Do you support gay marriages?
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Author Topic: Do you support gay marriages?  (Read 8520 times)
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Harry
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« Reply #50 on: July 25, 2015, 09:45:09 PM »

I've always supported it, but it's a moot point now that it's legalized.

It will be overturned and religious freedom will be returned to her rightful pride of place.
That's pretty delusional thinking.  Also, remember religious freedom goes both ways.

Call back when Roe v Wade is overturned. But I still stand by the position that the Federal Courts have no legal jurisdiction due to Article 1 Section 8 and the 9th and 10th Amendments. Sorry but the application of the 14th is a flawed one.

You really should check out Russia. It's every thing the super-duper-Religious Right wants in a country.
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HagridOfTheDeep
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« Reply #51 on: July 25, 2015, 09:49:24 PM »

I hope Hell exists.

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Attorney General, LGC Speaker, and Former PPT Dwarven Dragon
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« Reply #52 on: July 25, 2015, 11:03:31 PM »


Why? Opposition to gay marriage isn't sinful, so it's not like JCL would go there.
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HagridOfTheDeep
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« Reply #53 on: July 26, 2015, 12:48:16 AM »


Why? Opposition to gay marriage isn't sinful, so it's not like JCL would go there.

Of course, I'd leave it to God to decide. And I don't think he's as pea-brained as many of his followers. Love is love; hate is hate. He knows what's up.
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smoltchanov
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« Reply #54 on: July 26, 2015, 01:40:10 AM »

Yes. I evolved somethinfg from my initial position (i was always for civil unions, but had some qualms about using the same word "marriage" for single-sex unions), but now i consider the legalization as best possible variant.
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SNJ1985
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« Reply #55 on: July 26, 2015, 10:41:33 AM »

Of course, I'd leave it to God to decide. And I don't think he's as pea-brained as many of his followers. Love is love; hate is hate. He knows what's up.

In Leviticus 19:17, God tells us that the way to truly love our neighbors is to tell them the truth and warn them that their sins are taking them to Hell.

It's the world that doesn't know what love and hate really are. The world thinks it's ''loving'' to coddle people in their soul-damning sins.
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SUSAN CRUSHBONE
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« Reply #56 on: July 26, 2015, 03:48:51 PM »

Of course, I'd leave it to God to decide. And I don't think he's as pea-brained as many of his followers. Love is love; hate is hate. He knows what's up.

In Leviticus 19:17, God tells us that the way to truly love our neighbors is to tell them the truth and warn them that their sins are taking them to Hell.

It's the world that doesn't know what love and hate really are. The world thinks it's ''loving'' to coddle people in their soul-damning sins.

literally two sentences later she says to not wear clothing woven of two different materials. the verse after that, she tacitly condones slavery. another few verses later, she forbids people from cutting their sideburns and getting tattoos.

you're either a troll or a huge fckin' moron.
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SNJ1985
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« Reply #57 on: July 26, 2015, 05:58:39 PM »
« Edited: July 26, 2015, 06:35:50 PM by Thomas from NJ »

Of course, I'd leave it to God to decide. And I don't think he's as pea-brained as many of his followers. Love is love; hate is hate. He knows what's up.

In Leviticus 19:17, God tells us that the way to truly love our neighbors is to tell them the truth and warn them that their sins are taking them to Hell.

It's the world that doesn't know what love and hate really are. The world thinks it's ''loving'' to coddle people in their soul-damning sins.

literally two sentences later she says to not wear clothing woven of two different materials. the verse after that, she tacitly condones slavery. another few verses later, she forbids people from cutting their sideburns and getting tattoos.

First of all, you mean ''He''. God is exclusively referred to with male pronouns throughout the entire Bible.

Secondly, there are three different types of Old Testament laws: Moral laws, ceremonial laws, and civil/judicial laws. Moral laws were never overturned; and the prohibition on homosexuality is a moral law - as are, to name a few examples, the prohibitions on murder, lying, stealing, fornicating and committing adultery. We are commanded to obey moral laws to this day.

http://crossexamined.org/cherry-picking-the-bible-are-christians-expected-to-follow-the-levitical-laws/
https://carm.org/leviticus-homosexuality-old-testament-law
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« Reply #58 on: July 26, 2015, 06:20:16 PM »

I'm sure God has more important things on her mind though.
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« Reply #59 on: July 26, 2015, 07:05:00 PM »

I'm sure God has more important things on her mind though.

