thread for the current pacific crisis

[Bacon King]

I made this thread so we won't have disjoined conversations across different people's offices.

After examining the Regional Constitution, I am fairly certain that Ebowed remains CJO of the Pacific (unless he has done something in the interim that would have removed him from office).

It's also true that there is no Governor, no Speaker, and no method of selecting either.

I call upon Pacific Justice Ebowed to use my visionary precedent that I set here to install a technocrat leader who can bring stability back to the region

[Türkisblau]

Yes, as I interpret the Constitution:

1. The only time to appoint a new CJO is within 10 days of the June elections barring the office is vacant due to resignation/impeachment.
2. It is true Simfan "dismissed" ebowed within 10 days of the June elections (but Governors can't just "dismiss" the CJO), and he never appointed anyone else. Ebowed was never removed through the formal process.
3. Then it goes that ebowed was "automatically reappointed" because the governor "did nothing" ie. appoint a new CJO.

It would be easier for all involved if we just recognized ebowed as CJO so he could open up special elections to solve all this nonsense.

[Classic Conservative]

I believe Ebowed is still CJO beacuse the Governor can't dismiss him and he has been pardoned also by Simfan many months ago.

[Adam Griffin]

Yes, as I interpret the Constitution:

1. The only time to appoint a new CJO is within 10 days of the June elections barring the office is vacant due to resignation/impeachment.
2. It is true Simfan "dismissed" ebowed within 10 days of the June elections (but Governors can't just "dismiss" the CJO), and he never appointed anyone else. Ebowed was never removed through the formal process.
3. Then it goes that ebowed was "automatically reappointed" because the governor "did nothing" ie. appoint a new CJO.

It would be easier for all involved if we just recognized ebowed as CJO so he could open up special elections to solve all this nonsense.

Well, that's just an asinine assumption and stretches the interpretation way too far to even be considered; "the CJO that was dismissed gets automatically placed back into office if nothing is done within an arbitrary time-period as interpreted as me, and oh by the way, there's nothing in the Constitution about that"?

Furthermore, there is nothing in the Constitution that states that the Speaker must be elected every two months, or even be elected at all:

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So let's see the statute passed that dictates Council rules (which may or may not exist) that confirms the Speaker must be elected by formal vote every two months.

Also, BK, you told Simfan when he started this nonsense that you ended emergency powers as Pacific CJO like a year or so ago but you're citing them - are they in effect or are they not?

[Türkisblau]

Griffin, please at least get a cursory knowledge on how the Council operates if you want to pass judgments!

https://uselectionatlas.org/AFEWIKI/index.php/Rules_of_Order_of_the_Legislative_Council_(Pacific_Region)#Section_3._The_Speaker

[Bacon King]

The emergency powers aren't in effect but the precedent is there for the Justice if he wants to do something similar

[Bacon King]

Also the Constitution doesn't give the Governor the authority to dismiss a Justice, only to replace them, which Simfan did not do

[Türkisblau]

Yes, as I interpret the Constitution:

1. The only time to appoint a new CJO is within 10 days of the June elections barring the office is vacant due to resignation/impeachment.
2. It is true Simfan "dismissed" ebowed within 10 days of the June elections (but Governors can't just "dismiss" the CJO), and he never appointed anyone else. Ebowed was never removed through the formal process.
3. Then it goes that ebowed was "automatically reappointed" because the governor "did nothing" ie. appoint a new CJO.

It would be easier for all involved if we just recognized ebowed as CJO so he could open up special elections to solve all this nonsense.

Well, that's just an asinine assumption and stretches the interpretation way too far to even be considered; "the CJO that was dismissed gets automatically placed back into office if nothing is done within an arbitrary time-period as interpreted as me, and oh by the way, there's nothing in the Constitution about that"?

Read the section of the Constitution pertaining to the Justice, please. The time period is not arbitrary and is clearly set out. The Governor can not dismiss the Justice and automatic reappointment occurs if the Governor does not appoint another CJO within 10 days of the June elections.

Simfan illegally attempted to "dismiss" ebowed and never appointed anyone else. Thus, by the way the Constitution operates, ebowed was automatically reappointed CJO for another year long term.

