Constitutional Convention - Commentary thread.

[Classic Conservative]

I'm not a lmao on this matter or even a conservative I want radical change but not seccesion, the NNP in la la land here thinks everyone who doesn't want Northeast independence is anti-change.

[Oakvale]

The Constitutional Convention as opposed to just collectively saying "let's try something else" was inherently a conservative idea.

[Senator Cris]

The Constitutional Convention as opposed to just collectively saying "let's try something else" was inherently a conservative idea.

So why are you serving in it?

[Fmr. Pres. Duke]

Well, I'm glad that the convention at least sees me "capable enough" to be a delegate seeing as I was the original author of the plan many are championing now.

Feel free to pluck someone else out of the senate. I'm just offering my services.

[Senator Cris]

Well, I'm glad that the convention at least sees me "capable enough" to be a delegate seeing as I was the original author of the plan many are championing now.

Feel free to pluck someone else out of the senate. I'm just offering my services.

There were a lot of occasions for being a delegate. Looks like there is still a way for you to be a delegate thanks to the Senate replacement.

Some people are saying that is unconstitutional that the Senate will pick the Kalwejt's replacement.
I'd like to remember that including independents on the famous Senate ballot was "unconstitutional" too, but no one had anything to say at that time.

[Marokai Backbeat]

Marokai (conservative)

what

[Fmr. Pres. Duke]

This convention is starting off well.

Marokai has always been a big proponent of game reform. We wanted to be even more radical when we ran for office together but had to tone it down because of fear we'd set off a lot of conservatives.

[Leinad]

I'm in favor of making Duke a delegate, no matter what rules we need to create/use in order to do it. I mean, we obviously need to pick someone, right?

If it could be done legally, since this is a seat that is one of 5 Senators that was elected by the Senate, as mandated by the delegate selection rules, then this seat should go to the Senator who finished next in line in this Senate election.

Only problem is that those 5 Senators were the only Senators in that election. Cris and Yankee were elected via the regions, while JoMCaR, New Canadaland, and Cassius declined to run at all.

The ConCon already lacks credibility due to being stuffed with zombie voters, dullards and most obviously, half (!!!!) the far-right Senate.

So you're against voting for delegates and against the Senate picking delegates...I'm sorry, how are we supposed to choose delegates?

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It was a mistake, not a conspiracy. Take off the tin-foil hat.

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Well, I agree with that.

Leinad (ultra-conservative)

...how in the seven circles of hades am I ultra-conservative?!?

[windjammer]

I assume this will be a lost cause since it's utterly dominated by ultra-conservatives (in the 'game reform' sense) of various affiliations like Yankee, Kalwejt, PiT, CLASSIC CONSERVATIVE, various Labor zombies etc etc etc but I will try my utmost to represent the people shut out of the convention by the undemocratic Senate.

yes, yes, it's very democratic to unilaterally seize control of almost half the delegate positions, we know.

I love how Evergreen is accusing the Senate of being "undemocratic" when she literally suggested choosing delegates based on post count.

And Oakvale, I'd love to see a list of the so-called "Labor zombies" that supposedly control the convention. Of the six Laborites attending the Convention, the only one who has not been consistently active over the past month is the president, who you continue to defend despite all rationality. That being the case, I'll just assume that you're blowing smoke as usual and have no intention of doing anything remotely constructive. 

I'll do my utmost to try and bring some reason to proceedings but look at the list of people attending - we've got ultra-conservatives (those resistant to anything but the most superficial change), conservatives (those who want some change but want to ultimately save the current system, not replace it) and only a few radicals.

