Opinion of Banned Posters: Adam Griffin
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  Opinion of Banned Posters: Adam Griffin
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Author Topic: Opinion of Banned Posters: Adam Griffin  (Read 5747 times)
Dr. Cynic
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« Reply #25 on: July 22, 2015, 08:17:24 AM »

I'm just done with this place. I'm glad that things are happening to make me really just not want to be here anymore. AAD ain't perfect, but this crap doesn't go on.
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TNF
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« Reply #26 on: July 22, 2015, 10:16:35 AM »

You guys banned Adam Griffin? WTF? Freedom Fighter, which is more than I can say of the so-called moderation team here. I've never been one to be on the 'FASCIST MODS' bandwagon either, but jfc
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Oakvale
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« Reply #27 on: July 22, 2015, 10:19:01 AM »

This is a fiasco, guys.
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The Dowager Mod
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« Reply #28 on: July 22, 2015, 10:31:21 AM »

I never really had any interaction with him, but ya this ban stinks.
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Simfan34
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« Reply #29 on: July 22, 2015, 10:44:52 AM »

By banning AG the moderators completely shattered whatever momentum or good-will they may have generated over the past day that would have allowed the forum to move forwards. On those grounds alone it was a terrible call, go say nothing of the flimsiness of the "reasons" behind his banning.

And I am obviously not someone who complains about the moderation on this site.
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« Reply #30 on: July 22, 2015, 10:52:14 AM »

I'm inclined to agree with Sim. I understand the logic of banning BK, but banning Griffin seems overly crude. I hope it will be reversed soon and we; the community and the leadership can begin to patch things up.
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bedstuy
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« Reply #31 on: July 22, 2015, 10:54:10 AM »

I think this is reaching, "we destroyed the village to save it," levels of absurdity.
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The Mikado
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« Reply #32 on: July 22, 2015, 11:09:50 AM »

Adam Griffin was aware that Tweed was behind Modleaks and that it was done through Bacon King's account and rather than revealing that information, colluded and kept Tweed's involvement a secret. Knowingly abetting criminal activity is itself a crime in any jurisdiction I'm familiar with.
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« Reply #33 on: July 22, 2015, 11:10:32 AM »

Adam is my friend and I'm obviously very unhappy with his departure.
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DemPGH
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« Reply #34 on: July 22, 2015, 11:13:13 AM »

Massive FF and a really awesome guy. The fact that he's evidently been banned, and the explanation for it pretty much bogus, is pretty close to doing it for me. WT ever-loving F?!?! Shameful.
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traininthedistance
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« Reply #35 on: July 22, 2015, 11:16:13 AM »
« Edited: July 22, 2015, 11:19:17 AM by traininthedistance »

Far be it from me to side with the anti-Mod sh*t-stirrers in general, but this was clearly out of line.  Agree with Sim, Crabcake, bedstuy of course.  At this point, knowing what we know, whether they think it's fair or not the Mods are going to have to walk back a couple of their recent actions if they want the populace in general to regain their trust.  Normally I would be satisfied with an explanation (and perhaps if Dave himself descended from the sky that would be an additional point-in-favor), but this is an extraordinary case in which legalisms will only feed our distrust and should instead be replaced with an attempt to make whole, rather than just move on.  

At a minimum, AG should be unbanned and BK's ban should be clearly made temporary.  Knowing what we know about the deliberations (and given his far-better behavior on AAD), I think that an unban of CountryClassSF, of all people, would also be particularly warranted.  I'm pretty easily satisfied; that's all I'd demand personally.  Others might want more, like say de-modding Joe Republic (who is a good and funny poster 95% of the time but whose anger issues and questionable objectivity make him a poor fit for modship).  Some things are too far gone: Tweed of course can rot in hell and so can his defenders; opebo isn't coming back, and those who worship him aren't coming back either- it's a genuine shame that people like Lewis have fallen into that sad bubble, but some hearts and minds are just too hardened against dialogue and reconciliation. But I choose to believe that the Atlas team can repair some of the damage, and it would be in their best interest to choose compassion over legalism and do so.
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HagridOfTheDeep
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« Reply #36 on: July 22, 2015, 11:32:30 AM »

I'll be the ass who says it.

Why the f-ck are people doing obviously questionable things, putting their friends' security in jeopardy, in the first place? If you play with fire you're going to get burned, and this whole situation was preventable if people had just used some common damn sense. I actually came around on Griffin with our love-hate relationship, so I know the Atlas is losing a good poster, but I'll never understand why people push the limits for the thrill of personal notoriety.

