Opinion of Abdel Fattah el-Sisi

[Orthogonian Society Treasurer]

It's nice to see how little democracy matters to the people in this thread.

Some things are more important than democracy. Like not having your head forcibly removed from your body.

But there have been far more executions under Sisi than Morsi? Is the faux secularism adopted by the regime really that important for you?

Yeah, it is. Secular authoritarianism is immeasurably better than Islamic authoritarianism.

"Oh no, mu family have all been disappeared, my kneecaps blown out and all my belongings distributed to regime cronies. I guess I'm pretty lucky though, nobody said "Allah Akhbar" in the process"

"Oh no, I'm being punished by the state for attempting to overthrow the state. This is truly unimaginable. If only I could have lived an Islamic democracy where the infidels, not I, were the ones being put to death."

[DavidB.]

Hate to say it but Clash is 100% right on in this thread.

[Хahar 🤔]

Hate to say it but Clash is 100% right on in this thread.

I don't get the sense that you hate to say it at all!

[DavidB.]

I don't get the sense that you hate to say it at all!

Do you really think I care about the sense you get?

[SATW]

I'm personally enjoying the ridiculousness of the left in this thread.

[Zioneer]

I'm personally enjoying the ridiculousness of the left in this thread.

We're not the ones supporting a dictator who seized power from a theoretically democratic system.

[Green Line]

I'm personally enjoying the ridiculousness of the left in this thread.

We're not the ones supporting a dictator who seized power from a theoretically democratic system.

His election was about as democratic as Hitlers was.  

[MASHED POTATOES. VOTE!]

It's nice to see how little democracy matters to the people in this thread.

Some things are more important than democracy. Like not having your head forcibly removed from your body.

But there have been far more executions under Sisi than Morsi? Is the faux secularism adopted by the regime really that important for you?

Yeah, it is. Secular authoritarianism is immeasurably better than Islamic authoritarianism.

"Oh no, mu family have all been disappeared, my kneecaps blown out and all my belongings distributed to regime cronies. I guess I'm pretty lucky though, nobody said "Allah Akhbar" in the process"

"Oh no, I'm being punished by the state for attempting to overthrow the state. This is truly unimaginable. If only I could have lived an Islamic democracy where the infidels, not I, were the ones being put to death."

F**king serious, man?

[Okay, maybe Mike Johnson is a competent parliamentarian.]

Terrible, terrible, terrible. Even if it's possible to make precisely historically conditional (as in, not '[population X] is inherently not Ready For Democracy') arguments for some degree of authoritarianism, the emphasis should always be on 'some degree of', and Sisi's regime is over-the-top, cartoonishly evil.

[Sir Mohamed]

HP. He is a stabilizing figure but nevertheless an autocrat or dictator. I read recent reports that state, that it's now even worse than under Mubarak.

[Antonio the Sixth]

Terrible, terrible, terrible. Even if it's possible to make precisely historically conditional (as in, not '[population X] is inherently not Ready For Democracy') arguments for some degree of authoritarianism, the emphasis should always be on 'some degree of', and Sisi's regime is over-the-top, cartoonishly evil.

This.

[MASHED POTATOES. VOTE!]

Trying to portray Sisi as some kind of your regular "enlightened despot" doesn't hold up.

[ingemann]

HP. He is a stabilizing figure but nevertheless an autocrat or dictator. I read recent reports that state, that it's now even worse than under Mubarak.

Of course it is, Mubarak had had decades to get rid of any serious opposition except the Muslim Brotherhood, he didn't need to break the neck on everybody raising their head. Sisi are still getting ridof opposition, as such he still need to crush skulls and break necks until he has consolidated power.

[ingemann]

Trying to portray Sisi as some kind of your regular "enlightened despot" doesn't hold up.

No he's a horrible excuse for a human being, but he's not our problem and I don't really think there's a realistic alternative to him, the Muslim Brotherhood are pretty horrible in their own right and worse they was even more incompetent than Mubarak (and likely Sisi), and I'm not really ready to make my blood boil for a alternative who want a even worse apartheid and misogynistic state than Egypt already is, no matter how democratic elected they are.

[🦀🎂🦀🎂]

I think Morsi's support was shallow enough that he'd probably have been defeated in a regular election anyway. Because the army shot the gun (and the non-Islamist opposition backed them up) now the Islamists have been handed the moral hand ground which is pretty grim. Except with the effective collapse of the relatively moderate MB, now the Islamist mantle has been handed to the Salafis.

[Sir Mohamed]

HP. He is a stabilizing figure but nevertheless an autocrat or dictator. I read recent reports that state, that it's now even worse than under Mubarak.

Of course it is, Mubarak had had decades to get rid of any serious opposition except the Muslim Brotherhood, he didn't need to break the neck on everybody raising their head. Sisi are still getting ridof opposition, as such he still need to crush skulls and break necks until he has consolidated power.

Agreed. He's not even democratically elected. Morsi wasn't a good guy, but at least he was elected.

[#TheShadowyAbyss]

HP for being a dictator on the levels of Mubarak, FF for keeping Ikhwan Muslimeen (Muslim Brotherhood) and other Salafist groups at bay.

[Okay, maybe Mike Johnson is a competent parliamentarian.]

HP for being a dictator on the levels of Mubarak, FF for keeping Ikhwan Muslimeen (Muslim Brotherhood) and other Salafist groups at bay.

The Ikhwan isn't Salafist.

Sisi has succeeded in making Salafists the only semi-credible opposition.

[#TheShadowyAbyss]

HP for being a dictator on the levels of Mubarak, FF for keeping Ikhwan Muslimeen (Muslim Brotherhood) and other Salafist groups at bay.

The Ikhwan isn't Salafist.

Sisi has succeeded in making Salafists the only semi-credible opposition.

They are Semi-Salafist, just not as radical as the main Salafist groups, they believe in the principles of the Salaf, we could go on about the definition of a Salafist is.

[Cory]

"Oh no, mu family have all been disappeared, my kneecaps blown out and all my belongings distributed to regime cronies. I guess I'm pretty lucky though, nobody said "Allah Akhbar" in the process"

Yeah, because Pre-Civil War Assad's Syria was just as bad as the Islamic State. *rolls eyes*

[Okay, maybe Mike Johnson is a competent parliamentarian.]

"Oh no, mu family have all been disappeared, my kneecaps blown out and all my belongings distributed to regime cronies. I guess I'm pretty lucky though, nobody said "Allah Akhbar" in the process"

Yeah, because Pre-Civil War Assad's Syria was just as bad as the Islamic State. *rolls eyes*

We are discussing Egypt. I don't think CrabCake would dispute that 'el-Sisi vs. the Ikhwan' is a different calculus than 'Assad vs. ISIS'; would you?