys such trust.

Children of a certain age (latency) have no interest in sex. Sex can only hurt them; they cannot enjoy it. I think that we can all agree on this: adults must repress any urge to mess with a child sexually. This is an absolute, and there are no excuses.  Not alcohol or drugs, and certainly not religion.

I'm probably digging myself into a hole here considering this forum, but it's a bit excusable for a 14 year old, especially one who was growing up in a household like this that doesn't know any better because of how closed off some topics must be. And honestly that goes for probably anyone of that age. Not denying the results can be horrific, but we're not talking about a 27 year old man doing this.

http://www.criminaldefenselawyer.com/resources/expunging-or-sealing-a-juvenile-court-record-arkansas

I think that Jim Bob Duggar was in a real "Sophie's Choice" situation, and, yes, I agree that the fact that Josh Duggar was 14 years old at the time is relevant in determining the right and wrong here of the response.  If it's true that what has been revealed is the extent of such activities by Josh Duggar and that there have not been any other instances or any other victims, then Jim Bob Duggar was able to both protect his daughters from further harm and save his son from Draconian penalties that may well not have been appropriate in his case.  If there's more; if there are more victims, or more instances against the same victims after Josh Duggar came home from his "work therapy", that's another story, but there's no indication that this is the case at this time.  Yes, Josh Duggar could turn into the next Bill Cosby, but until he does, the situation needs to be viewed in light of the facts out there.

In retrospect, Jim Bob would have been better off calling the cops right away.  Josh would have had an expunged record by now, according to Arkansas law.  Now, of course, his deeds will live on forever in the media, and no one, not even the victims, will have any control of the media frenzy over this.

I'm not going to pretend I know how this would have been handled in a perfect world.  In a perfect world, these awful events would not have happened.  But I will note that very few of those who are excoriating Jim Bob Duggar and Mike Huckabee here could care less about the victims.  They are mainly concerned with politics and with their resentments toward Fundamentalist Christianity.  In that respect, Jim Bob Duggar gave folks a hammer that he, his son, and his Presidential candidate can all be beaten over the head with.  If this is therapeutic for the victims, I'm all for it, but somehow, I suspect that it may not be so.

[afleitch]

I'm probably digging myself into a hole here considering this forum, but it's a bit excusable for a 14 year old, especially one who was growing up in a household like this that doesn't know any better because of how closed off some topics must be. And honestly that goes for probably anyone of that age. Not denying the results can be horrific, but we're not talking about a 27 year old man doing this.

So it's excusable for a certain type of evangelical Christianity to so fundamentally ill prepare a teenager as to make that teenager think it's okay to molest girls and for the family to think it's okay to deal with such matters 'internally'?

If that's the case, then their faith is worth f-ck all.

[YaBoyNY]

Child molestation is damnable and inexcusable. Children need to develop some wholesome trust in humanity as a whole, and child sexual abuse utterly destroys such trust.

Children of a certain age (latency) have no interest in sex. Sex can only hurt them; they cannot enjoy it. I think that we can all agree on this: adults must repress any urge to mess with a child sexually. This is an absolute, and there are no excuses.  Not alcohol or drugs, and certainly not religion.

I'm probably digging myself into a hole here considering this forum, but it's a bit excusable for a 14 year old, especially one who was growing up in a household like this that doesn't know any better because of how closed off some topics must be. And honestly that goes for probably anyone of that age. Not denying the results can be horrific, but we're not talking about a 27 year old man doing this.

http://www.criminaldefenselawyer.com/resources/expunging-or-sealing-a-juvenile-court-record-arkansas

I think that Jim Bob Duggar was in a real "Sophie's Choice" situation, and, yes, I agree that the fact that Josh Duggar was 14 years old at the time is relevant in determining the right and wrong here of the response.  If it's true that what has been revealed is the extent of such activities by Josh Duggar and that there have not been any other instances or any other victims, then Jim Bob Duggar was able to both protect his daughters from further harm and save his son from Draconian penalties that may well not have been appropriate in his case.  If there's more; if there are more victims, or more instances against the same victims after Josh Duggar came home from his "work therapy", that's another story, but there's no indication that this is the case at this time.  Yes, Josh Duggar could turn into the next Bill Cosby, but until he does, the situation needs to be viewed in light of the facts out there.