Anyway, pile on. But there are also good posters here who would never find themselves in this position to begin with.
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Simfan34
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« Reply #37 on: July 22, 2015, 11:35:04 AM »

Yes. Dave must come down and address this himself. If there was something that could make me leave, it would be the kind of show of such immense apathy that him not doing so would be.
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Torie
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« Reply #38 on: July 22, 2015, 11:35:39 AM »
« Edited: July 22, 2015, 11:39:42 AM by Torie »

Far be it from me to side with the anti-Mod sh*t-stirrers in general, but this was clearly out of line.  Agree with Sim, Crabcake, bedstuy of course.  At this point, knowing what we know, whether they think it's fair or not the Mods are going to have to walk back a couple of their recent actions if they want the populace in general to regain their trust.  Normally I would be satisfied with an explanation (and perhaps if Dave himself descended from the sky that would be an additional point-in-favor), but this is an extraordinary case in which legalisms will only feed our distrust and should instead be replaced with an attempt to make whole, rather than just move on.  

At a minimum, AG should be unbanned and BK's ban should be clearly made temporary.  Knowing what we know about the deliberations (and given his far-better behavior on AAD), I think that an unban of CountryClassSF, of all people, would also be particularly warranted.  I'm pretty easily satisfied; that's all I'd demand personally.  Others might want more, like say de-modding Joe Republic (who is a good and funny poster 95% of the time but whose anger issues and questionable objectivity make him a poor fit for modship).  Some things are too far gone: Tweed of course can rot in hell and so can his defenders; opebo isn't coming back, and those who worship him aren't coming back either- it's a genuine shame that people like Lewis have fallen into that sad bubble, but some hearts and minds are just too hardened against dialogue and reconciliation. But I choose to believe that the Atlas team can repair some of the damage, and it would be in their best interest to choose compassion over legalism and do so.

Putting aside CCSF (what he is doing on another site is not really relevant, and that ban decision was extensively discussed in the Cave, and was a divided decision where all the competing considerations were fully aired, and is not a part of the recent events), what you are advocating Train, is really a decision for Dave to make. He has to decide how he feels about the theft and the subsequent events,(it's severity and what he thinks constitutes behavior that cannot be forgiven, and what if any he thinks can),  and the relationship of this site to AAD, and what this site's policies should be towards it. It is a bad situation, I very much agree (and now AAD is doing counter bannings). So, with that said, you might PM Dave with your thoughts.
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traininthedistance
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« Reply #39 on: July 22, 2015, 11:41:05 AM »

Far be it from me to side with the anti-Mod sh*t-stirrers in general, but this was clearly out of line.  Agree with Sim, Crabcake, bedstuy of course.  At this point, knowing what we know, whether they think it's fair or not the Mods are going to have to walk back a couple of their recent actions if they want the populace in general to regain their trust.  Normally I would be satisfied with an explanation (and perhaps if Dave himself descended from the sky that would be an additional point-in-favor), but this is an extraordinary case in which legalisms will only feed our distrust and should instead be replaced with an attempt to make whole, rather than just move on.  

At a minimum, AG should be unbanned and BK's ban should be clearly made temporary.  Knowing what we know about the deliberations (and given his far-better behavior on AAD), I think that an unban of CountryClassSF, of all people, would also be particularly warranted.  I'm pretty easily satisfied; that's all I'd demand personally.  Others might want more, like say de-modding Joe Republic (who is a good and funny poster 95% of the time but whose anger issues and questionable objectivity make him a poor fit for modship).  Some things are too far gone: Tweed of course can rot in hell and so can his defenders; opebo isn't coming back, and those who worship him aren't coming back either- it's a genuine shame that people like Lewis have fallen into that sad bubble, but some hearts and minds are just too hardened against dialogue and reconciliation. But I choose to believe that the Atlas team can repair some of the damage, and it would be in their best interest to choose compassion over legalism and do so.

Putting aside CCSF (what he is doing on another site is not really relevant, and that ban decision was extensively discussed in the Cave, and was a divided decision where all the competing considerations were fully aired, and is not a part of the recent events), what you are advocating Train, is really a decision for Dave to make. He has to decide how he feels about the theft (it's severity and what he thinks constitutes behavior that cannot be forgiven, and what if any he thinks can), and the subsequent events, and the relationship of this site to AAD, and what this site's policies should be towards it. It is a bad situation, I very much agree (and now AAD is doing counter bannings). So, with that said, you might PM Dave with your thoughts.

The thing with CCSF is that decisions which are that divided should necessarily not be bans.  I'm not saying that it always has to be unanimous, but it should as a matter course require a supermajority, not 51%.

And we all know much good PMing Dave will do.
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Torie
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« Reply #40 on: July 22, 2015, 11:45:00 AM »
« Edited: July 22, 2015, 12:08:13 PM by Torie »

There was a supra majority regarding CCSF's ban, and one or two Mods came up with creative and novel approaches, that were not accepted, but in the end, it is not the vote count, but how the discussion influences Nym. It is just that if the Mod team is closely divided, or a majority against, that makes Nym more reluctant to ban. And I think there was at least one instance, where despite a supra majority for a ban, for quite a period of time, Nym was not persuaded. And then there was barfbag, where I was the lone Mod against a ban, and Nym agreed to let me try to rehabilitate him. Obviously that did not work out. Each ban decision, and its dynamics, is very fact specific.