[Adam Griffin]

Griffin, please at least get a cursory knowledge on how the Council operates if you want to pass judgments!

https://uselectionatlas.org/AFEWIKI/index.php/Rules_of_Order_of_the_Legislative_Council_(Pacific_Region)#Section_3._The_Speaker

Fabulous! So that makes document doesn't define the duration of the term "session", and as best I can tell, we are still in the same session in which the current Speaker was elected based on the Governor's thread, "16th Pacific LegCo introduction and discussion thread". So why did a new election for Speaker need to be held?

[Türkisblau]

Griffin, please at least get a cursory knowledge on how the Council operates if you want to pass judgments!

https://uselectionatlas.org/AFEWIKI/index.php/Rules_of_Order_of_the_Legislative_Council_(Pacific_Region)#Section_3._The_Speaker

Fabulous! So that makes document doesn't define the duration of the term "session", and as best I can tell, we are still in the same session in which the current Speaker was elected based on the Governor's thread, "16th Pacific LegCo introduction and discussion thread". So why did a new election for Speaker need to be held?

According to common sense, sessions start every time there are new council elections of course. The fact that the same thread was used is an oversight and an overt mistake.

Again, if you read the Rules of Order, you would know that even if Classic didn't need to be elected Speaker again, he ceased being Speaker and actually lost his Council seat due to inactivity.

[Adam Griffin]

Griffin, please at least get a cursory knowledge on how the Council operates if you want to pass judgments!

https://uselectionatlas.org/AFEWIKI/index.php/Rules_of_Order_of_the_Legislative_Council_(Pacific_Region)#Section_3._The_Speaker

Fabulous! So that makes document doesn't define the duration of the term "session", and as best I can tell, we are still in the same session in which the current Speaker was elected based on the Governor's thread, "16th Pacific LegCo introduction and discussion thread". So why did a new election for Speaker need to be held?

According to common sense, sessions start every time there are new council sessions of course. The fact that the same thread was used is an oversight and an overt mistake.

Again, if you read the Rules of Order, you would know that even if Classic didn't need to be elected Speaker again, he ceased being Speaker and actually lost his Council seat due to inactivity.

According to common sense, a refusal to renew the term of a CJO doesn't automatically result in the CJO being put back into office

[Türkisblau]

Griffin, please at least get a cursory knowledge on how the Council operates if you want to pass judgments!

https://uselectionatlas.org/AFEWIKI/index.php/Rules_of_Order_of_the_Legislative_Council_(Pacific_Region)#Section_3._The_Speaker

Fabulous! So that makes document doesn't define the duration of the term "session", and as best I can tell, we are still in the same session in which the current Speaker was elected based on the Governor's thread, "16th Pacific LegCo introduction and discussion thread". So why did a new election for Speaker need to be held?

According to common sense, sessions start every time there are new council sessions of course. The fact that the same thread was used is an oversight and an overt mistake.

Again, if you read the Rules of Order, you would know that even if Classic didn't need to be elected Speaker again, he ceased being Speaker and actually lost his Council seat due to inactivity.

According to common sense, a refusal to renew the term of a CJO doesn't automatically result in the CJO being put back into office

According to the text of the Constitution, the current CJO is automatically reappointed to another year long term if another individual isn't appointed CJO.

[Adam Griffin]

Griffin, please at least get a cursory knowledge on how the Council operates if you want to pass judgments!

https://uselectionatlas.org/AFEWIKI/index.php/Rules_of_Order_of_the_Legislative_Council_(Pacific_Region)#Section_3._The_Speaker

Fabulous! So that makes document doesn't define the duration of the term "session", and as best I can tell, we are still in the same session in which the current Speaker was elected based on the Governor's thread, "16th Pacific LegCo introduction and discussion thread". So why did a new election for Speaker need to be held?

According to common sense, sessions start every time there are new council sessions of course. The fact that the same thread was used is an oversight and an overt mistake.

Again, if you read the Rules of Order, you would know that even if Classic didn't need to be elected Speaker again, he ceased being Speaker and actually lost his Council seat due to inactivity.

According to common sense, a refusal to renew the term of a CJO doesn't automatically result in the CJO being put back into office

According to the text of the Constitution, the current CJO is automatically reappointed to another year long term if another individual isn't appointed CJO.

