Will Obama be remembered in the top 10 of Presidents? (user search)
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  Will Obama be remembered in the top 10 of Presidents? (search mode)
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Question: Will Obama be remembered in the top 10 of Presidents?
#1
Yes
#2
No
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Author Topic: Will Obama be remembered in the top 10 of Presidents?  (Read 12089 times)
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CrabCake
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« on: June 28, 2015, 03:09:08 PM »

Yes certainly, although that  be testament to the lousiness of the vast majority of Presidents more than anything.

Personally I see him as a top five POTUS, above Truman, Kennedy, Eisenhower and Arthur, but below Jefferson, FDR, Lincoln and Washington.
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CrabCake
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« Reply #1 on: June 28, 2015, 04:37:46 PM »

I would say the damage to done to America's international standing and reputation under Bush could be categorised as a crisis itself.
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CrabCake
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« Reply #2 on: June 28, 2015, 04:53:13 PM »

Historians currently rank him at about 17. Which means the following presidents are better than Obama:

Monroe
Reagan
LBJ
Madison
Adams
Polk
JFK
Eisenhower
Truman
Wilson
Jefferson
Both Roosevelts
Washington
Lincoln

I'm comfortable saying that most of these guys are better.


Most of them are ultimately pretty medicore or vile, when you get down to it.
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CrabCake
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« Reply #3 on: June 28, 2015, 05:20:03 PM »

Historians currently rank him at about 17. Which means the following presidents are better than Obama:

Monroe
Reagan
LBJ
Madison
Adams
Polk
JFK
Eisenhower
Truman
Wilson
Jefferson
Both Roosevelts
Washington
Lincoln

I'm comfortable saying that most of these guys are better.


Vomit.  Why isn't he in the bottom five?  
1. unnecessary foreign war
2. incompetent idealism on League of Nations
3. economic recession at end of 2nd term
4. very racist even by the standards of his time.

And don't give him credit for women's suffrage- he didn't even support it until after his reelection when it was basically inevitable.

Historians care more about "consequnciality" than sucess. You're right though, Wilson really was a crap.
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CrabCake
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« Reply #4 on: June 29, 2015, 06:32:40 AM »

Can I just say, I really appreciate your posts Leinad. It's nice to have a right-libertarian that is neither insane nor inane.

Anyway, Obama's legacy! What will really cement him as a great (or alternatively come up and wipe him out) are these next eighteen months. It's going to be interesting time, especially because of the Reprobate controlled Congress.

Obviously some issues will fall by the wayside. Healthcare is thankfully finished for this term. Obamacare will need amending, but now is not the time. Gun control is also dead in the water judging by his resigned comments on the issue after Charleston. Education has always been a weirdo issue for Obama. He has a few initiatives like Race to the Top (or whatever) and Common Core, which all seem a bit fishy and standardised. Oh yeah, and free community college. Spoiler alert: won't happen under this congress, although I've read he's going to get up to some good old-fashioned executive order shenanigans to sort out college prices. Sadly, my pet issue of nuclear and general disarmament has fallen by the wayside due to Putin and Israel, ugh. I would be highly surprised if there is aNY further serious work done in the issue, especially with the latest nuke deal with Modi.

So what will cement him as a great? Well the two pending transoceanic trade deals for one! Whatver you may think of them, Obama has spent significant capital crafting these gigantic FTA's which make NAFTA look pretty pathetic.

Next: the climate. Everyone thought this issue was dead in the water after congress failed epically to pass cap and trade. However, it's been a consistent slow burner, as emissions standards fell into place and the long awaited renewable industry finally burst free (and remarkably quickly). Now Obama needs to solidify that impact in Paris with mandatory GHG cuts from everyone. If that requires bashing the heads of the Canadian, Saudi and Australian delegates together, then so be it. (I do hope Tony Abbott is humiliated badly ftr)

Foreign policy: this is where everything gets sticky. Obama, perhaps wisely, isn't doing anything too drastic about the present Libya/Yemen/Syria/Iraq quagmire, just nudging the sides and gently fondling his proxy States. That mess will probably be left for Mr or Mrs Next President. Likewise, all this gentle calculations could count for squat if Greece takes out the Eurozone with itself and drags us all down to doom. Basically Obama's main hope of cementing some form of impact is the detente with both Iran and Cuba. (The latter of course perhaps going better than the former). Oh yeah, and he'll probably continue encircling China for whatever reason. (which reminds me: a Cybersecurity bill needs to be passed)

Criminal justice: probably the best bipartisan thing Obama could do. An alliance between fiscal conservatives, libertarians and progressives could unwreack some of the damage forced on the justice system by 90's tinpot populism. Elimination of old mandatory laws and three strikes, release of non-violent prisoners, genuinely look at the Drug War. It's the best legislative thing I see him getting through (tax reform is dead while all the GOPhers are under that stupid pledge IMO; immigration will also be relied on via executive orders.

Beyond that all he needs to do is stay awesome and he'll be an easy top fiver.
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CrabCake
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« Reply #5 on: June 30, 2015, 01:05:51 PM »

I was going to seriously argue why I dislike enough of your "candidates"  (like the medicore tool Wilson, the inept disaster of LBJ and the guy who got the country in the unwinnable War of 2012) to rate them higher than Barry. But then I realised you had Nixon (!!!!!) on your list and realised you are insane.
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