In retrospect, Jim Bob would have been better off calling the cops right away.  Josh would have had an expunged record by now, according to Arkansas law.  Now, of course, his deeds will live on forever in the media, and no one, not even the victims, will have any control of the media frenzy over this.

I'm not going to pretend I know how this would have been handled in a perfect world.  In a perfect world, these awful events would not have happened.  But I will note that very few of those who are excoriating Jim Bob Duggar and Mike Huckabee here could care less about the victims.  They are mainly concerned with politics and with their resentments toward Fundamentalist Christianity.  In that respect, Jim Bob Duggar gave folks a hammer that he, his son, and his Presidential candidate can all be beaten over the head with.  If this is therapeutic for the victims, I'm all for it, but somehow, I suspect that it may not be so.

This isn't even about politics. If a Democrat did this I'd be saying the same thing. Most of the people giving them hell do give a damn about the victims. That anybody is defending either Duggar or Huckabe is despicable and disgusting. There is no excuse.

[Fuzzy Bear]

Child molestation is damnable and inexcusable. Children need to develop some wholesome trust in humanity as a whole, and child sexual abuse utterly destroys such trust.

Children of a certain age (latency) have no interest in sex. Sex can only hurt them; they cannot enjoy it. I think that we can all agree on this: adults must repress any urge to mess with a child sexually. This is an absolute, and there are no excuses.  Not alcohol or drugs, and certainly not religion.

I'm probably digging myself into a hole here considering this forum, but it's a bit excusable for a 14 year old, especially one who was growing up in a household like this that doesn't know any better because of how closed off some topics must be. And honestly that goes for probably anyone of that age. Not denying the results can be horrific, but we're not talking about a 27 year old man doing this.

http://www.criminaldefenselawyer.com/resources/expunging-or-sealing-a-juvenile-court-record-arkansas

I think that Jim Bob Duggar was in a real "Sophie's Choice" situation, and, yes, I agree that the fact that Josh Duggar was 14 years old at the time is relevant in determining the right and wrong here of the response.  If it's true that what has been revealed is the extent of such activities by Josh Duggar and that there have not been any other instances or any other victims, then Jim Bob Duggar was able to both protect his daughters from further harm and save his son from Draconian penalties that may well not have been appropriate in his case.  If there's more; if there are more victims, or more instances against the same victims after Josh Duggar came home from his "work therapy", that's another story, but there's no indication that this is the case at this time.  Yes, Josh Duggar could turn into the next Bill Cosby, but until he does, the situation needs to be viewed in light of the facts out there.

In retrospect, Jim Bob would have been better off calling the cops right away.  Josh would have had an expunged record by now, according to Arkansas law.  Now, of course, his deeds will live on forever in the media, and no one, not even the victims, will have any control of the media frenzy over this.

I'm not going to pretend I know how this would have been handled in a perfect world.  In a perfect world, these awful events would not have happened.  But I will note that very few of those who are excoriating Jim Bob Duggar and Mike Huckabee here could care less about the victims.  They are mainly concerned with politics and with their resentments toward Fundamentalist Christianity.  In that respect, Jim Bob Duggar gave folks a hammer that he, his son, and his Presidential candidate can all be beaten over the head with.  If this is therapeutic for the victims, I'm all for it, but somehow, I suspect that it may not be so.

This isn't even about politics. If a Democrat did this I'd be saying the same thing. Most of the people giving them hell do give a damn about the victims. That anybody is defending either Duggar or Huckabe is despicable and disgusting. There is no excuse.

Sure, it's about politics.  Rep. Gerry Studds (D-MA) had sex with an underage male Congressional Page, and was merely censured by the Democratic House.  He was unrepentant, and his Democratic district continued to re-elect him through the mid-1990s. 

