So the Lichtman Test so far
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  So the Lichtman Test so far
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SteveRogers
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« Reply #75 on: May 17, 2016, 01:40:13 AM »

Key 4: There is no significant third-party or independent candidacy.
Licthmann defines "significant" as earning 5%. Webb isn't going to do that and it's probably too late for Trump to go indy, so FALSE.

Shouldn't that be listed as true, then?

Key 11: There has been a major military or foreign policy success during the term.
TRUE. The opening of Cuba relations and Iran deal would definitely qualify.

If you say so. Most people don't care about either of those things or even have a negative view of them.

The real problem on Key #4 is whether the Third Party nominee draws significant support from the incumbent's Party. So if some conservative independent runs and gets a significant support largely from Republicans, then the test would say FALSE when the effect is basically TRUE.

Third-Party nominees hurt

Democrats in 1948
Democrats in 1968
Democrats in 1980
Republicans in 1992
Republicans in 1996 (but the test would have shown Clinton being hurt).



This ^^^^
More to the point, Key 4 seems useless as a predictive tool since in elections where there is a noteworthy third party candidate this will be the one key that cannot be called until after the election. Look at 2000: In June and July of that year, Nader was polling at 5-6%, so at that point that key could be considered turned against the Democrats. And in the last 2 months of the election Nader's polling still fluctuated between 2 and 4%. But of course Nader finished with only 2.7%, so Key 4 resolves as a TRUE after the fact and the model is praised for correctly "predicting" Gore's victory in the popular vote.  Ugh.

Same thing in 1980. If you were looking to the Keys at this point in the 1980 election you'd confidently declare Key 4 turned to FALSE since John Anderson was polling in the mid-20s. But of course he only finished with 6.7%, a photo finish for Key 4.

Same thing in 1996. You wouldn't have known until election night whether Perot was really going to get over 5%.

Ugh.
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Attorney General, Senator-Elect, & Former PPT Dwarven Dragon
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« Reply #76 on: July 25, 2016, 09:41:49 PM »

Update. Things getting pretty dire for Dems.

Key 1: The incumbent party (in this case, Democrats) holds more seats in the U. S. House of Representatives after the midterm election than after the preceding midterm election.
FALSE

Key 2: There is no serious contest for the incumbent-party nomination.
Lichtmann defined "serious contest" as the nominee winning less than 2/3 of the delegates. So serious contest means Sanders getting 1590 delegates (including supers). Even without his supers, he's over 1800. He's also awakened a sector of the Dem Party that hates Hillary and is willing to even boo their own standardbearer to show it. The public definitely perceives him as a serious challenger.
FALSE

Key 3: The incumbent-party candidate is the current president.
FALSE

Key 4: There is no significant third-party or independent candidacy.
Licthmann defines "significant" as earning 5%. While Stein won't get anywhere close to that, it looks like Johnson could make it. We have to wait for a possible fade, so UNKNOWN for the moment.

Key 5: The economy is not in recession during the campaign. UNKNOWN

Key 6: Real (constant-dollar) per capita economic growth during the term equals or exceeds mean growth for the preceding two terms. TRUE

Key 7: The incumbent administration has effected major policy changes during the term. FALSE

Key 8: There has been no major social unrest during the term.
AMBIGUOUS. The whole police brutality/BLM movement might qualify. Depends on whether people see Trump as the solution to this or not.

Key 9: The incumbent administration is untainted by major scandal.
TRUE.

Key 10: There has been no major military or foreign policy failure during the term.
Barring any major development, TRUE

Key 11: There has been a major military or foreign policy success during the term.
Likely TRUE. The opening of Cuba relations and Iran deal would definitely qualify, as long as people see them as an accomplishment.

Key 12: The incumbent-party candidate is charismatic or is a national hero.
FALSE.

Key 13: The challenger is not charismatic and is not a national hero.
You can make the argument that you can't be charismatic when you're unpopular, but you can't deny that Trump is a great orator. He also draws much bigger crowds than Hillary and his "base supporters" are more excited about voting for him than Hillary's "base supporters". Litchman will probably sway this one whichever way keeps his model intact. But I still feel like it should be put at FALSE.

6 FALSE
4 TRUE
2 Unknown
1 Ambiguous

Six "False" is required for the incumbent party to lose. Even if we flip the last key to True, that doesn't give Hillary much leeway - a strong Johnson performance, a last-minute recession, BLM protests turning people to Trump, or people not seeing Obama foreign policy as a success would turn the election to Trump.

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SteveRogers
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« Reply #77 on: July 25, 2016, 10:30:08 PM »

Stop.
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Attorney General, Senator-Elect, & Former PPT Dwarven Dragon
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« Reply #78 on: July 25, 2016, 10:45:34 PM »


I'm just inputting the data. If all the keys were at "Hillary", I'd say that.
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