Northeast: Oakvale (radical), Winfield (ultra-conservative) RGN08 (ultra-conservative), Clyde1998 (radical)

Mideast: JCL (lmao), Windjammer (conservative), vivaportugalhabs (clone of windjammer), NeverAgain (clone of windjammer) (truly shocking results in the Mideast tbh)

South: NCYankee (lmao), Leinad (ultra-conservative), Adam Griffin (has a credible plan but will ultimately be concerned with sustaining indefinitely the failed communist system)

Midwest: Cris (ultra-conservative), Marokai (conservative)

Pacific: Simfan (conservative), Classic Conservative (lmao)

Senators: Kalwejt (RIP), Lumine (ultra-conservative), RPryor (ultra-conservative), Harry S Truman (conservative), PiT (ultra-conservative)

conservative: Tmthforu94 (conservative), Clark Kent (ultra-conservative)

progressive: Bore, (radical) evergreen (radical)

centrist: BMotley (ultra-conservative)

Lmao

[Southern Senator North Carolina Yankee]

Marokai as a Conservative, that was a criticism I thought he long ago lived down. Wasn't it Napleon or someone who made that accusation first.

Hard not to ROTFLOL watching someone frantically trying to get everyone dancing on his rhetorical tune or even better, measuring their own proposals against his measuring sticks. Amazing how someone who labels as conservatives and reactionaries, well established socialists with a long history of supporting reforms (stretching back to when that certain someone was still sucking up to the establishment mind you) and yet is regarded as so credible by so many.

[Oakvale]

Enjoy ROTFLOLing!

[Southern Senator North Carolina Yankee]

Uh, I just finished. I am gonna need about ten seconds to recharge, okay.

Enjoy ROTFLOLing!

Never mind we're back in business.

Be a sport and fetch daddy another beer just like you did when you were serving real dinosaurs, I am still too busy err ROTFLOLing.

[SUSAN CRUSHBONE]

Adam Griffin (has a credible plan but will ultimately be concerned with sustaining indefinitely the failed communist system)

Lmao

1. Write-in: Harry S. Truman
2. Cris
3. oakvale
4. Leinad

[Simfan34]

Labor still is, and shall always remain, the enemy. Let no one think that the Reform/South American question in any way changes this.

[Türkisblau]

I suppose this belongs here more.

why isn't oakvale on the ballot?

Yea, the vote should be restarted.

A shining success, boys. I can't wait to see this efficiency in action when you all get into the nitty gritty of revising a constitution!

[Unconditional Surrender Truman]

Adam Griffin (has a credible plan but will ultimately be concerned with sustaining indefinitely the failed communist system)

Lmao

1. Write-in: Harry S. Truman
2. Cris
3. oakvale
4. Leinad

Wait, I'm a communist now? The Jacobins are getting desperate, it seems. Thus far, I've been accused of being a "fascist," a "conservative," and a "communist," all in the span of two weeks!

[SUSAN CRUSHBONE]

Adam Griffin (has a credible plan but will ultimately be concerned with sustaining indefinitely the failed communist system)

Lmao

1. Write-in: Harry S. Truman
2. Cris
3. oakvale
4. Leinad

Wait, I'm a communist now? The Jacobins are getting desperate, it seems. Thus far, I've been accused of being a "fascist," a "conservative," and a "communist," all in the span of two weeks!

i'm speaking more about the "failed system" part, which is indisputable

[Unconditional Surrender Truman]

Adam Griffin (has a credible plan but will ultimately be concerned with sustaining indefinitely the failed communist system)

Lmao

1. Write-in: Harry S. Truman
2. Cris
3. oakvale
4. Leinad

Wait, I'm a communist now? The Jacobins are getting desperate, it seems. Thus far, I've been accused of being a "fascist," a "conservative," and a "communist," all in the span of two weeks!

i'm speaking more about the "failed system" part, which is indisputable

I see... so, Griffin voted to make me President of the ConCon, and this is somehow evidence of his nefarious scheme to maintain the status quo? This makes sense, because I am clearly a high-ranking member of the political elite (registered for 10 whole months!) with a vested interest in keeping newbies like Oakvale from gaining power... oh, wait.