From Wikipedia:  http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gerry_Studds

You must be logged in to read this quote.

Rep. Daniel Crane (R-IN) was also found to be having sex with an underage female page; he was ridden out on a rail by the voters in the 1984 elections.  Studds, on the other hand, became the Chairman of the Merchant Marine and Fisheries committee in 1990, a chair he had his eye set on for a long, long time.

If Josh Duggar, and Jim Bob Duggar, and Mike Huckabee, and anyone else in their set took a look at the Gerry Studds matter and how it played out, they'd we wondering what the deal is.  Studds weathered some flak, but recovered it all, and even blew the underage victim off as having consented.  Now two wrongs don't make a right, but please don't tell me that this isn't about a combination of partisan politics and generalized resentment for Evangelicals.

I do wonder how many people weighing in here are actually PARENTS.  Not that not being a parent invalidates ones opinion, but I wonder what the PARENTS in this forum would ACTUALLY do (and not hypothetically do) if they were in a similar situation where they had to make this kind of choice.  Jim Bob Duggar's TV act may wear thin with me, but his real-world dilemma has my empathy, and while I don't believe I'd have handled the situation as he did, I'd be taking into account that my son, in that situation, was only 14 years old, and a child, himself.  When you divorce the politics of this and put yourself in the position of a PARENT in that situation, you can begin to understand the kind of crushing pressure the most unselfish of parents would be under in such a situation.

[WVdemocrat]

-snip-

That's the 1983 House of Representatives. Democrats on Atlas, spoiler alert, were not members of that Congress. We have the potential to disagree with them.

Legally speaking, I don't believe either of those liaisons were illegal, but they should be frowned upon, for the fact that the pages were underage.

On Huckabee, it's disgusting that he defends this man. Personally, I believe in the possibility for redemption, but this man and his family completely bypassed the legal process. They thought they were above the law. They thought it was okay that they deal with their son molesting girls  internally. That's wrong. Huckabee only defends him because of his generous donations.

It is nothing more than that, and it is pathetic.

[Fuzzy Bear]

-snip-

That the 1983 House of Representatives. Democrats on Atlas, spoiler alert, were not members of that Congress. We have the potential to disagree with them.

Legally speaking, I don't believe either of those liaisons were illegal, but they should be frowned upon, for the fact that the pages were underage.

On Huckabee, it's disgusting that he defends this man. Personally, I believe in the possibility for redemption, but this man and his family completely bypassed the legal process. They thought they were above the law. They thought it was okay that they deal with their son molesting girls  internally. That's wrong. Huckabee only defends him because of his generous donations.

It is nothing more than that, and it is pathetic.

The law did not require Jim Bob Duggar to report this, from what I have read.  Whether he should have done so, and done so in a timeframe of less than the 1 year he took before he did it is another matter, and a moral question.  That he did not sent his son to an actual therapy program (where the therapist would likely have been a mandatory reporter of some sort) is another aspect of the affair that I question.   

But if, in fact, Josh Duggar came home from wherever it was that he was sent, never inappropriately touched anyone ever again, there are no more victims or instances of victimization that remain unrevealed, and the Duggar daughters are TRULY satisfied with the final outcome of all of this, then is it not possible that the best possible outcome for all did actually come about?  For all of my questions, I can't honestly say that it didn't.  And while I'm not down with Huckabee on everything by a long shot, friendship ought to mean not publicly tossing your friend overboard just because it may be expedient to do so.  Huckabee isn't responsible for the matter in any way, and standing by a friend under fire (even deserved fire) is something most of us would hope for in our friends.

[WVdemocrat]

-snip-

That the 1983 House of Representatives. Democrats on Atlas, spoiler alert, were not members of that Congress. We have the potential to disagree with them.

Legally speaking, I don't believe either of those liaisons were illegal, but they should be frowned upon, for the fact that the pages were underage.

