Europe-Middle East-Africa Refugee Crisis General Thread

[Antonio the Sixth]

In the German city of Tübingen, the Green mayor Boris Palmer, threatens to confiscate [unused] private property to forcefully house asylum seekers and/or illegals ...

FF

[Antonio the Sixth]

In the German city of Tübingen, the Green mayor Boris Palmer, threatens to confiscate [unused] private property to forcefully house asylum seekers and/or illegals ...

FF

No, that's not an FF move. That is a violation of basic property rights, which is at the core of any liberal understanding of liberty.

"Property rights" are among the most unimportant rights there is, and certainly rank waaaay below the fundamental right to housing.

[Antonio the Sixth]

Can we ban this worthless piece of trash already?

[Antonio the Sixth]

Can we ban this worthless piece of trash already?

Why do you want to be banned?

That's some first-class sick burn we got here.

[Antonio the Sixth]

Oh wow.

Maybe its time to consider at least temporarily stepping away from your keyboards gentlemen?

Probably the best idea. Arguing with nazis never really seemed to work anyway.

Protip: being Jewish does not allow you to resort to argumentum ad Hitlerum every time your idiotic views are challenged.

[Antonio the Sixth]

Xenophobia isn't inherent to "human nature", as Politicus disturbingly seems to believe. Societies can be educated to accept, and even actively promote, multiculturalism, if thier political and cultural leaders make the effort to endorse it, instead of pandering to irrational fears.

[Antonio the Sixth]

Thank God DFB is here. He's the only one who's making any sense in this discussion.

[Antonio the Sixth]

ITT: Middle class White people living in liberal democracies lecturing poor nonwhite people living in authoritarian regimes on what they should do.

[Antonio the Sixth]

Bavarian state premier Horst Seehofer will invite Viktor Orban to the next conference meeting of his party's state parliamentary group. This is quite a big move considering that the German media and political class have painted Orban as an autocrat who's one step away from erecting concentration camps for refugees. Seehofer has also gone out of his way to criticize Merkel, calling her decision to accept refugees from Hungary a mistake.

(In German) http://www.spiegel.de/politik/deutschland/horst-seehofer-wettert-gegen-angela-merkel-in-fluechtlingspolitik-a-1052455.html

Orban IS an autocrat who's one step away from erecting concentration camps for refugees, though.

[Antonio the Sixth]

What the f**k, Merkel? Dumbest flip-flop ever.

[Antonio the Sixth]

The difference between a legitimate West European refugee camp (which anyway would only be a temporary solution before the refugees can acquire affordable housing) and a concentration camp is treating people with human dignity. It's not that hard to understand if you start from the assumption that refugees are human beings (which is apparently lost on most of you).

[Antonio the Sixth]

Sweden continues to be the best.

[Antonio the Sixth]

64% of Germans approve of Schäuble? That's the scariest number.

[Antonio the Sixth]

But this is exactly the stuff I tried to warn you about. This silly, reckless mass immigration policy "stresses" the native population unnecessarily and makes them agitated.

Cry me a river. Clearly racist first-worlders are the people we should sympathize with.

[Antonio the Sixth]

But this is exactly the stuff I tried to warn you about. This silly, reckless mass immigration policy "stresses" the native population unnecessarily and makes them agitated.

Cry me a river. Clearly racist first-worlders are the people we should sympathize with.

Those damn racists need to have their votes drowned out!

Yes.

[Antonio the Sixth]

Sorry if I don't sympathize too much with the plight of people who feel entitled to their privileges just because they were born in a certain place and have a certain religion/skin color, and want to deny those privileges to the rest of the world because muh homeland. I, as any decent person, stand with the unprivileged and the downtrodden.

[Antonio the Sixth]

The new European left-winger has given up on the white working class and instead belittles them and their lifestyle, either doesn't really care about maintaining the welfare state or simply believes things about the productivity of non-Western immigrants that are not true, and thinks solidarity based on traditional nation-state patterns is racist and should be eradicated, just as the nation-state itself should be eradicated.

You clearly haven't been paying attention to my posts if you believe that applies to me.

First off, I care about the Welfare State probably more than about 90% of people here, and certainly more than Tender, who isn't a left-winger in any meaningful sense of the word (whether "old" or "new").

Second, please cite any post where I said anything about the "White working class". I don't know why you assume that my condemnation of racism are in anyway related to that, but I've got news for you: there are plenty of racists among the middle and upper classes. In fact, this forum is a good demonstration of that. If anything, the populist right's fetishization of the "White working class" is quite telling in its implicit exclusion of the nonwhite working class. Why is the first more deserving of care and support than the latter?

They are entitled to these privileges because they worked hard to establish these welfare systems, contrary to the millions who are now lining up at the border and want to enjoy these goodies too.

Oh, I see, so Middle Easterners are just lazy freeloaders and that's why their countries don't look like Austria. Thanks for proving my point about racism.

[Antonio the Sixth]

Also (and this applies to Latin American/African immigration more than Syria), if poor people from the third world are such an economic boon for developed countries, why are their countries of origin so poor that they have to flee?

because white people of course

No, clearly it's the fault of ordinary folks who have been brutally murdered and/or left starving for the past decades or so. If only they pulled themselves by their bootstraps like the good, deserving Whites, every problem in their countries would fix themselves!

[Antonio the Sixth]

They are entitled to these privileges because they worked hard to establish these welfare systems, contrary to the millions who are now lining up at the border and want to enjoy these goodies too.

Oh, I see, so Middle Easterners are just lazy freeloaders and that's why their countries don't look like Austria. Thanks for proving my point about racism.

Welfare states are a form of collective insurance. You pay into them with your taxes when you are working and you (or your children) can use them when studying, sick, unemployed, retired etc. It does create bad will when people who haven't paid the "insurance premium" gets ahead in the queue (so to speak) to fx housing or hospital treatment or too many non-payers use the systems and fx hospital waiting lists go up. You may find this selfish, but its a natural sentiment.

Tender didn't say anything about why most Middle Eastern countries malfunction (which is a complex issue).

Non-citizens generally pay taxes in the countries they reside in, and that goes for migrants and refugees as well. Why shouldn't they get access to the same services and benefits other taxpayers receive?

[Antonio the Sixth]

They are entitled to these privileges because they worked hard to establish these welfare systems, contrary to the millions who are now lining up at the border and want to enjoy these goodies too.

Oh, I see, so Middle Easterners are just lazy freeloaders and that's why their countries don't look like Austria. Thanks for proving my point about racism.

Welfare states are a form of collective insurance. You pay into them with your taxes when you are working and you (or your children) can use them when studying, sick, unemployed, retired etc. It does create bad will when people who haven't paid the "insurance premium" gets ahead in the queue (so to speak) to fx housing or hospital treatment or too many non-payers use the systems and fx hospital waiting lists go up. You may find this selfish, but its a natural sentiment.

Tender didn't say anything about why most Middle Eastern countries malfunction (which is a complex issue).

Non-citizens generally pay taxes in the countries they reside in, and that goes for migrants and refugees as well. Why shouldn't they get access to the same services and benefits other taxpayers receive?

Well, they pay taxes when and if they enter the labour market. They haven't done so on arrival. Plus their labour market participation is low in many countries - especially those with high minimum wages, which are the same ones that have an extensive welfare state.

Most unemployed people, whether native or immigrant, are looking for jobs. If they don't get them, that's probably due to economic circumstances that can be reversed through appropriate stimulus policies. But either way, the native unemployed person is in the same situation as the immigrant one. Why would you blame the latter more than the former?