Constitutional Convention - Commentary thread.

[Cincinnatus]

I assume this will be a lost cause since it's utterly dominated by ultra-conservatives (in the 'game reform' sense) of various affiliations like Yankee, Kalwejt, PiT, CLASSIC CONSERVATIVE, various Labor zombies etc etc etc but I will try my utmost to represent the people shut out of the convention by the undemocratic Senate.

It could come together but I wonder if the veterans that are involved will be able to compensate for the newer people who haven't seen all the failed reforms and debates over the past few years.  Of course it might help having a bunch of new people instead of a lot more of the Nay first crowd that's been around here forever.

[Oakvale]

I assume this will be a lost cause since it's utterly dominated by ultra-conservatives (in the 'game reform' sense) of various affiliations like Yankee, Kalwejt, PiT, CLASSIC CONSERVATIVE, various Labor zombies etc etc etc but I will try my utmost to represent the people shut out of the convention by the undemocratic Senate.

It could come together but I wonder if the veterans that are involved will be able to compensate for the newer people who haven't seen all the failed reforms and debates over the past few years.  Of course it might help having a bunch of new people instead of a lot more of the Nay first crowd that's been around here forever.

God willing people will take a look at the ruins of the disastrous 2010 convention. The threads are still there and are entirely people begging someone to end it after literally nothing happened for three months.

[Classic Conservative]

I'm personally willing to take questions and concerns by any person from Atlasia and listen to them.

[Fmr. Pres. Duke]

Has it started yet? If so, what is the plan for it?

[Senator Cris]

Has it started yet? If so, what is the plan for it?

Today, Senator PiT will open a 48-hours vote for the election of the Presiding Officer.
After this vote, the Convention will start.

[Unconditional Surrender Truman]

I assume this will be a lost cause since it's utterly dominated by ultra-conservatives (in the 'game reform' sense) of various affiliations like Yankee, Kalwejt, PiT, CLASSIC CONSERVATIVE, various Labor zombies etc etc etc but I will try my utmost to represent the people shut out of the convention by the undemocratic Senate.

yes, yes, it's very democratic to unilaterally seize control of almost half the delegate positions, we know.

I love how Evergreen is accusing the Senate of being "undemocratic" when she literally suggested choosing delegates based on post count.

And Oakvale, I'd love to see a list of the so-called "Labor zombies" that supposedly control the convention. Of the six Laborites attending the Convention, the only one who has not been consistently active over the past month is the president, who you continue to defend despite all rationality. That being the case, I'll just assume that you're blowing smoke as usual and have no intention of doing anything remotely constructive. 

[Classic Conservative]

Since Kal de registered don't you guys have to pick another delegate.

[Unconditional Surrender Truman]

It seems that several citizens are concerned that a significant portion of the population has been "shut out" of the Constitutional Convention. Some of these people, of course, are the usual malcontents who have spent the last four months trying to destroy the game; however, a sizable number (Winfield, Tmthforu, etc.) are patriotic Atlasians who are genuinely motivated to ensure that this process is as transparent as possible. Therefore, I have compiled these statistics in hopes of putting their minds at ease:



As we can see from this graph, the partisan composition of the convention closely mirrors that of the national electorate, according to the most recent Census. Of the major political parties, only ANUSTART is entirely without representation (this due to the fact that the party ran no candidates for delegate and has largely collapsed as a political entity in recent months). Apart from that, the representation of parties at the ConCon is effectively identical to its share of the electorate. Only two parties - Civic Renewal and, ironically, NNP - has a significantly¹ larger percentage of seats in the ConCon than it would receive in a perfectly proportional system. No party (excluding ANUSTART) is underrepresented.

"But wait!" you say, "This chart says that Independents are underrepresented at the Convention by a margin of 8%! The Senate is evil! Off with their heads!"

While it is true that Independents make up a smaller share of the ConCon than they do the national population, it is also true that 100% of Independents who ran in the Delegate Elections were elected. In other words, independents are underrepresented at the ConCon not because of a nefarious scheme cooked up by the socialist-tea party-newbie-establishment cabal, but because there were fewer independents interested in serving in the ConCon than might have been expected. This is not the work of a power-hungry legislature: this is the effect of rampant apathy and inactivity.

Likewise, if you evaluate the composition of the ConCon based on Regional representation, no Region is significantly underrepresented and one - the Northeast - is actually overrepresented. In short, the selection process actually resulted in a Convention that accurately reflects not only the partisan composition of the electorate, but also the populations of the Regions.

¹For our purposes, a "significant" deviation is one greater than 3%.

[SUSAN CRUSHBONE]

I assume this will be a lost cause since it's utterly dominated by ultra-conservatives (in the 'game reform' sense) of various affiliations like Yankee, Kalwejt, PiT, CLASSIC CONSERVATIVE, various Labor zombies etc etc etc but I will try my utmost to represent the people shut out of the convention by the undemocratic Senate.

yes, yes, it's very democratic to unilaterally seize control of almost half the delegate positions, we know.