Nah, world famine and wars can wait, someone is having butt sex while eating shrimp. Shocked
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True Federalist (진정한 연방 주의자)
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« Reply #60 on: July 26, 2015, 09:09:42 PM »

literally two sentences later she says to not wear clothing woven of two different materials. the verse after that, she tacitly condones slavery. another few verses later, she forbids people from cutting their sideburns and getting tattoos.

Material woven of two different materials was not particularly practical for the time. Quite a few of the Levitical regulations are anti-luxury and that's one of them. Strictly speaking the prohibitions against cutting hair and scarring the body are in the context of doing so as a means of mourning. As for slavery in the Bible, especially in the Old Testament, you're dealing with a society that had no coinage or money in the form we have it today.  As a result, labor contracts tended to be lengthy, the equivalent of what today we'd consider slavery or peonage.
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« Reply #61 on: July 26, 2015, 11:56:20 PM »


Who are you hoping to hang out with?
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HagridOfTheDeep
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« Reply #62 on: July 27, 2015, 01:17:44 AM »


Not you.
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MaxQue
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« Reply #63 on: July 27, 2015, 01:36:02 AM »

Of course, I'd leave it to God to decide. And I don't think he's as pea-brained as many of his followers. Love is love; hate is hate. He knows what's up.

In Leviticus 19:17, God tells us that the way to truly love our neighbors is to tell them the truth and warn them that their sins are taking them to Hell.

It's the world that doesn't know what love and hate really are. The world thinks it's ''loving'' to coddle people in their soul-damning sins.

literally two sentences later she says to not wear clothing woven of two different materials. the verse after that, she tacitly condones slavery. another few verses later, she forbids people from cutting their sideburns and getting tattoos.

First of all, you mean ''He''. God is exclusively referred to with male pronouns throughout the entire Bible.

Secondly, there are three different types of Old Testament laws: Moral laws, ceremonial laws, and civil/judicial laws. Moral laws were never overturned; and the prohibition on homosexuality is a moral law - as are, to name a few examples, the prohibitions on murder, lying, stealing, fornicating and committing adultery. We are commanded to obey moral laws to this day.

http://crossexamined.org/cherry-picking-the-bible-are-christians-expected-to-follow-the-levitical-laws/
https://carm.org/leviticus-homosexuality-old-testament-law

That moral-ceremonial-civil distinction is written nowhere in Bible, it has been invented by clever people wanting to delete some rules, but not other ones.
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afleitch
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« Reply #64 on: July 27, 2015, 06:03:19 AM »

As for slavery in the Bible, especially in the Old Testament, you're dealing with a society that had no coinage or money in the form we have it today.  As a result, labor contracts tended to be lengthy, the equivalent of what today we'd consider slavery or peonage.

They were not 'labour contracts'.

Leviticus states that slaves may be purchased, treated as property, their offspring treated as property and passed to your children as a 'permanent inheritance'

That is slavery.

On the matter of Hebrew slaves, the male slave may go free after seven, but his wife and children (if gained during that time) cannot go free. That is a forced choice. And no loving man would choose it, therefore he becomes his masters property forever and is branded.

That is slavery.

A female slave that does not 'please' the man that bought her can be bought back again.

That is sex slavery.

And that's before we get to Jesus.

Don't bullsh-t with the 'it's not really slavery' argument Smiley It is.

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True Federalist (진정한 연방 주의자)
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« Reply #65 on: July 27, 2015, 06:22:18 AM »

As for slavery in the Bible, especially in the Old Testament, you're dealing with a society that had no coinage or money in the form we have it today.  As a result, labor contracts tended to be lengthy, the equivalent of what today we'd consider slavery or peonage.

They were not 'labour contracts'.

Leviticus states that slaves may be purchased, treated as property, their offspring treated as property and passed to your children as a 'permanent inheritance'

That is slavery.

On the matter of Hebrew slaves, the male slave may go free after seven, but his wife and children (if gained during that time) cannot go free. That is a forced choice. And no loving man would choose it, therefore he becomes his masters property forever and is branded.

That is slavery.

A female slave that does not 'please' the man that bought her can be bought back again.

That is sex slavery.

And that's before we get to Jesus.

Don't bullsh-t with the 'it's not really slavery' argument Smiley It is.



