Will Obama be remembered in the top 10 of Presidents?

[Blue3]

Will Obama be remembered in the top 10 of Presidents?

I'm thinking Yes. The progress and accomplishments of his presidency so far, while not perfect, are understated so far, as well as the lack of real scandals. That, combined with how Presidents usually look better in hindsight, and I think we have a Top 10 President. Especially with what he was walking into when he started his first term.

[🦀🎂🦀🎂]

Yes certainly, although that  be testament to the lousiness of the vast majority of Presidents more than anything.

Personally I see him as a top five POTUS, above Truman, Kennedy, Eisenhower and Arthur, but below Jefferson, FDR, Lincoln and Washington.

[The Dowager Mod]

Nah, Top 20 maybe.

[Beet]

Too soon to tell. He's still got 18 months left.

[JerryArkansas]

No, he is going to be remembered probably as having a mixed record.  He should be on the lines of a Coolidge, or a McKinley.  Not amazing, but not too bad.

[Attorney General, LGC Speaker, and Former PPT Dwarven Dragon]

No, he is going to be remembered probably as having a mixed record.  He should be on the lines of a Coolidge, or a McKinley.  Not amazing, but not too bad.

[pbrower2a]

Let's start by the toughest standard: George Washington, Abraham Lincoln, and FDR became President with America severely divided and in great danger; their Presidencies ended with America much more united and with the danger gone or practically gone. At that standard, Obama isn't even close. He is in that league if Americans fully repudiate the anti-Obama agenda of the other Party in 2016. That is asking for the nearly-impossible.

He rightly gets credit for undoing the economic meltdown that began with the bungling of his predecessor without starting an economic bubble. He gets credit for whacking the perpetrator of the worst incidents of terrorism against America.  Terrorism against American citizens has again proved a poor way to get to bask long in personal (if perverse) glory. If Democrats could remind others that "General Motors is alive and Osama bin Laden is dead"...  that's good.

America remains politically polarized -- almost as badly as Spain was on the brink of the Spanish Civil War. But such is the choice of tycoons who see that as the second-best choice, the best being that those tycoons have America operating in servile lockstep. President Obama rescued American capitalism by rescuing capitalists -- even if those capitalists would stab him in the back.

He did not solve every problem... but he gets us the Affordable Care Act. Is it perfect? No. But after it has come into effect it seems unassailable.  

There are two peace-time Presidents (I do not consider Tr4uman a peacetime President) who achieved much as President, leaving an indelible mark upon America. Jefferson did one thing that heavily defines America -- the Louisiana Purchase; he also kept America out of a European war that could have brought only harm to America. Theodore Roosevelt is by far the best President between Lincoln and FDR for a series of huge, humanizing reforms that have long been unassailable. Obama got only a short window of opportunity for reforms that he wanted... but he got most of them achieved.

Truman inherited the best possible post-war situation near its end. You cannot argue with his conduct of the last days of World War II in Europe... and even if one questions the use of the atom bomb on Hiroshima and Nagasaki... the Japanese government was not showing any willingness to surrender.  

So -- Washington, Lincoln, FDR --- 1, 2, and 3... take your choice.
Jefferson, TR, and Truman --- 4, 5, and 6... take your choice.  

I'll give Eisenhower #7 for the Interstate Highway System, giving a conservative rationale for desegregation, ending the Korean War without 'losing' South Korea, and letting the dangerous demagogue Joseph McCarthy implode rather than jumping on the bandwagon. I see Obama having much the same virtues as Eisenhower -- caution, integrity, and respect for legal niceties. But ACA can save lives as can expressways that supplant the infamous Blood Alleys of the 1950s.

I fault Ike for letting the CIA make short-term choices to depose Arbenz in Guatemala and Mossadegh in Iran... America would pay for both decisions. But such was not obvious at the time.



#8 through #10 are more difficult. Sure, Jackson redefined American politics forever... but he also gave America the Trail of Tears and the expansion of slavery.  Polk annexed lands between Texas and the Pacific -- but such more reflects the weakness of Mexico than personal greatness.