I love how Evergreen is accusing the Senate of being "undemocratic" when she literally suggested choosing delegates based on post count.

this is a red herring, obviously. seizing a power for yourself is a very different thing from leaving it to purely meritocratic criteria. (not to mention, of course, that that wasn't, in fact, my final proposal)

[Unconditional Surrender Truman]

I assume this will be a lost cause since it's utterly dominated by ultra-conservatives (in the 'game reform' sense) of various affiliations like Yankee, Kalwejt, PiT, CLASSIC CONSERVATIVE, various Labor zombies etc etc etc but I will try my utmost to represent the people shut out of the convention by the undemocratic Senate.

yes, yes, it's very democratic to unilaterally seize control of almost half the delegate positions, we know.

I love how Evergreen is accusing the Senate of being "undemocratic" when she literally suggested choosing delegates based on post count.

this is a red herring, obviously. seizing a power for yourself is a very different thing from leaving it to purely meritocratic criteria. (not to mention, of course, that that wasn't, in fact, my final proposal)

So anything that contradicts your argument is a "red herring" and should be ignored in favor of your version of reality? How convenient! In that case, we won't bother to talk about how your second plan allowed the Regional governments to circumvent the people entirely and appoint all 25 delegates themselves.

[Lincoln Republican]

Let us look beyond these conspiracy theories and let us get on with the task of rebuilding the republic.

We will never satisfy everyone.

The Con Con has wide representation across regions, parties, and ideology, probably the best we could have under the difficult circumstances of organizing this convention.    

Let us get on with the job at hand.

[Classic Conservative]

Look the only people complaining our the enemies of state in the Northeast National Party which seeks to destroy our nation and form their own 'legitimate' country.

[Lincoln Republican]

I am shocked and saddened.

Seriously.

Why did Kalwejt de-register?

Anybody know?

[Fmr. Pres. Duke]

It's time for me to take Kal's place.

[Lincoln Republican]

It's time for me to take Kal's place.

Sorry Duke, but you do not qualify.

Kalwejt was one of 5 Senators elected by the Senate, as per the rules of delegate selection. 

His replacement must be a sitting Senator.

[SUSAN CRUSHBONE]

It's time for me to take Kal's place.

Sorry Duke, but you do not qualify.

Kalwejt was one of 5 Senators elected by the Senate, as per the rules of delegate selection. 

His replacement must be a sitting Senator.

well, not quite.

the only thing in the regulations about vacancies is this:

You must be logged in to read this quote.

which refers specifically to regional delegates only. in other words, there is no procedure for filling kalwejt's seat

[Lincoln Republican]

It's time for me to take Kal's place.

Sorry Duke, but you do not qualify.

Kalwejt was one of 5 Senators elected by the Senate, as per the rules of delegate selection. 

His replacement must be a sitting Senator.

well, not quite.

the only thing in the regulations about vacancies is this:

You must be logged in to read this quote.

which refers specifically to regional delegates only. in other words, there is no procedure for filling kalwejt's seat

So if in fact there is no legal procedure for filling this seat, like you say, that makes matters even worse.  The vacancy cannot then be filled legally.  And if this is in fact the case, we cannot go making exceptions to the law.  The Con Con would then lose credibility.

If it could be done legally, since this is a seat that is one of 5 Senators that was elected by the Senate, as mandated by the delegate selection rules, then this seat should go to the Senator who finished next in line in this Senate election.

[SUSAN CRUSHBONE]

It's time for me to take Kal's place.

Sorry Duke, but you do not qualify.

Kalwejt was one of 5 Senators elected by the Senate, as per the rules of delegate selection. 

His replacement must be a sitting Senator.

well, not quite.

the only thing in the regulations about vacancies is this:

You must be logged in to read this quote.

which refers specifically to regional delegates only. in other words, there is no procedure for filling kalwejt's seat

So if in fact there is no legal procedure for filling this seat, like you say, that makes matters even worse.  The vacancy cannot then be filled legally.  And if this is in fact the case, we cannot go making exceptions to the law.  The Con Con would then lose credibility.

indeed.

[Oakvale]

The ConCon already lacks credibility due to being stuffed with zombie voters, dullards and most obviously, half (!!!!) the far-right Senate. Not to mention the reactionary conspiracy to elect Cris as the presiding officer by leaving me off the ballot. Just let's all agree Duke should be a delegate and move on.

[Oakvale]

I assume this will be a lost cause since it's utterly dominated by ultra-conservatives (in the 'game reform' sense) of various affiliations like Yankee, Kalwejt, PiT, CLASSIC CONSERVATIVE, various Labor zombies etc etc etc but I will try my utmost to represent the people shut out of the convention by the undemocratic Senate.

yes, yes, it's very democratic to unilaterally seize control of almost half the delegate positions, we know.