[SUSAN CRUSHBONE]

hahaha are you seriously trying to claim that oakvale represents the status quo and you and cris don't

[Unconditional Surrender Truman]

hahaha are you seriously trying to claim that oakvale represents the status quo and you and cris don't

Yes, I am. It makes no sense for Oakvale to claim that he is less entrenched in the current system, and less responsible for what it has become, than someone who joined this game 10 months ago. He's free to offer alternative solutions to the current crisis - in fact, I encourage it - but the charge that I am some sort of establishment figure is clearly ridiculous. Do you really expect people to believe that a man who has been registered with the Census Bureau for 5+ years, who was prominent enough to be a presidential candidate in 2011, and who has held the same office for two years straight is the 'agent of change'? In any case, anyone who has payed even the slightest attention to what Cris, I, and others have said and done over the last four months knows that we support radical changes to the system: the world is not divided between secessionists and statists.

[Oakvale]

I'd actually argue that, by and large and with obvious exceptions like Yankee, it's the newer players that are far more conservative in terms of reform than those of us who've been around a disgustingly long time and know Atlasia's played itself out.

[Unconditional Surrender Truman]

I'd actually argue that, by and large and with obvious exceptions like Yankee, it's the newer players that are far more conservative in terms of reform than those of us who've been around a disgustingly long time and know Atlasia's played itself out.

I don't mean this to be combative, so I apologize if it sounds that way, but nevertheless: if you're convinced that Atlasia has "played itself out," as you say, why are you still here? It would seem that the existence of another game (South America) would provide the perfect solution, allowing the old guard to wipe the slate clean and start fresh while leaving the newbies to rebuild Atlasia. I can understand why you and others would be bored or disillusioned with Atlasia (who wouldn't be, after playing for so long?), but I'm puzzled as to why you chose to remain, especially when an alternative is so readily available. I'm genuinely curious.

[SUSAN CRUSHBONE]

hahaha are you seriously trying to claim that oakvale represents the status quo and you and cris don't

Yes, I am. It makes no sense for Oakvale to claim that he is less entrenched in the current system, and less responsible for what it has become, than someone who joined this game 10 months ago. He's free to offer alternative solutions to the current crisis - in fact, I encourage it - but the charge that I am some sort of establishment figure is clearly ridiculous. Do you really expect people to believe that a man who has been registered with the Census Bureau for 5+ years, who was prominent enough to be a presidential candidate in 2011, and who has held the same office for two years straight is the 'agent of change'? In any case, anyone who has payed even the slightest attention to what Cris, I, and others have said and done over the last four months knows that we support radical changes to the system: the world is not divided between secessionists and statists.

i'm honestly baffled as to how a smart person like you could make such an incredibly dumb post.

1.  the supreme court doesn't actually have any significant amount of power w/r/t game reform issues. or at all, really.

2. xahar was registered 5 years ago. so was snowstalker. are you claiming they wouldn't be outsiders today?

3. you're a senator who aligns with the game-reform views of most, if not all, of the senate. you're an establishment figure.

4. what offices or histories you two have is entirely irrelevant anyway - your policies are the policies of the status quo, and oakvale's decidedly aren't.

5. changing the number of regions doesn't qualify as "radical changes to the system."

6. existing in a system is a different thing from supporting it or contributing to its continuation. your whole argument reminds me of the old "a ~real~ socialist would stop using all products produced by capitalism" trope.

[Unconditional Surrender Truman]

Arguing that my policies support the "status quo" is like saying the policies of the Republican Party in the 1850s supported slavery: it completely ignores the substance of the proposals in question and instead seizes on the existence of even more radical ideas as evidence of alleged statism. Neither I, nor you, nor anyone at the Constitutional Convention supports maintaining the existing state of affairs; we merely differ in the extent to which the system must be rebuilt. Like you, I support a totally new charter of government, an end to the current Regional system (not just consolidation, but devolution as well), and a legislative "blank slate": I simply support doing so before we scrap the existing government. Why? Because writing a new Constitution with rules in place to guide the process, rather than a free-for-all dominated by the loudest voices, is more likely to produce a game enjoyable for all. If that makes me a "conservative", so be it.

[Simfan34]

I'd actually argue that, by and large and with obvious exceptions like Yankee, it's the newer players that are far more conservative in terms of reform than those of us who've been around a disgustingly long time and know Atlasia's played itself out.

Then perhaps those are tired should move on and let the newbies have their fun rather than ruin the game for everyone. Or at the very least come forth with new proposals.