President Obama can still do something catastrophically wrong that sends him to the bottom of the list. But based upon what he has done so far -- if he were struck by lightning today he would be well above average. Many positives and very few negatives.  

  

[Stand With Israel. Crush Hamas]

No, his accomplishments are far too partisan and he didn't guide America through a crisis like the absolute top tier. In addition, almost all of his accomplishments are heavily dependent on how they look in 10-20 years, and he still stands the chance of being a bottom ten President is he ramrods through a deal with Iran that amounts to complete surrender.

[Warren 4 Secretary of Everything]

No, his accomplishments are far too partisan and he didn't guide America through a crisis like the absolute top tier. In addition, almost all of his accomplishments are heavily dependent on how they look in 10-20 years, and he still stands the chance of being a bottom ten President is he ramrods through a deal with Iran that amounts to complete surrender.

Because the Great Recession never happened

[Stand With Israel. Crush Hamas]

No, his accomplishments are far too partisan and he didn't guide America through a crisis like the absolute top tier. In addition, almost all of his accomplishments are heavily dependent on how they look in 10-20 years, and he still stands the chance of being a bottom ten President is he ramrods through a deal with Iran that amounts to complete surrender.

Because the Great Recession never happened

The vast majority of Americans weren't personally affected by the great recession. It is to the Great Depression what Afghanistan/Iraq is to WW2.

The bailouts and fixes that minimized the damage began under Bush and continued under Obama. While his handling of the economy was competent enough to keep the damage from worsening, it's not like he's credited with saving the US economy.

The one big accomplishment everyone can give him is Bin Laden.

[🦀🎂🦀🎂]

I would say the damage to done to America's international standing and reputation under Bush could be categorised as a crisis itself.

[Oswald Acted Alone, You Kook]

Historians currently rank him at about 17. Which means the following presidents are better than Obama:

Monroe
Reagan
LBJ
Madison
Adams
Polk
JFK
Eisenhower
Truman
Wilson
Jefferson
Both Roosevelts
Washington
Lincoln

I'm comfortable saying that most of these guys are better.

[Mr. Illini]

He will be remembered a lot like Reagan is. Same with FDR.

Loved by his side, hated by the other.

[🦀🎂🦀🎂]

Historians currently rank him at about 17. Which means the following presidents are better than Obama:

Monroe
Reagan
LBJ
Madison
Adams
Polk
JFK
Eisenhower
Truman
Wilson
Jefferson
Both Roosevelts
Washington
Lincoln

I'm comfortable saying that most of these guys are better.

Most of them are ultimately pretty medicore or vile, when you get down to it.

[Oswald Acted Alone, You Kook]

Historians currently rank him at about 17. Which means the following presidents are better than Obama:

Monroe
Reagan
LBJ
Madison
Adams
Polk
JFK
Eisenhower
Truman
Wilson
Jefferson
Both Roosevelts
Washington
Lincoln

I'm comfortable saying that most of these guys are better.

Most of them are ultimately pretty medicore or vile, when you get down to it.

In general or compared to Obama?

[Skill and Chance]

Historians currently rank him at about 17. Which means the following presidents are better than Obama:

Monroe
Reagan
LBJ
Madison
Adams
Polk
JFK
Eisenhower
Truman
Wilson
Jefferson
Both Roosevelts
Washington
Lincoln

I'm comfortable saying that most of these guys are better.

Vomit.  Why isn't he in the bottom five?  
1. unnecessary foreign war
2. incompetent idealism on League of Nations
3. economic recession at end of 2nd term
4. very racist even by the standards of his time.

And don't give him credit for women's suffrage- he didn't even support it until after his reelection when it was basically inevitable.

[CountryClassSF]

In terms of policy enactments for his party, yes.  Which is why Rush had it right when he said he hoped Obama failed.  

He'll also be remembered in the top 10 in terms of health care premium costs.

He is the most divisive President of our lifetimes, never have I seen a leader villify his opposition so much

[DC Al Fine]

Historians currently rank him at about 17. Which means the following presidents are better than Obama:

Monroe
Reagan
LBJ
Madison
Adams
Polk
JFK
Eisenhower
Truman
Wilson
Jefferson
Both Roosevelts
Washington
Lincoln

I'm comfortable saying that most of these guys are better.

