SE8- The Ron Paul Act of 2016 (passed)

[Former Senator Haslam2020]

The Ron Paul Act of 2016:

1. The police can not lie to get confessions.
2. The police cannot go through your documents, or home without a warrant, and if they do they shall face a $50,000 fine and go to court on charges of invasion of privacy, should an officer do this.
3. This act would call for small cameras to be put on each officer, they'd cost about $50 dollars each, setting aside around 300,000 dollars to supply these cameras.
4. The police can not demand people to stop recording police situations.
5. This act states the government shall encourage PEACEFUL demonstrations if any sort of police brutality happens, the officer likely won't get away with it.
6. If somehow a prisoner in the South has been labeled not guilty of something and has served in prison for something they didn't commit, they shall be liable to a 3,000 dollar grant for each year they served. (of course they will be labeled innocent with proper investigations, of course)

Sponsor: Speaker Haslam

I think this act would benefit officers and citizens of the South.

Debate?

[Former Senator Haslam2020]

I think it's great!

[Classic Conservative]

I think that we definitely need criminal justice reform in Atlasia but encouraging citizens to protest the police, I don't think that's a good idea. Think about it for a second Haslam we are first infringing on the officers rights to tell bystanders to put away the camera because A, a video can be tampered and edited B, we are basically telling citizens you should go out in the street whenever the police murders someone without knowing all the facts because we believe innocent until proven guilty and there will always be a bad soul in the crowd that will start ruckus. And we are giving money to people because there piers falsely accused them, this bill is two crony capitalist and anti-police for me to support. But I will still support sections 2 and 3. I urge all assemblymen to vote NAY

[NeverAgain]

I think that we definitely need criminal justice reform in Atlasia but encouraging citizens to protest the police, I don't think that's a good idea. Think about it for a second Haslam we are first infringing on the officers rights to tell bystanders to put away the camera because A, a video can be tampered and edited B, we are basically telling citizens you should go out in the street whenever the police murders someone without knowing all the facts because we believe innocent until proven guilty and there will always be a bad soul in the crowd that will start ruckus. And we are giving money to people because there piers falsely accused them, this bill is two crony capitalist and anti-police for me to support. But I will still support sections 2 and 3. I urge all assemblymen to vote NAY

This bill seems logical and protects the people's right to assemble. If there is corruption or illegal actions going on in our legal process the people have a right to protest this without intervention, especially from the same corrupt people they are protesting. Innocent until proven guilty still applies to our criminal justice system, not our citizens. I don't know who are these "bad souls" are in the crowds, but it seems like that relates pretty closely to the "bad souls" that brutally beat up our citizens. This isn't anti-police, if anything its pro-constitution.

[Former Senator Haslam2020]

Thank you Governor, and Mr. Secretary, I understand your concerns but if a video is to be tampered with, the officer has cameras to prove his innocence. I believe if police brutality is occurring, it should be stopped. And also, we should protect peoples' right to protest... PEACEFULLY. This would not encourage any wrong doing, and I believe it is a step in the right direction

[pikachu]

A few comments on this:

• Allocating only $300,000 to body cameras will barely cover southern Florida, let alone all of the South.
  
• I'm confused by what the goal of clause 5 is.
• Isn't clause 2 already law, or does Atlasia not have search/seizure protections? (Which, considering the historical ideology of this game, would genuinely surprise me.)

[Leinad]

1. The police can not lie to get confessions.

Great idea, but we've already done this--it was actually one of the first things I introduced: the Police Honesty Act.

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I like this, good.

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Not too expensive, and I think it's worth it. This is something that helps both the police officers and the criminals in case something bad happens.

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I disagree with Classic--this is a good thing. The police has no "right" to infringe on civilian's rights to, well, police the police. If they're doing something wrong, we should try to catch it, and if they're not, what's to worry about?

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Again, I disagree with Classic, the right to assembly is a VERY important right. Just like the other rights in the first amendment to the US constitution (including freedom of religion, freedom of speech, and freedom of the press) this is one where if we lose it, we've taken a MASSIVE step towards tyranny.

Government/law enforcement can't and shouldn't be trusted to solve it's own problems without assistance. Oftentimes if good citizens see a problem, it's a big help to our Republic if they enact measures, such as peaceful protest, to fix them. And if there is a "bad soul" (I swear, you're either getting into some odd philosophy or just became my grandmother ) causing ruckus, the usual methods of combating this are not restricted by this law.

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I think there's already laws regarding that, but I don't know right off hand what they are.


Anyway, it's a great bill, and while it might need some touching up, I look forward to signing it if Steelers and Pingvin are also willing.

[Classic Conservative]

My point is we shouldn't encourage people to protest.

