Will the Paid Speech Question followed by LBGT Rights damage Clinton's campaign?

[This account no longer in use.]

Although Sanders is a much better LGBT+ advocate, I believe that Clinton has redeemed herself on this issue, and that you should stop calling her out for it.

[ProgressiveCanadian]

Although Sanders is a much better LGBT+ advocate, I believe that Clinton has redeemed herself on this issue, and that you should stop calling her out for it.

I'd be fine if Clinton admitted that she was always for gay rights then i wouldn't criticize. It's when she says she evolved on the issue that gets me. No you did not evolve Hillary (also same for Obama) you just supported gays when Americas opinion changed.

[🦀🎂🦀🎂]

Because the Clintons (and Obama) hid their blatent support of gay rights behind weasel words, they would get elected and be able to nominate Ginsburg, Breyer, Kagan and Sotomayor. Perhaps you'd have preferred if they weren't elected at all on by endorsing a policy rejected wholesale by the majority of Americans at the time; with the result that there would probably be a Federal Marriage Amendment, Section 28 style legislation and a judicary overwhelmingly against gay rights?

[Taco Truck 🚚]

Because the Clintons (and Obama) hid their blatent support of gay rights behind weasel words, they would get elected and be able to nominate Ginsburg, Breyer, Kagan and Sotomayor. Perhaps you'd have preferred if they weren't elected at all on by endorsing a policy rejected wholesale by the majority of Americans at the time; with the result that there would probably be a Federal Marriage Amendment, Section 28 style legislation and a judicary overwhelmingly against gay rights?

No, man.  That's not how it works in America.  The Clintons and Obama were certainly NOT supporters of gay marriage and no American who was alive and conscious in the 90s would say otherwise.  I can't think of a single person I knew back then who supported gay marriage.

The idea that a governor of Arkansas back in the 90s was for gay marriage is ludicrous.

Having said that there is nothing wrong with changing your mind.  If supporting gay marriage in the early 90s is the litmus test 95+% of Dem politicians would have to resign on the spot.

In other words this is a complete nonissue.

I do take your meaning though on getting elected and the appointments.  But there is simply no way I can believe the Clintons nor Obama were thinking about gay marriage in the 90s.  No way.

[🦀🎂🦀🎂]

Obama claimed to support SSM when he was running in 1996. I don't when the Clintons started supporting it, but I highly doubt it was anything near when they claim to have changed their mind. I mean, the Clinton's aren't exactly earnest church types are they?

[Blair]

Gay people understand why it's not always easy to be a purist, and sacrifices and positioning have to be taken not just in politics but in every other realm of life related to being LGBT.

This 100%; gay rights in the 1990's/2000's where a lot different to what it was today (heck it was even a lot worse back in 2008)

[Higgs]

DOMA was an evil bill & Clinton should not have signed it - It set gay rights for a generation.

And the problem is not just 1996 but in 2007 she said the same when Obama openly said he supported Gay Marriage she said in a very brutal way "Marriage is between a man & a woman". It was much worse than Mitt Romney coming when it is coming from a so-called "Progressive" " No Champion of Gay Rights" Democrat candidate in 2007 when the other guy has supported it.

This was 2007, not 1996. She only turned in 2013 - when the whole country changed.

Does she deserve the gay vote over a candidate who was talking on GOP in 1995 for anti-gay speeches or voting against DOMA.

Are you completely illiterate? Read my post again.

I read that dumb post of yours & it was a pile of BS

For once, I can agree with the Bernie hacks.

[Landslide Lyndon]

DOMA was an evil bill & Clinton should not have signed it - It set gay rights for a generation.

And the problem is not just 1996 but in 2007 she said the same when Obama openly said he supported Gay Marriage she said in a very brutal way "Marriage is between a man & a woman". It was much worse than Mitt Romney coming when it is coming from a so-called "Progressive" " No Champion of Gay Rights" Democrat candidate in 2007 when the other guy has supported it.

This was 2007, not 1996. She only turned in 2013 - when the whole country changed.

Does she deserve the gay vote over a candidate who was talking on GOP in 1995 for anti-gay speeches or voting against DOMA.

Are you completely illiterate? Read my post again.

I read that dumb post of yours & it was a pile of BS

For onceAs usual, I can agree with the Bernie hacks.

Fixed.

[This account no longer in use.]

DOMA was an evil bill & Clinton should not have signed it - It set gay rights for a generation.

And the problem is not just 1996 but in 2007 she said the same when Obama openly said he supported Gay Marriage she said in a very brutal way "Marriage is between a man & a woman". It was much worse than Mitt Romney coming when it is coming from a so-called "Progressive" " No Champion of Gay Rights" Democrat candidate in 2007 when the other guy has supported it.

This was 2007, not 1996. She only turned in 2013 - when the whole country changed.

Does she deserve the gay vote over a candidate who was talking on GOP in 1995 for anti-gay speeches or voting against DOMA.

Are you completely illiterate? Read my post again.

I read that dumb post of yours & it was a pile of BS

For onceAs usual, I can agree with the Bernie hacks.

Fixed.

Please don't tell me you're accusing Higgs of being a hack now.

[Marokai Backbeat]

I have no serious issue with people making compromises and not being able to stand up for the right thing way back when. Just don't try to paint yourself as this champion for gay rights - like you've always been one. It honestly disgusts me. And it makes me think less of the people eating it all up.

[IceSpear]

Probably. The media cooks up all kinds of non-stories when the goal is to tarnish Hillary Clinton.