Vomit.  Why isn't he in the bottom five?  
1. unnecessary foreign war
2. incompetent idealism on League of Nations
3. economic recession at end of 2nd term
4. very racist even by the standards of his time.

And don't give him credit for women's suffrage- he didn't even support it until after his reelection when it was basically inevitable.

Historians have a major hard on for Wilson. It's just one of those weird facts of life.

[Famous Mortimer]

No, his accomplishments are far too partisan and he didn't guide America through a crisis like the absolute top tier. In addition, almost all of his accomplishments are heavily dependent on how they look in 10-20 years, and he still stands the chance of being a bottom ten President is he ramrods through a deal with Iran that amounts to complete surrender.

Because the Great Recession never happened

The vast majority of Americans weren't personally affected by the great recession. It is to the Great Depression what Afghanistan/Iraq is to WW2.

lolwut?

[🦀🎂🦀🎂]

Historians currently rank him at about 17. Which means the following presidents are better than Obama:

Monroe
Reagan
LBJ
Madison
Adams
Polk
JFK
Eisenhower
Truman
Wilson
Jefferson
Both Roosevelts
Washington
Lincoln

I'm comfortable saying that most of these guys are better.

Vomit.  Why isn't he in the bottom five?  
1. unnecessary foreign war
2. incompetent idealism on League of Nations
3. economic recession at end of 2nd term
4. very racist even by the standards of his time.

And don't give him credit for women's suffrage- he didn't even support it until after his reelection when it was basically inevitable.

Historians care more about "consequnciality" than sucess. You're right though, Wilson really was a crap.

[Penelope]

No, his accomplishments are far too partisan and he didn't guide America through a crisis like the absolute top tier. In addition, almost all of his accomplishments are heavily dependent on how they look in 10-20 years, and he still stands the chance of being a bottom ten President is he ramrods through a deal with Iran that amounts to complete surrender.

Because the Great Recession never happened

The vast majority of Americans weren't personally affected by the great recession.

LOL

[Brittain33]

Yes, very much so for domestic policy and economic policy, and for cultural change he will be associated with such as gay rights progress and growing U.S. diversity. Less so for foreign policy although he inherited an unholy mess and a country with no energy to stick with it... he wound down our involvements overseas and the results are not pretty.

[publicunofficial]

I think he'll be like the Democratic version of Reagan. Loved by liberals and independents, reviled by conservatives.

[Warren 4 Secretary of Everything]

No, his accomplishments are far too partisan and he didn't guide America through a crisis like the absolute top tier. In addition, almost all of his accomplishments are heavily dependent on how they look in 10-20 years, and he still stands the chance of being a bottom ten President is he ramrods through a deal with Iran that amounts to complete surrender.

Because the Great Recession never happened

The vast majority of Americans weren't personally affected by the great recession. It is to the Great Depression what Afghanistan/Iraq is to WW2.

All right, everybody! Gather around here, circle it up. Now, I know I'm pretty quick to point out other people's mistakes but...Ive graduated and I'm getting older now, and I realize that it's important to recognize when someone does something right. Rubio Republican came in here with what seemed like a basic and legitimate criticism of the President. But someone took the time to find out that really he'd been drinking and correctly diagnosed him with a case of the Trolly's Disease. Now, I'm sure some of your are gonna think this is a silly exercise, but I'd like that someone to step forward and stick your hand up in the air so that the Forum can recognize your great good work. This is no time to be modest. Come now.

---Waits---

Oh! My God! It was me! I did it, I'm a genius, I'm a huge brain in a ripped up body, I am Jesus H. Clinton1996... Troll Hunter extraordinaire. Now I'm gonna exit this thread, but not until people start chanting my name so that I can exit the room with my hands held high above my head in a victorious gesture. You see, this rational troll hunting machine, this fabulous thing? Well, it runs on accolades, so I'm going to need to hear it. Come now.

[Will of the People]

he is not speaking to Christians like myself what about Christians rights who get bullied and pushed around and harassed. etc. etc. i do not recognize this america anymore this america is a stranger to me.