Carly Fiorina: Everyone should have to take citizenship test

[HillOfANight]

http://www.washingtonexaminer.com/carly-fiorina-everyone-should-have-to-take-citizenship-test/article/2570466

[Yelnoc]

Excellent! Take a test, and you are a citizen. Even if you have lived here for 3 weeks. I approve.

Well, no, she's saying American citizens like us should have to take the same citizenship test we give to people trying to attain citizenship, because "[she] worr[ies] that we are no longer educating citizens." So it's a sort of civic education thing.

[Krago]

If passing a standard citizenship test was required for voting, would more Republicans or Democrats be disqualified?

[ElectionsGuy]

If passing a standard citizenship test was required for voting, would more Republicans or Democrats be disqualified?

Democrats, for sure.

[Yelnoc]

If passing a standard citizenship test was required for voting, would more Republicans or Democrats be disqualified?

Democrats, for sure.

What makes you say that?

[King]

If passing a standard citizenship test was required for voting, would more Republicans or Democrats be disqualified?

Democrats, for sure.

What makes you say that?

He's conservative.

[Zioneer]

Honestly, as long as it's a fair test, I have no problems with this.

[Simfan34]

I've supported this for a very long time. It's ridiculous that immigrants are compelled to learn proper basic civic knowledge about our government and how it functions while natural born citizens get off scot free with ignorance. We need to up the ante.

[bedstuy]

If only there was some sort of government institution that educated people...

[Simfan34]

If only there was some sort of government institution that educated people...

And only if said institution was actually able to do so competently...

[ag]

They tried it in the South before the 1960s, if I recall it right.

[mencken]

They tried it in the South before the 1960s, if I recall it right.

The problem there was that such tests were not applied equally. However, leftists seem to have generally succeeded in Pavlovian conditioning of the public to associate basic civil literacy with racism.

You must be logged in to read this quote.

[Beezer]

Ronald Reagan was

[ ] a great
[ ] the greatest

president.

[Crumpets]

Honestly, as long as it's a fair test, I have no problems with this.

[○∙◄☻¥tπ[╪AV┼cVê└]

Sounds like she wants to bring back the literacy tests of Jim Crow.

[ag]

They tried it in the South before the 1960s, if I recall it right.

The problem there was that such tests were not applied equally. However, leftists seem to have generally succeeded in Pavlovian conditioning of the public to associate basic civil literacy with racism.

You must be logged in to read this quote.

"Leftists" did not compose, nor did they administer this test.

http://www.slate.com/blogs/the_vault/2013/06/28/voting_rights_and_the_supreme_court_the_impossible_literacy_test_louisiana.html

Or are you saying that it is something else that has succeeded in associating literacy tests with racism?

[mencken]

They tried it in the South before the 1960s, if I recall it right.

The problem there was that such tests were not applied equally. However, leftists seem to have generally succeeded in Pavlovian conditioning of the public to associate basic civil literacy with racism.

You must be logged in to read this quote.

"Leftists" did not compose, nor did they administer this test.

http://www.slate.com/blogs/the_vault/2013/06/28/voting_rights_and_the_supreme_court_the_impossible_literacy_test_louisiana.html

Or are you saying that it is something else that has succeeded in associating literacy tests with racism?

Leftists who oppose any requirement for civic literacy bring up the bogus "literacy tests" of Jim Crow-era South as a means of discrediting the entire concept.

[Mehmentum]

I agree that we need more civic education, but a test where if you fail, you get kicked out of the country?  That's a step too far.

[ag]

They tried it in the South before the 1960s, if I recall it right.

The problem there was that such tests were not applied equally. However, leftists seem to have generally succeeded in Pavlovian conditioning of the public to associate basic civil literacy with racism.

You must be logged in to read this quote.

"Leftists" did not compose, nor did they administer this test.

http://www.slate.com/blogs/the_vault/2013/06/28/voting_rights_and_the_supreme_court_the_impossible_literacy_test_louisiana.html

Or are you saying that it is something else that has succeeded in associating literacy tests with racism?

Leftists who oppose any requirement for civic literacy bring up the bogus "literacy tests" of Jim Crow-era South as a means of discrediting the entire concept.

Bogus? I thought they were very real.

And if you claim that this cannot happen now, you should, at least, give us some idea of why you are so confident.

[Fuzzy Bear]

Isn't taxation without representation tyranny?

If one cannot vote, will they be exempt from Federal Income Tax?

This idea is worse than silly; it's repugnant.

[mencken]

They tried it in the South before the 1960s, if I recall it right.

The problem there was that such tests were not applied equally. However, leftists seem to have generally succeeded in Pavlovian conditioning of the public to associate basic civil literacy with racism.

You must be logged in to read this quote.

"Leftists" did not compose, nor did they administer this test.

http://www.slate.com/blogs/the_vault/2013/06/28/voting_rights_and_the_supreme_court_the_impossible_literacy_test_louisiana.html

Or are you saying that it is something else that has succeeded in associating literacy tests with racism?

Leftists who oppose any requirement for civic literacy bring up the bogus "literacy tests" of Jim Crow-era South as a means of discrediting the entire concept.

Bogus? I thought they were very real.

And if you claim that this cannot happen now, you should, at least, give us some idea of why you are so confident.

Don't be naive. The content of the test was bogus, not the test itself.

Perhaps societal attitudes have changed since the 1960s? I realize your posting history says otherwise, but the correct year is, in fact, not 1938, but 2015.

[Simfan34]

They tried it in the South before the 1960s, if I recall it right.