Just for fun, do a search of both Democratic candidates in Google News and look at the headlines. Most of the stories aren't really based on anything because not much has happened in terms of substance over the last few days. Yet somehow everything about Sanders is framed in this hopeful, optimistic, positive light, and everything about Clinton raises questions and doubts that have no grounding in reality.

Heh. I've actually noticed that since mid 2014 (the Clinton negativity and spin regardless of anything else.) Dead broke was the canary in the coal mine that this was gonna be ugly. A gaffe that would've been a week long story tops for any other politician was turned into a 6 month+ saga for Hillary.

Even still, I never imagined it would get so bad to the extent it is now. Our media is barely outside of North Korea territory at this point.

A few months before the start of her campaign I knew she needed to aggressively attack and discredit the media (her main opponents) the way the Republicans do, so their smears would have less and less of an effect. She needed to ingrain it into the voters' consciousness that they were vehemently against her. It would've given her a Trump-esque teflon quality, with every media hit job just further placing her supporters into a bunker mentality. Unfortunately, they didn't do this. Most voters and even many naive Democrats bought their smears hook, line, and sinker. It's not surprising they did though, since rather than attack the root of the problem, the Clinton campaign instead decided to try to treat the symptoms and attack and discredit an individual story, making it a near daily futile battle. Why they chose this route, I have no clue. Perhaps they were truly naive enough to think the media would not try to destroy her? Maybe they figured it wouldn't make a difference even if they did try to destroy her since it was so early in the campaign? Were the Obama alums so used to favorable treatment that they didn't even consider a plan on how to deal with a hostile media? Or were they just plain incompetent?  It's hard to say, but it seems to be the biggest mistake of her campaign.

[Shadows]

118 Democrats voted for DOMA & 65 against. So inn 1996 about 35% of the Democrats were for Gay Marriage, which honestly is huge. That was the age of Bill Clinton's New Democrats & Moderates & The president supported DOMA tacitly & didn't veto it. So there was a large section who were pro LGBT.

Now come to 2007, 20 years back when Obama pledged & more half of the Democrats supported Gary Marriage, Clinton was still firmly against it. So she was one of the last persons to embrace LGBT rights.

I don't blame Clinton - she can evolve from being a conservative. But when she says she has been championing gay rights over someone who fought against DOMA 20 years back, that's just phony.

[Averroës Nix]

This will probably be dismissed as crazy and hackish, but maybe coverage of Clinton has been negative and pessimistic because she's running a fairly negative, pessimistic, and defensive campaign? Just something to consider.

[IceSpear]

This will probably be dismissed as crazy and hackish, but maybe coverage of Clinton has been negative and pessimistic because she's running a fairly negative, pessimistic, and defensive campaign? Just something to consider.

It's been negative and pessimistic long before she even had a campaign, much less a coherent narrative about one could be formed.

[Higgs]

DOMA was an evil bill & Clinton should not have signed it - It set gay rights for a generation.

And the problem is not just 1996 but in 2007 she said the same when Obama openly said he supported Gay Marriage she said in a very brutal way "Marriage is between a man & a woman". It was much worse than Mitt Romney coming when it is coming from a so-called "Progressive" " No Champion of Gay Rights" Democrat candidate in 2007 when the other guy has supported it.

This was 2007, not 1996. She only turned in 2013 - when the whole country changed.

Does she deserve the gay vote over a candidate who was talking on GOP in 1995 for anti-gay speeches or voting against DOMA.

Are you completely illiterate? Read my post again.

I read that dumb post of yours & it was a pile of BS

For onceAs usual, I can agree with the Bernie hacks.

Fixed.

Lol, I guess I'm a Bernie hack now

[Landslide Lyndon]

DOMA was an evil bill & Clinton should not have signed it - It set gay rights for a generation.

And the problem is not just 1996 but in 2007 she said the same when Obama openly said he supported Gay Marriage she said in a very brutal way "Marriage is between a man & a woman". It was much worse than Mitt Romney coming when it is coming from a so-called "Progressive" " No Champion of Gay Rights" Democrat candidate in 2007 when the other guy has supported it.

This was 2007, not 1996. She only turned in 2013 - when the whole country changed.

Does she deserve the gay vote over a candidate who was talking on GOP in 1995 for anti-gay speeches or voting against DOMA.

Are you completely illiterate? Read my post again.

I read that dumb post of yours & it was a pile of BS

For onceAs usual, I can agree with the Bernie hacks.

Fixed.

Lol, I guess I'm a Bernie hack now

Nope, just a Republican hack propping up the man you hope will be easier to beat at the general.

[This account no longer in use.]

DOMA was an evil bill & Clinton should not have signed it - It set gay rights for a generation.

And the problem is not just 1996 but in 2007 she said the same when Obama openly said he supported Gay Marriage she said in a very brutal way "Marriage is between a man & a woman". It was much worse than Mitt Romney coming when it is coming from a so-called "Progressive" " No Champion of Gay Rights" Democrat candidate in 2007 when the other guy has supported it.

This was 2007, not 1996. She only turned in 2013 - when the whole country changed.

Does she deserve the gay vote over a candidate who was talking on GOP in 1995 for anti-gay speeches or voting against DOMA.

Are you completely illiterate? Read my post again.

I read that dumb post of yours & it was a pile of BS

For onceAs usual, I can agree with the Bernie hacks.

Fixed.

Lol, I guess I'm a Bernie hack now

Nope, just a Republican hack propping up the man you hope will be easier to beat at the general.

You are acting utterly delusional. I have not seen any evidence of Higgs being a hack for anybody.