I love how Evergreen is accusing the Senate of being "undemocratic" when she literally suggested choosing delegates based on post count.

And Oakvale, I'd love to see a list of the so-called "Labor zombies" that supposedly control the convention. Of the six Laborites attending the Convention, the only one who has not been consistently active over the past month is the president, who you continue to defend despite all rationality. That being the case, I'll just assume that you're blowing smoke as usual and have no intention of doing anything remotely constructive. 

I'll do my utmost to try and bring some reason to proceedings but look at the list of people attending - we've got ultra-conservatives (those resistant to anything but the most superficial change), conservatives (those who want some change but want to ultimately save the current system, not replace it) and only a few radicals.

Northeast: Oakvale (radical), Winfield (ultra-conservative) RGN08 (ultra-conservative), Clyde1998 (radical)

Mideast: JCL (lmao), Windjammer (conservative), vivaportugalhabs (clone of windjammer), NeverAgain (clone of windjammer) (truly shocking results in the Mideast tbh)

South: NCYankee (lmao), Leinad (ultra-conservative), Adam Griffin (has a credible plan but will ultimately be concerned with sustaining indefinitely the failed communist system)

Midwest: Cris (ultra-conservative), Marokai (conservative)

Pacific: Simfan (conservative), Classic Conservative (lmao)

Senators: Kalwejt (RIP), Lumine (ultra-conservative), RPryor (ultra-conservative), Harry S Truman (conservative), PiT (ultra-conservative)

conservative: Tmthforu94 (conservative), Clark Kent (ultra-conservative)

progressive: Bore, (radical) evergreen (radical)

centrist: BMotley (ultra-conservative)

[Oakvale]

Also can someone give a good reason why someone like Verin, who's been championing radical change in Atlasia for the better part of a decade, is not a delegate?

[Classic Conservative]

Also can someone give a good reason why someone like Verin, who's been championing radical change in Atlasia for the better part of a decade, is not a delegate?

Beacuse he didn't sign up.

[Classic Conservative]

So anyone who isn't in the NNP or Bore is conservative??? Are you sure about that???

[Clark Kent]

I don't think it can hurt to invite Canada to the ConCon. Worst case scenario, they decline.

[Senator Cris]

About the Kalwejt seat. It's true that there is nothing on a replacement, but who imagined that a Senator would have resign from his delegate spot? However, even if there isn't a wrote rule, it's clear that he should be replaced by a Senator, because Kalwejt was selected as a representative of the Senate.
About Duke: If it's for me, he'd be a delegate. He's really a capable person, but he didn't run for the delegate election and he didn't declared his intention to be selected by the Senate. So a delegate spot for Duke is nothing granted.

The ConCon already lacks credibility due to being stuffed with zombie voters, dullards and most obviously, half (!!!!) the far-right Senate. Not to mention the reactionary conspiracy to elect Cris as the presiding officer by leaving me off the ballot. Just let's all agree Duke should be a delegate and move on.

LOL. There isn't any conspiracy. I'm sure Senator PiT will not have nothing against opening a new vote with you on the ballot. We'll see the results

I'll do my utmost to try and bring some reason to proceedings but look at the list of people attending - we've got ultra-conservatives (those resistant to anything but the most superficial change), conservatives (those who want some change but want to ultimately save the current system, not replace it) and only a few radicals.

Northeast: Oakvale (radical), Winfield (ultra-conservative) RGN08 (ultra-conservative), Clyde1998 (radical)

Mideast: JCL (lmao), Windjammer (conservative), vivaportugalhabs (clone of windjammer), NeverAgain (clone of windjammer) (truly shocking results in the Mideast tbh)

South: NCYankee (lmao), Leinad (ultra-conservative), Adam Griffin (has a credible plan but will ultimately be concerned with sustaining indefinitely the failed communist system)

Midwest: Cris (ultra-conservative), Marokai (conservative)

Pacific: Simfan (conservative), Classic Conservative (lmao)

Senators: Kalwejt (RIP), Lumine (ultra-conservative), RPryor (ultra-conservative), Harry S Truman (conservative), PiT (ultra-conservative)

conservative: Tmthforu94 (conservative), Clark Kent (ultra-conservative)

progressive: Bore, (radical) evergreen (radical)

centrist: BMotley (ultra-conservative)

That's only garbage. I'm not an ultra-conservative, as a lot of other delegates aren't ultra conservative on this matter. We can be conservatives or not in policy matters, but not at this time. You are saying that I'm an ultra conservative, when I was an advocate for Constitutional Convention (the same convention in which you are a delegate now) from the first day.

Also can someone give a good reason why someone like Verin, who's been championing radical change in Atlasia for the better part of a decade, is not a delegate?

He didn't declared candidacy for the delegate election. Then he ran as a write-in candidate, but he lost that election. Then the undemocratic Senate included him on the ballot for centrist delegate, but he was not selected. Are these good reasons?