The problem there was that such tests were not applied equally. However, leftists seem to have generally succeeded in Pavlovian conditioning of the public to associate basic civil literacy with racism.

You must be logged in to read this quote.

"Leftists" did not compose, nor did they administer this test.

http://www.slate.com/blogs/the_vault/2013/06/28/voting_rights_and_the_supreme_court_the_impossible_literacy_test_louisiana.html

Or are you saying that it is something else that has succeeded in associating literacy tests with racism?

Leftists who oppose any requirement for civic literacy bring up the bogus "literacy tests" of Jim Crow-era South as a means of discrediting the entire concept.

Bogus? I thought they were very real.

And if you claim that this cannot happen now, you should, at least, give us some idea of why you are so confident.

Come on ag, you're better than such strawmanning. These tests were arbitrary questions hurled with the deliberate intent to bar a segment of a population from voting. The basic idea here is to administer the same test to all people.

If you want to stop ignoramuses from electing someone like Trump this is a reasonable way to do it. Perhaps if they were made to study basic civics they'd see why voting for him was a bad idea.

[ag]

They tried it in the South before the 1960s, if I recall it right.

The problem there was that such tests were not applied equally. However, leftists seem to have generally succeeded in Pavlovian conditioning of the public to associate basic civil literacy with racism.

You must be logged in to read this quote.

"Leftists" did not compose, nor did they administer this test.

http://www.slate.com/blogs/the_vault/2013/06/28/voting_rights_and_the_supreme_court_the_impossible_literacy_test_louisiana.html

Or are you saying that it is something else that has succeeded in associating literacy tests with racism?

Leftists who oppose any requirement for civic literacy bring up the bogus "literacy tests" of Jim Crow-era South as a means of discrediting the entire concept.

Bogus? I thought they were very real.

And if you claim that this cannot happen now, you should, at least, give us some idea of why you are so confident.

Don't be naive. The content of the test was bogus, not the test itself.

Perhaps societal attitudes have changed since the 1960s? I realize your posting history says otherwise, but the correct year is, in fact, not 1938, but 2015.

Oh, the optimism of the young. And the naive belief that we have outgrown the barbarity of the past.  Hate to breakt it to you, but people back in 1928 also thought it was not 1913 anymore.

[ag]

They tried it in the South before the 1960s, if I recall it right.

The problem there was that such tests were not applied equally. However, leftists seem to have generally succeeded in Pavlovian conditioning of the public to associate basic civil literacy with racism.

You must be logged in to read this quote.

"Leftists" did not compose, nor did they administer this test.

http://www.slate.com/blogs/the_vault/2013/06/28/voting_rights_and_the_supreme_court_the_impossible_literacy_test_louisiana.html

Or are you saying that it is something else that has succeeded in associating literacy tests with racism?

Leftists who oppose any requirement for civic literacy bring up the bogus "literacy tests" of Jim Crow-era South as a means of discrediting the entire concept.

Bogus? I thought they were very real.

And if you claim that this cannot happen now, you should, at least, give us some idea of why you are so confident.

Come on ag, you're better than such strawmanning. These tests were arbitrary questions hurled with the deliberate intent to bar a segment of a population from voting. The basic idea here is to administer the same test to all people.

If you want to stop ignoramuses from electing someone like Trump this is a reasonable way to do it. Perhaps if they were made to study basic civics they'd see why voting for him was a bad idea.

The test that will stop ignoramuses, would stop 95% of the voting-age population. The test that will be practical to administer will not test anything. A single multiple-choice exam cannot test understanding and anything else would be possible to administer in a very arbitrary fashion. I have seen people preparing for the citizenship exam - they learn by heart the answers to 150 or so questions, frequently without understanding either the questions or the answers (the test is in English, and they, frequently, speak it the way your neighboring parrot does, at  best).  You really want to create the bureaucracy that would be necessary to extend this imitation to the society at large? And then monitor this bureaucracy for fairness in administering the exam?

Somebody, who is proposing such an exam is a lot more dangerous for a democracy than Donald Trump or any of his supporters. If anything, a true conservative should be loath to be giving this sort of powers to a government.

[The Mikado]

Decided to look at some current questions on the citizenship test.

43. Who is the Governor of your state now?
▪ Answers will vary. [District of Columbia residents should answer that D.C. does not have a Governor.]

Well, that's a lot of people out right from the get-go. What, 20% of adults know who their governor is? Sometimes more for celebrity governors.

21. The House of Representatives has how many voting members?
▪ four hundred thirty-five (435)

Non-Atlas types will pretty much all miss this one.

11. What is the economic system in the United States?*
▪ capitalist economy
▪ market economy

Yeah, this isn't going to go very well.

40. Who is the Chief Justice of the United States now?
▪ John Roberts (John G. Roberts, Jr.)

I'd be surprised if 10% of the population could get this.

67. The Federalist Papers supported the passage of the U.S. Constitution. Name one of the writers.
▪ (James) Madison
▪ (Alexander) Hamilton
▪ (John) Jay
▪ Publius

How many people even know what the Federalist Papers are?

73. Name the U.S. war between the North and the South.
▪ the Civil War
▪ the War between the States

Just thought that the accepted answers were interesting on this one.

79. Who was President during World War I?
▪ (Woodrow) Wilson

Ahahaha nope.

91. Name one U.S. territory.
▪ Puerto Rico
▪ U.S. Virgin Islands
▪ American Samoa
▪ Northern Mariana Islands
▪ Guam

This one would be tricky for a lot of people, who'd just write a state down or maybe Washington DC.