No, at least not any more than the current Speaker is still Speaker and can reassume his position by posting in the appropriate regional thread

[Adam Griffin]

Also here's the entirety of the original thread you deleted:

http://imgur.com/SUzSG2N

[Türkisblau]

Griffin, please at least get a cursory knowledge on how the Council operates if you want to pass judgments!

https://uselectionatlas.org/AFEWIKI/index.php/Rules_of_Order_of_the_Legislative_Council_(Pacific_Region)#Section_3._The_Speaker

Fabulous! So that makes document doesn't define the duration of the term "session", and as best I can tell, we are still in the same session in which the current Speaker was elected based on the Governor's thread, "16th Pacific LegCo introduction and discussion thread". So why did a new election for Speaker need to be held?

According to common sense, sessions start every time there are new council sessions of course. The fact that the same thread was used is an oversight and an overt mistake.

Again, if you read the Rules of Order, you would know that even if Classic didn't need to be elected Speaker again, he ceased being Speaker and actually lost his Council seat due to inactivity.

According to common sense, a refusal to renew the term of a CJO doesn't automatically result in the CJO being put back into office

According to the text of the Constitution, the current CJO is automatically reappointed to another year long term if another individual isn't appointed CJO.

No, at least not any more than the current Speaker is still Speaker and can reassume his position by posting in the appropriate regional thread

Why do you show such a fundamental misunderstanding of the Pacific Constitution and Statute and find yourself such an authority on it?

BaconKing is well-versed in Pacific law as a former CJO and he says that there is a good argument for ebowed still being CJO, and the fact that there is no speaker.

[Türkisblau]

The Rules of Order state that if a Speaker is inactive for 3 days he loses his position and his council seat! If Classic was still Speaker this session he would have lost the Speakership and his council seat because he was inactive since the 21st!

Why are you being so dense? Are you and Classic Conservative in some sort of cahoots, but that can't be because even he recognizes ebowed is still CJO!

[Classic Conservative]

Well I do think I am still Speaker since I posted a minute before the seven days.

[Adam Griffin]

The Rules of Order state that if a Speaker is inactive for 3 days he loses his position and his council seat! If Classic was still Speaker this session he would have lost the Speakership and his council seat because he was inactive since the 21st!

Why are you being so dense? Are you and Classic Conservative in some sort of cahoots, but that can't be because even he recognizes ebowed is still CJO!

No, the Rules of Order state:

You must be logged in to read this quote.

Why are you being so dense?

[Adam Griffin]

Classic Conservative, now that you've re-activated your Speakership, I'd go ahead and open your Acting Governor's Office since you're next in the line of succession.

As for me, well, I just can't wait to be President!

[Türkisblau]

It is beside the point, Classic Conservative was never made Speaker this session (this session being since the elections in August.)

[Unconditional Surrender Truman]

This, friends, is why we need a three-region map.

[Classic Conservative]

It is beside the point, Classic Conservative was never made Speaker this session (this session being since the elections in August.)

The session problem is none of the councils concern my friend the Governor opens the new council thread not the Speaker. I have no say in that part, I sent Sinfan a text telling him to swear in and open the council thread which he didn't.

[Classic Conservative]

This, friends, is why we need a three-region map.

I agree, I'm so looking forward to this day.

[Türkisblau]

It is beside the point, Classic Conservative was never made Speaker this session (this session being since the elections in August.)

The session problem is none of the councils concern my friend the Governor opens the new council thread not the Speaker. I have no say in that part, I sent Sinfan a text telling him to swear in and open the council thread which he didn't.

Yes, that is the Governor's oversight and is one of the many reasons why Simfan should have been impeached long ago.

I find it astounding that we are trying to redefine what a "session" consitutes, though! You needed to be reelected Speaker after each council election, Classic.

[Classic Conservative]

It is beside the point, Classic Conservative was never made Speaker this session (this session being since the elections in August.)

The session problem is none of the councils concern my friend the Governor opens the new council thread not the Speaker. I have no say in that part, I sent Sinfan a text telling him to swear in and open the council thread which he didn't.

Yes, that is the Governor's oversight and is one of the many reasons why Simfan should have been impeached long ago.

I find it astounding that we are trying to redefine what a "session" consitutes, though! You needed to be reelected Speaker after each council election, Classic.

If we find out that Ebowed isn't still the CJO, which I think he is or he doesn't give us the heads up in less than 72 hours, I'd like to ask my fellow Atlasians on this thread, if everyone here would be fine if I open the thread since I'm technically in line after him since I'm the most senior member.