[Kingpoleon]

I think that we definitely need criminal justice reform in Atlasia but encouraging citizens to protest the police, I don't think that's a good idea. Think about it for a second Haslam we are first infringing on the officers rights to tell bystanders to put away the camera because A, a video can be tampered and edited B, we are basically telling citizens you should go out in the street whenever the police murders someone without knowing all the facts because we believe innocent until proven guilty and there will always be a bad soul in the crowd that will start ruckus. And we are giving money to people because there piers falsely accused them, this bill is two crony capitalist and anti-police for me to support. But I will still support sections 2 and 3. I urge all assemblymen to vote NAY

ROFL at part B.

Also, $300,000 is 6,000 officers. Perhaps 250,000 officers, or $10,000,000, is a better goal.

[Leinad]

My point is we shouldn't encourage people to protest.

Hmmm...maybe it would be better to have it where it punishes the police for trying to stop peaceful protest, and reiterates the responsibility of the citizens to make sure the protest stays peaceful and doesn't get out of hand?


Also, while I do genuinely enjoy hearing others' thoughts on the matter--I really do--I'd like to see what Pingvin and Steelers think.

[Former Senator Haslam2020]

I like those ideas!! Also 10,000,000 is a good number, it's a lot but it'll stop chaos from ever reaching our streets. And hm.. Officers for peaceful protest get I don't know... Any ideas?

[Ex-Assemblyman Steelers]

I support this bill.

[Former Senator Haslam2020]

Let's put this up to a vote. AYE!!!

[Pingvin]

Aye.

[Ex-Assemblyman Steelers]

Aye!

[Former Senator Haslam2020]

This act has passed! A truly momentous occasion for the South!

[Leinad]

Sigh...

It was not ready to be voted on.

Section 1 is redundant--it's not hard to amend it to only include 2-6. Did literally no one read me pointing that out?

Also, no attempt was made to improve the rest of the bill. First of all, how many police officers are in the South? That would be an important question to ask. Also, while I'm okay with the current protest section, I'm sure it could be improved. Not to mention the wording of the bill could be helped in several places--I can look at that in the next couple of days and come up with a better-worded version.

We should continue debate and re-vote on this when we're ready.

[Former Senator Haslam2020]

Sigh...

It was not ready to be voted on.

Section 1 is redundant--it's not hard to amend it to only include 2-6. Did literally no one read me pointing that out?

Also, no attempt was made to improve the rest of the bill. First of all, how many police officers are in the South? That would be an important question to ask. Also, while I'm okay with the current protest section, I'm sure it could be improved. Not to mention the wording of the bill could be helped in several places--I can look at that in the next couple of days and come up with a better-worded version.

We should continue debate and re-vote on this when we're ready.

I guess, put your amendment of the bill in the legislation thread and we'll take a look at it

[Blair]

Doesn't the Governor have a veto?

The South has just passed a law that encourages the state to encourage protests.

[Leinad]

Doesn't the Governor have a veto?

Yes, but I don't want to veto it. I'd rather just take another vote on an amended bill. Certainly either me or the Speaker can overturn the first vote.

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What's wrong with protests? It's a great way for people to make their case against injustices.

Although I do agree that section needs some touching-up.


I'll come up with an amended version shortly.

[Classic Conservative]

I'd be completely happy if you got rid of the encouragement of protesting and changed the title.

[Leinad]

I'd be completely happy if you got rid of the encouragement of protesting and changed the title.

What should the title be? Maybe the Criminal Justice Reform Act of 2016?

I'll go with that unless anyone has a better idea.


Here's my amendment:

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I struck section 1 and turned the old section 4 into a new 4 and 5--instead of encouraging protests, it puts a penalty on police for impeding peaceful protests.

Also, from a quick Google search I can find that there are 900k police officers in the whole US (i.e. Atlasia), so back-of-the-envelope about 150k-200k in the South. So this would cover most of them, and from what I can tell they often travel in pairs, so 100k should be enough. It's a lot of money, but the police (a force to protect people's rights to life, liberty, and property) is something that I think is within governmental jurisdiction.

How's that for governing!

Thoughts?

[Former Senator Haslam2020]

Great! I'll introduce it soon!

[Former Senator Haslam2020]

New Amendment:

The Criminal Justice Reform Act of 2016:

(Amendment on Ron Paul Act of 2016)

1. If a police officer goes through your documents or your home without a warrant they shall face a $50,000 fine and go to court on charges of invasion of privacy.
2. This act would call for small cameras to be put on each officer, supplying for 100,000 of these cameras (thus costing about $5,000,000).
3. The police can not demand people to stop recording police situations. If they do, there will be an ethics investigation, and they will face a fine of the wages that they miss.
4. This act reinforces the right to peaceful protest, and police officers will be punished if they infringe on that right by in any way impeding, discouraging, or abusing people legally protesting something.
5. The punishment for infringing on protest rights will be at least a weeks wages, and will be immediate dismissal and criminal charges if violence is involved on the part of the officer.
6. In the event that someone in the South serves time in prison for a crime it was proved that he/she didn't commit, he/she shall be liable to a 3,000 dollar grant for each year they served.

Sponsor: Governor Leinad

This is a good bill!

[Ex-Assemblyman Steelers]

Aye!