That wasn't my argument, as should be obvious since I said that it essentially was what we'd call slavery.  My argument was that ancient economics weren't subtle enough to meet the demand for labor without it.  Indeed, they were unsubtle enough that Ancient Hebrew used the same word for "slave" and "indentured servant".
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SUSAN CRUSHBONE
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« Reply #66 on: July 27, 2015, 06:44:32 AM »

Of course, I'd leave it to God to decide. And I don't think he's as pea-brained as many of his followers. Love is love; hate is hate. He knows what's up.

In Leviticus 19:17, God tells us that the way to truly love our neighbors is to tell them the truth and warn them that their sins are taking them to Hell.

It's the world that doesn't know what love and hate really are. The world thinks it's ''loving'' to coddle people in their soul-damning sins.

literally two sentences later she says to not wear clothing woven of two different materials. the verse after that, she tacitly condones slavery. another few verses later, she forbids people from cutting their sideburns and getting tattoos.

First of all, you mean ''He''.
no

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show me exactly where god says that the first rule is still valid and the others aren't.

literally two sentences later she says to not wear clothing woven of two different materials. the verse after that, she tacitly condones slavery. another few verses later, she forbids people from cutting their sideburns and getting tattoos.

Material woven of two different materials was not particularly practical for the time. Quite a few of the Levitical regulations are anti-luxury and that's one of them.
...so?

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you could make that argument but it's not explicitly said
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Holmes
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« Reply #67 on: July 27, 2015, 08:53:35 AM »

I'm having one in 25 days, so.
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Cassius
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« Reply #68 on: July 27, 2015, 09:28:45 AM »

Basically, the Bible is for the Church to interpret, not a gaggle of random posters on an internet forum. Debate closed.
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HagridOfTheDeep
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« Reply #69 on: July 27, 2015, 09:42:38 AM »

Basically, the Bible is for the Church to interpret, not a gaggle of random posters on an internet forum. Debate closed.

Uh, the Bible is for God's children, not a group of robed elitists in a dark room.

And with your logic we might as well shut down the whole forum.
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Cassius
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« Reply #70 on: July 27, 2015, 09:49:36 AM »

Basically, the Bible is for the Church to interpret, not a gaggle of random posters on an internet forum. Debate closed.

Uh, the Bible is for God's children, not a group of robed elitists in a dark room.

And with your logic we might as well shut down the whole forum.

Of course the Bible is for God's children... and being children, they lack the ability to interpret the Bible correctly by themselves.
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Sprouts Farmers Market ✘
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« Reply #71 on: July 27, 2015, 09:52:37 AM »

Basically, the Bible is for the Church to interpret, not a gaggle of random posters on an internet forum. Debate closed.

Uh, the Bible is for God's children, not a group of robed elitists in a dark room.

And with your logic we might as well shut down the whole forum.

Of course the Bible is for God's children... and being children, they lack the ability to interpret the Bible correctly by themselves.

So presumably I am just God's infant and the elites are his adult children. Even as a Catholic, that hierarchical metaphor is disturbing.
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HagridOfTheDeep
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« Reply #72 on: July 27, 2015, 10:06:09 AM »

It's exactly why I have turned so sharply against religion. There is no room for critical thinking. You just have to unflinchingly accept whatever biblical interpretation comes down the pipe. What a great thing for society—we need more of that!

Roll Eyes
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Cassius
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« Reply #73 on: July 27, 2015, 10:11:22 AM »

Basically, the Bible is for the Church to interpret, not a gaggle of random posters on an internet forum. Debate closed.

Uh, the Bible is for God's children, not a group of robed elitists in a dark room.

And with your logic we might as well shut down the whole forum.

Of course the Bible is for God's children... and being children, they lack the ability to interpret the Bible correctly by themselves.

So presumably I am just God's infant and the elites are his adult children. Even as a Catholic, that hierarchical metaphor is disturbing.

Well I'm not really a fan of the whole 'God's children' concept; I'm not the son of God, Jesus was the one and only son of God. My basic point is that individuals who are not priests and have no formal training or education in scripture have no right or competence in interpreting the Bible, in the same way as a person who has no medical training has no right or competence to make pronouncements upon medical issues.

It's exactly why I have turned so sharply against religion. There is no room for critical thinking. You just have to unflinchingly accept whatever biblical interpretation comes down the pipe. What a great thing for society—we need more of that!

Roll Eyes

Well it leaves more time to deal with serious issues like earning a living and playing badminton, so I think on balance it's a good thing Smiley
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SNJ1985
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« Reply #74 on: July 27, 2015, 10:38:43 AM »

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show me exactly where god says that the first rule is still valid and the others aren't.

The websites I linked to do just that.
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