Greek Referendum on IMF/Troika deal

[jaichind]

Those Greeks know how to count their votes quickly. 25% counted already.

Too bad the rest of the economy is not as efficient.

[RogueBeaver]

Interior Ministry projects 61/39 NO.

[Tetro Kornbluth]

Ag, how are you seeing results from places like Sparta - the lowest level I can get is Electoral District?

[ObserverIE]

Well its safe to say that 'No' is going to win, the only question is by how much?

Pretty much.  This is very surprising to me.  I guess this really turned into a vote against a national unity government which lets ND and PASOK back in.  

Having Brussels sources announce that they considered a newly-elected government unacceptable and they wanted a more compliant replacement was always f***ing stupid and counter-productive. (Particularly given that this is a Brussels that puts up with Viktor Orban without complaint.)

But then, "stupid and counter-productive" describes so much of what has come from Brussels over the last seven years.

[Antonio the Sixth]

Good for the Greek people. If the austericrats refuse to heed this message, they will have to bear the responsibility of kicking Greece out.

[ag]

Ag, how are you seeing results from places like Sparta - the lowest level I can get is Electoral District?

Once you go into the electoral district, there is another menu for municipality, and then a menu for municipal segment.

[Phony Moderate]

Yes might pull through after the provisional ballots are counted.

[ag]

Good for the Greek people. If the austericrats refuse to heed this message, they will have to bear the responsibility of kicking Greece out.

Greek people have freely and without interference voted to get out of the euro. Their voice should be heard.

The European partners should help with printing the drachma: they might have trouble to finding a printer to do it on credit otherwise.

[ag]

Yes might pull through after the provisional ballots are counted.

Have you looked at the actual results? Or are you suggesting they are refusing to count the "yes" votes?

[jaichind]

If the margin of victory is large which it seems like it will, it will give the ammo for  Tsipras to  take a even less conciliatory stance.  This will complicate things since the previous bailout expired there will be more complicated procedures to get the new bailout started.  For example, the German Bundestag first has to authorize the German government to enter into negotiations that might create new liabilities for the ESM.  Anyway, if pushed by Tsipras, the Bundestag will respond with "release the Kraken"  For this not to blowup Tsipras has to make a humbling speech asking for a new deal and show willingness to compromise.  Of else it will be as predicted, exit of Greece from Euro.

[Phony Moderate]

Yes might pull through after the provisional ballots are counted.

Have you looked at the actual results? Or are you suggesting they are refusing to count the "yes" votes?

It was a joke: think 2004.

[jaichind]

Yes might pull through after the provisional ballots are counted.

Have you looked at the actual results? Or are you suggesting they are refusing to count the "yes" votes?

I think he meant this a joke trying to tie in the Ohio 2004 Prez election saga.

[RogueBeaver]

Guardian saying demand is growing in ND for Samaras' resignation as leader.

[ag]

Guardian saying demand is growing in ND for Samaras' resignation as leader.

This should have been done in January.

[jaichind]

Guardian saying demand is growing in ND for Samaras' resignation as leader.

This should have been done in January.

Yeah.  To think he could have prevented this whole series of disasters if he only compromised last year on the Prez candidate.

[Antonio the Sixth]

Good for the Greek people. If the austericrats refuse to heed this message, they will have to bear the responsibility of kicking Greece out.

Greek people have freely and without interference voted to get out of the euro. Their voice should be heard.

No, the Greeks have said that they will not bend to any conditions to stay in the Euro. They will be out if they are forced to by the draconian and absurd conditions imposed by Lagarde and Schaeuble.

[Diouf]

Quite expected result.

Basically the Icesaver referendum all over again. Do we want to pay our debt? NO!

[RogueBeaver]

CSU general secretary: "it is clear that the blackmailer and liar to voters cannot force through his dirty promises." Sounds friendly.

[Beezer]

So does this strengthen or weaken Tsipras' position? I'd say it's the latter since the creditors now realize that their demands will never be met by a Greek government so it's sensible to just cut their losses and let Greece default and exit.

[ag]

Good for the Greek people. If the austericrats refuse to heed this message, they will have to bear the responsibility of kicking Greece out.

Greek people have freely and without interference voted to get out of the euro. Their voice should be heard.

No, the Greeks have said that they will not bend to any conditions to stay in the Euro. They will be out if they are forced to by the draconian and absurd conditions imposed by Lagarde and Schaeuble.

They knew, even these conditions were, probably, no longer on the table. They knew, that voting "no" means the banks can never reopen issuing euro. They voted. This is their free will, and democracy has to be respected. Doing anything else would be going against the freely expressed democratic will of the Greek people.

[ag]

So does this strengthen or weaken Tsipras' position? I'd say it's the latter since the creditors now realize that their demands will never be met by a Greek government so it's sensible to just cut their losses and let Greece default and exit.

Tsipras's personal position, as the Greek PM, is, obviously, strengthened. And, as for the negotiations, I am afraid they are now dead, so no issue of "strengthening or weakening" left.

[jaichind]

Early trading has EUR down 1.25% against USD.

[jaichind]

So does this strengthen or weaken Tsipras' position? I'd say it's the latter since the creditors now realize that their demands will never be met by a Greek government so it's sensible to just cut their losses and let Greece default and exit.

Tsipras's personal position, as the Greek PM, is, obviously, strengthened. And, as for the negotiations, I am afraid they are now dead, so no issue of "strengthening or weakening" left.

The Greek Labor Minister seems to disagree.  He just said that now Greece’s govt now has strong mandate to go seal deal with creditors.  Question is, what sort of deal ?

[ag]

So does this strengthen or weaken Tsipras' position? I'd say it's the latter since the creditors now realize that their demands will never be met by a Greek government so it's sensible to just cut their losses and let Greece default and exit.

Tsipras's personal position, as the Greek PM, is, obviously, strengthened. And, as for the negotiations, I am afraid they are now dead, so no issue of "strengthening or weakening" left.

The Greek Labor Minister seems to disagree.  He just said that now Greece’s govt now has strong mandate to go seal deal with creditors.  Question is, what sort of deal ?

Arrangements for a German printing press printing the drachma, obviously.

[Cubby]

I supported Tsipras and opposed Austerity a few weeks ago but I've changed my mind. I really hope the Greeks vote Yes, although that is starting to look unlikely.

I don't want to see the whole European Union and Euro to collapse over one man's intransigence.

I feel remorse for ever having supported Syriza, although I don't like that the Troika seems to be using this referendum as an excuse to remove a democratically elected government that they don't like.