Missouri Bill Would Put State Gun Sales Under Same Restrictions as Abortions

[🐒Gods of Prosperity🔱🐲💸]

Because killing your child and buying a tool for protecting your home should be treated the same...

I love how every part of this post is wrong.

No children are killed in an abortion. A gun is a weapon, not a "tool." And owning a gun makes your household less safe.

What do you think an abortion is?   What do you think a tool is?   

[🐒Gods of Prosperity🔱🐲💸]

Because killing your child and buying a tool for protecting your home should be treated the same...

I love how every part of this post is wrong.

No children are killed in an abortion. A gun is a weapon, not a "tool." And owning a gun makes your household less safe.

What do you think an abortion is?   

The termination of a fetus. >99.9% of the time, this is done before a. the point of viability and b. the threshold significant neurological development and activity.

No, it isn't.  You're just making up a statistic.  Viability is a completely arbitrary distinction in determining value, as is what you consider to be significant neurological development. This is a child, regardless of whatever competency tests you want to introduce.  A very young child in the first stages of development, yes. Just admit you don't think these children have any value. 

You must be logged in to read this quote.

Are you intentionally dense?

Clearly a weapon is a subset of a tool. Let's call a spade a spade and not obfuscate a gun's true purpose: to more easily facilitate the injury or killing of another.
[/quote]

Yes, that's why it is potentially useful for protection. 

Are you intentionally an annoying cockalorum?

[🐒Gods of Prosperity🔱🐲💸]

No, it isn't.  You're just making up a statistic.

99% within 20 weeks. That's well within the constraints what Roe laid down for viability or the benchmarks of brain development.

You must be logged in to read this quote.

You and I, and 7 billion other human beings on this planet, are the manifested consciousness in our brains. We can think and reason. That is where the "being" in human being resides. That is what truly makes us a unique person. You have to choose some criterion, and there is a reason why brain death is defined as definitive death in our legal system. It's logical, from both a legal and a philosophical perspective, that the beginning ought be placed at the onset of this activity.

Sure, the exact moment of this is arbitrary, but there are definitive benchmarks when we can draw the line. The large-scale linking up of neurons in the fetus doesn't occur until between the 24th-27th weeks of pregnancy. You don't see a regular pattern of brain waves until the 30th week. Fetuses lack the necessary architecture to be a person until this point. It also happens that nearly (again >=99%) of abortions happen well before the 24 week mark. No murder is occurring here.

I don't buy into Cartesian dualism.  We are the sum totals of ourselves, not only our ability for  reason divorced from bodily experience.  Giving people IQ tests to determine if they are dumb enough to kill is something I hope we can generally manage to avoid.
I have no idea what you mean by "large-scale linking up of neurons" since the nervous system develops to a great extent very early, since otherwise it would be impossible for the fetus to move or even have functioning organs.  Brain death is a completely different thing from having a brain that is functioning and developing. 

You must be logged in to read this quote.

We have conflicting definitions of what a child is. Potential to be a child does not equate to being a child in my view. As to the value, I leave that to be determined by each individual pregnant woman to make that determination herself. Nice attempt to smear my character though, but I suppose that's always a given with you.
[/quote]

It's not smearing your character. It is an accurate statement of your value system. I'm sure you are very sincere or whatever in holding this value system but that is beside the point. If you believe a life is not worthy of either identity to be called as such or a right to be protected from violence, then you do not value that life in any meaningful sense aside from perhaps instrumentally.

You must be logged in to read this quote.

Congrats, you found a dictionary to try and up the ante of your personal attack!
[/quote]

you complain about personal attacks?  lol   There were plenty of words I could have used that were more familiar but also more uncharitable.  "Cockalorum" seemed the most appropriate word to use without too greatly overstepping the line of decency. 

[🐒Gods of Prosperity🔱🐲💸]

You must be logged in to read this quote.

We have conflicting definitions of what a child is. Potential to be a child does not equate to being a child in my view. As to the value, I leave that to be determined by each individual pregnant woman to make that determination herself. Nice attempt to smear my character though, but I suppose that's always a given with you.

It's not smearing your character. It is an accurate statement of your value system. I'm sure you are very sincere or whatever in holding this value system but that is beside the point. If you believe a life is not worthy of either identity to be called as such or a right to be protected from violence, then you do not value that life in any meaningful sense aside from perhaps instrumentally.[/quote]

Its potential wholly depends on the mother exclusively, so why does it deserve to be granted its own identity unless the mother grants it one?

Awful, terrible question for you: Do you mourn the same for a natural early-term miscarriage as you do the death of a two-year-old?

Don't worry, I think I know the awful, terrible answer already, you don't need to say anything. Shouldn't have brought it up really.
[/quote]

I view identity as a human being as an intrinsic characteristic, not something that can granted or taken away by the wishes of someone.

Would you mourn more for a pet who died or five random people in Africa?  Don't worry, I think I know the answer.  Not sure why that sort of question is relevant here though.

[🐒Gods of Prosperity🔱🐲💸]

You must be logged in to read this quote.

We have conflicting definitions of what a child is. Potential to be a child does not equate to being a child in my view. As to the value, I leave that to be determined by each individual pregnant woman to make that determination herself. Nice attempt to smear my character though, but I suppose that's always a given with you.

It's not smearing your character. It is an accurate statement of your value system. I'm sure you are very sincere or whatever in holding this value system but that is beside the point. If you believe a life is not worthy of either identity to be called as such or a right to be protected from violence, then you do not value that life in any meaningful sense aside from perhaps instrumentally.

Its potential wholly depends on the mother exclusively, so why does it deserve to be granted its own identity unless the mother grants it one?

Awful, terrible question for you: Do you mourn the same for a natural early-term miscarriage as you do the death of a two-year-old?

Don't worry, I think I know the awful, terrible answer already, you don't need to say anything. Shouldn't have brought it up really.
[/quote]

I view identity as a human being as an intrinsic characteristic, not something that can granted or taken away by the wishes of someone.

Would you mourn more for a pet who died or five random people in Africa?  Don't worry, I think I know the answer.  Not sure why that sort of question is relevant here though.
[/quote]

btw Tik, maybe in the future don't try to use the idea of someone mourning over a miscarriage as some kind of sick burn.  might not go over well with some people,  and I would hope you wouldn't want to tell someone that they are a terrible person for the depths of their reaction to such an event in their own family.