Dave generally is unresponsive, but he has been very active lately, and is quite concerned about all that has transpired - and very much saddened by it. So I would give a PM a try Train.
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Mr. Smith
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« Reply #41 on: July 22, 2015, 11:52:23 AM »

FF
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Simfan34
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« Reply #42 on: July 22, 2015, 11:59:08 AM »

I can imagine the mods felt tired, betrayed, irritated, and probably angry after yesterday, but I think it can be said that not all pieces were looked at or looked at as well as they should have been. Hopefully you have a bigger picture now and can look at it in that light.

Dave generally is unresponsive, but he has been very active lately, and is quite concerned about all that has transpired - and very much saddened by it. So I would give a PM a try Train.

Why does he refuse to talk to us? At this point it is mere common courtesy, even if to publicly say "I have been following events" or something simple like that. It feels a bit like being an abandoned child.
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Chancellor Tanterterg
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« Reply #43 on: July 22, 2015, 12:07:54 PM »

If Griffin was colluding with Tweed in this than he deserved to be banned.  BK didn't deserve to be banned, but it sounds like Griffin was a willing accomplice what Tweed did.  Can't say I'm surprised Dave doesn't want to talk to any of us after this sad episode.  Can't say I blame him either, tbh.
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« Reply #44 on: July 22, 2015, 12:12:40 PM »

If Griffin was colluding with Tweed in this than he deserved to be banned.  BK didn't deserve to be banned, but it sounds like Griffin was a willing accomplice what Tweed did.  Can't say I'm surprised Dave doesn't want to talk to any of us after this sad episode.  Can't say I blame him either, tbh.
Um...you should really read what happened, dude.  If you're going to pkay the cold, calculating lawyer...then you should be arguing for BK's ban and against AG's.
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snowguy716
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« Reply #45 on: July 22, 2015, 12:29:44 PM »

Adam Griffin was aware that Tweed was behind Modleaks and that it was done through Bacon King's account and rather than revealing that information, colluded and kept Tweed's involvement a secret. Knowingly abetting criminal activity is itself a crime in any jurisdiction I'm familiar with.
And when you shared things from the mod board that other mods were saying about me behind my back...that was a-okay?  Peachy-keen?

From what I read that caused a stir and people were digging around to find out who leaked.

You people need to get off your high horse.  If what Adam and Bacon did was theft, then what your fellow mods did to me was slander.
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windjammer
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« Reply #46 on: July 22, 2015, 12:35:56 PM »
« Edited: July 22, 2015, 12:48:36 PM by Mideast Governor windjammer »

I wasn't going to post in this thread but then I read that:

If Griffin was colluding with Tweed in this than he deserved to be banned.  BK didn't deserve to be banned, but it sounds like Griffin was a willing accomplice what Tweed did.  Can't say I'm surprised Dave doesn't want to talk to any of us after this sad episode.  Can't say I blame him either, tbh.

Griffin wasn't a willing accomplice or whatever you can say. He just knew it was tweed and Bacon King who were behind these leaks. He didn't create this website leaking these threads. Bacon King however, literally GAVE HIS PASSWORDS TO TWEED, and when it was leaked, instead of directly taking responsibility, he denied it and let people think he was hacked.

Just to be clear I  like BK etc and I hope he will ONLY be tempbanned, but saying thingq like "Griffin should be banned but not BK" is hypocrisy. Griffin clearly made much less controversial things than BK.
-------------
Oh and by the way, is the only charge made against Griffin is that he knew who did that? Do these people want to do remake of the Vichy regime clearly based on "massive denunciation"? This is what people want for this website?
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Antonio the Sixth
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« Reply #47 on: July 22, 2015, 12:47:24 PM »

I think Adam was a great poster and I'm very sad to see him go, but I can't think you can honestly argue that his banning made no sense or is a grand injustice. From my understanding, Adam did provide Tweed with information on how to host the information thathe had obtained from the modcave. Yes, he didn't know how Tweed had obtained this information, which is obviously the worst aspect of this whole story, but he still provided some (minor) help to Tweed.

I'm not saying he should have been banned, but I can see where Nym is coming from and ultimately it's his (and Dave's) decision to make. I guess I'm the Moderate Hero on this controversy. Tongue
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« Reply #48 on: July 22, 2015, 01:23:06 PM »

Maybe I've got the wrong end of the stick, but I thought tweed asked griffin for information in a fairly hypothetical manner "how would I archive old threads?", sort of thing. Could be wrong though. I think Nym has jumped the gun on Griff, And thus is inadvertently prolonging this rather toxic scandal.
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Chancellor Tanterterg
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« Reply #49 on: July 22, 2015, 01:38:55 PM »

If Griffin was colluding with Tweed in this than he deserved to be banned.  BK didn't deserve to be banned, but it sounds like Griffin was a willing accomplice what Tweed did.  Can't say I'm surprised Dave doesn't want to talk to any of us after this sad episode.  Can't say I blame him either, tbh.
Um...you should really read what happened, dude.  If you're going to pkay the cold, calculating lawyer...then you should be arguing for BK's ban and against AG's.

Your post makes no sense and I don't even get what point you thought you were making with it, but whatever.
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