On Huckabee, it's disgusting that he defends this man. Personally, I believe in the possibility for redemption, but this man and his family completely bypassed the legal process. They thought they were above the law. They thought it was okay that they deal with their son molesting girls  internally. That's wrong. Huckabee only defends him because of his generous donations.

It is nothing more than that, and it is pathetic.

The law did not require Jim Bob Duggar to report this, from what I have read.  Whether he should have done so, and done so in a timeframe of less than the 1 year he took before he did it is another matter, and a moral question.  That he did not sent his son to an actual therapy program (where the therapist would likely have been a mandatory reporter of some sort) is another aspect of the affair that I question.   

But if, in fact, Josh Duggar came home from wherever it was that he was sent, never inappropriately touched anyone ever again, there are no more victims or instances of victimization that remain unrevealed, and the Duggar daughters are TRULY satisfied with the final outcome of all of this, then is it not possible that the best possible outcome for all did actually come about?  For all of my questions, I can't honestly say that it didn't.  And while I'm not down with Huckabee on everything by a long shot, friendship ought to mean not publicly tossing your friend overboard just because it may be expedient to do so.  Huckabee isn't responsible for the matter in any way, and standing by a friend under fire (even deserved fire) is something most of us would hope for in our friends.

I find it disgusting that they decided that they didn't have to go through legal processes. They could have gone to a trial, and pleaded for counseling and probation rather than prison time, but they didn't. The Duggar family is not a court of law. We are a nation of laws. They had no right to deal with it the way they did.

[○∙◄☻¥tπ[╪AV┼cVê└]

He could just be ignoring it like all the sane Republicans.

It's easy for the empty set to ignore it.

[🐒Gods of Prosperity🔱🐲💸]

I'm probably digging myself into a hole here considering this forum, but it's a bit excusable for a 14 year old, especially one who was growing up in a household like this that doesn't know any better because of how closed off some topics must be. And honestly that goes for probably anyone of that age. Not denying the results can be horrific, but we're not talking about a 27 year old man doing this.

So it's excusable for a certain type of evangelical Christianity to so fundamentally ill prepare a teenager as to make that teenager think it's okay to molest girls and for the family to think it's okay to deal with such matters 'internally'?

If that's the case, then their faith is worth f-ck all.

Have you ever counseled a parent whose child has committed sexual abuse?

[pbrower2a]

I'm probably digging myself into a hole here considering this forum, but it's a bit excusable for a 14 year old, especially one who was growing up in a household like this that doesn't know any better because of how closed off some topics must be. And honestly that goes for probably anyone of that age. Not denying the results can be horrific, but we're not talking about a 27 year old man doing this.

So it's excusable for a certain type of evangelical Christianity to so fundamentally ill prepare a teenager as to make that teenager think it's okay to molest girls and for the family to think it's okay to deal with such matters 'internally'?

If that's the case, then their faith is worth f-ck all.

Have you ever counseled a parent whose child has committed sexual abuse?

I can imagine the contradictions of guilt and denial.

Fundamentalist Christians can be good people -- so long as they toe the line consistently. But if I were a brilliant girl brought up as Rachel Dolezal was I would find some way to escape through some cultural rebellion.  There are so many tempting alternatives -- from secularism to alternative expressions of fundamentalism (in the latter, Islam is the most blatant. alternative to Christian fundamentalism).

Her big rebellion was not in cutting ties to the white race; her rebellion was in finding secularism. 

That is the safest. But in view of the fundamentalist view that humanity is inherently depraved I can understand some of the more dangerous forms of rebellion -- like the depravity of crime, including sex offenses. 

[Likely Voter]

Quick update. Huck's pal Josh was revealed as an adulterer in the Ashley Madison hack.  He issued a statement admitting it and more

You must be logged in to read this quote.

 

[Fuzzy Bear]

Quick update. Huck's pal Josh was revealed as an adulterer in the Ashley Madison hack.  He issued a statement admitting it and more

You must be logged in to read this quote.

 

Josh is a mess, but he's more forthright than Jim Bob.

[/]

LOL imagine if Hillary did this