Justice System Reform Bill 1 2015 (Passed)

[Southern Senator North Carolina Yankee]

This seems like a good idea to me. I assume that said review process will not result in sentences being increased?

I tried to avoid that but admittedly, I am still not satisfied with the last sentence as it was troubling the first several iterations before I finally landed at that one at nearly four in the morning.

[Southern Senator North Carolina Yankee]

     I guess the difference is taking their behavior in prison into account? I would suppose that commuting their sentences would have taken the new laws into account.

Not automatically. For instance a commutation could be given to someone under the same laws by the executive through his pardon power. Bush did this with almost everyone of his modifications, leaving the actual conviction in place, but commuting the sentence and releasing them from prison. This angered both Dick Cheney who wanted a full pardon for Libby and the border hawks who wanted a full pardon for Ramos and Compean.

This would be altering sentences to comport with current law. However that cannot be done automatically since person is to be subject to the laws as they existed at the time of the conviction until either pardoned or some kind of sentence review established. The States do this a lot using newer laws, usually when new technology like DNA, which wasn't even available more or less sanctioned by the law at the time, comes to hand and demonstrates innocence.  The review is essentially a retrial. Which means we should probably make that clear as well, because the authority and manner in which it operates would be similar.

[Southern Senator North Carolina Yankee]

Also, Cris, I haven't really worked on the matter of working it into the current text, since right now my priority is to engage discussion on these important key points and throwing up a wall of text would distract from the priority right now. Once I have a functional text, inclusion should be a simple matter, including giving it a clause number.

[Associate Justice PiT]

     I guess the difference is taking their behavior in prison into account? I would suppose that commuting their sentences would have taken the new laws into account.

Not automatically. For instance a commutation could be given to someone under the same laws by the executive through his pardon power. Bush did this with almost everyone of his modifications, leaving the actual conviction in place, but commuting the sentence and releasing them from prison. This angered both Dick Cheney who wanted a full pardon for Libby and the border hawks who wanted a full pardon for Ramos and Compean.

This would be altering sentences to comport with current law. However that cannot be done automatically since person is to be subject to the laws as they existed at the time of the conviction until either pardoned or some kind of sentence review established. The States do this a lot using newer laws, usually when new technology like DNA, which wasn't even available more or less sanctioned by the law at the time, comes to hand and demonstrates innocence.  The review is essentially a retrial. Which means we should probably make that clear as well, because the authority and manner in which it operates would be similar.

     That makes sense to me. We should be clear on what the processes we are using to achieve the ends we want actually entail, so I appreciate the clarification.

[Southern Senator North Carolina Yankee]

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[Southern Senator North Carolina Yankee]

What is the appropriate appropriation in the current text for on-going costs of management?It is presently XXXX in the bill?

With that decided, we can then decide on a reduction formula subject to reductions in inmates as a result of the amendment just offered, reaching a minimum threshold (Say 5%).

[Southern Senator North Carolina Yankee]

No feedback on my question?


What about my last amendment, I kind of wanted to finish this by month's end but that requires at least one more amendment to fless out that missing variable and handle some remaining issues.

[Associate Justice PiT]

     I can take the time to mull over an estimate of the costs, though today isn't the best for me.

[Southern Senator North Carolina Yankee]

When you get a chance that would be most helpeful, PiT.


Cris, when you get a chance can you go ahead and process my amendment three posts up?

[Senator Cris]

Senators have 24 hours to object:

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[Unconditional Surrender Truman]

I support Yankee's amendment.

[Senator Cris]

The amendment has been adopted.

[Southern Senator North Carolina Yankee]

PiT did you get a chance with regards to that cost estimate yet?

[Talleyrand]

Just pass this instead of waiting for some "cost estimate" that isn't going to change anything. Let the bureaucrats in the DoIA decide that.

I motion for a final vote.

[Associate Justice PiT]

Just pass this instead of waiting for some "cost estimate" that isn't going to change anything. Let the bureaucrats in the DoIA decide that.

I motion for a final vote.

     I basically agree with this. Sometimes we take too much work upon ourselves when it can be delegated out to agencies. I second the motion.

[Southern Senator North Carolina Yankee]

Its an appropriation, the Executive branch cannot appropriate money.

[Southern Senator North Carolina Yankee]

There is nothing else being delayed by this. The Convention is its own ing entity and its members are not the same as the Senate members. For those members of both, it is their responsibiltiy to maintain their responsibilities. We should not shut down and abandon two projects that are very close to being finished on these grounds. Once we do, the Senate is just going to sit idle and everyone is going to end up being expelled from it, or perhaps that is the plan. Either way, it isn't going to happen.

[Associate Justice PiT]

     Also, we kind of need to fix the clause anyway now that I think about it. I unsecond the motion. Regardless we have at least one more amendment we need to pass.

[Blair]

This bill is supported by the administration, and I'm happy to work some numbers out if Senators wish so

[Talleyrand]

Yes, the legislative branch sets appropriations, but by your logic we should start designating $100 for a new printer and $50 for paper in Room 232 of the Fish and Wildlife Service or whatever!!! The agency can just draw from their preexisting funds. We cannot afford to waste any more taxpayer money on things like this!!!

If the administration can come up with a cost estimate within the next 36 hours, I will back it, but let's fix the grammatical issues and send this bill to the President!!!

[Senator Cris]

Bump.

Are these numbers available?

[Associate Justice PiT]

     A quick Google search found that there were 130,000 prisoners in private prisons in the United States in 2010. Average cost of holding a prisoner is $31,000/prisoner/year according to a study by the Vera Institute of Justice. This works out to about $4 billion a year.

[Senator Cris]

Bump.

[Associate Justice PiT]

     I propose an amendment to the current Section 6:

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[Senator Cris]

Senators have 24 hours to object.