"Gay, transgender movements need a divorce"

[This account no longer in use.]

I agree. We need to fight against desperate creeps who post things like this:

You are a woman? Welcome to the forum! I hope you can ignore the extreme creepiness and crass sexism of some of our specimens, and focus on the few good things about it (maps, mostly).

[World politics is up Schmitt creek]

Why not come up with a phrase like Gender and Sexual Minorities (GSM) or something?

The idea is good in theory but hard to pull off. GSM is broad enough to include, and may have been intended to include, pedophiles. The similarly-intended MOGAI is broad enough to include all women.

[°Leprechaun]

Why not come up with a phrase like Gender and Sexual Minorities (GSM) or something?

The idea is good in theory but hard to pull off. GSM is broad enough to include, and may have been intended to include, pedophiles. The similarly-intended MOGAI is broad enough to include all women.

The term "queer" is all inclusive and many use it to identify themselves as such.
btw has it it occured to anyone that the term "gay" itself is problematic to describe a male? It seems to imply being effeminate, and although there is nothing wrong with being sensitive or effeminate, not all homosexual males are.

[Sprouts Farmers Market ✘]

Why not come up with a phrase like Gender and Sexual Minorities (GSM) or something?

The idea is good in theory but hard to pull off. GSM is broad enough to include, and may have been intended to include, pedophiles. The similarly-intended MOGAI is broad enough to include all women.

The term "queer" is all inclusive and many use it to identify themselves as such.
btw has it it occured to anyone that the term "gay" itself is problematic to describe a male? It seems to imply being effeminate, and although there is nothing wrong with being sensitive or effeminate, not all homosexual males are.

There is nothing wrong with the term. Everyone knows what it means. This isn't the 1950s.

[°Leprechaun]

Why not come up with a phrase like Gender and Sexual Minorities (GSM) or something?

The idea is good in theory but hard to pull off. GSM is broad enough to include, and may have been intended to include, pedophiles. The similarly-intended MOGAI is broad enough to include all women.

The term "queer" is all inclusive and many use it to identify themselves as such.
btw has it it occured to anyone that the term "gay" itself is problematic to describe a male? It seems to imply being effeminate, and although there is nothing wrong with being sensitive or effeminate, not all homosexual males are.

There is nothing wrong with the term. Everyone knows what it means. This isn't the 1950s.

There is nothing wrong with the term, but it is slang.

[Famous Mortimer]

A break between the gay and trans movements would be politically impossible at this point. The only way I could see it happening (and it's extremely unlikely) is if gays started voting Republican and the Republican establishment accepted them as "more normal" and the trans people remained Democrats.

[Figueira]

Why not come up with a phrase like Gender and Sexual Minorities (GSM) or something?

The idea is good in theory but hard to pull off. GSM is broad enough to include, and may have been intended to include, pedophiles. The similarly-intended MOGAI is broad enough to include all women.

The term "queer" is all inclusive and many use it to identify themselves as such.
btw has it it occured to anyone that the term "gay" itself is problematic to describe a male? It seems to imply being effeminate, and although there is nothing wrong with being sensitive or effeminate, not all homosexual males are.

There is nothing wrong with the term. Everyone knows what it means. This isn't the 1950s.

There is nothing wrong with the term, but it is slang.

It's not slang anymore.

[HagridOfTheDeep]

I prefer gay over queer. Queer connotes abnormality, like there's something about me that's just "off." Since it's a broad category, being called queer, to me, feels like I'm being thrown into a pile of misfits and outcasts. I prefer identifying as gay, even though I hate having to label sexuality at all, because I feel like there's more of a defined gay movement and sense of unity within that movement. There's a longer tradition of gay activism within Western communities, which makes me feel like an entrenched part of society, even if it's "subaltern." Everyone knows what it means to be gay; it has its place now—grudgingly accepted, but still something people understand as part of the human story. Plus, I kind of identify with the "gay culture," whereas queer makes me sound too much like a part of the rainbow coalition. I am a part of it, but I don't want that to be my whole narrative.

So I in terms of me, I would rather just use the most accurate descriptor than make some sort of political statement by calling myself queer. I'm still a part of the LGBT community, but I'll identify how I want for my own reasons, and others can do the same. Hopefully we'll still have each other's backs.

[Reginald]

I am genuinely shocked that Daugaard vetoed that bill. I can't believe it.

Maybe it's a good time for you to reassess your views on the issue. 

For some reason the existance of trans people really really offends him for some reason.

It's more of the idea of men in women's bathrooms and women in men's bathrooms that offends me. I don't see this as a partisan issue, I don't see it as right vs. left, I see it as right vs. wrong.

Fun fact: There is such a thing as unisex bathrooms. What excuse do you have for your obsessive transphobia now?

I don't have a problem with unisex bathrooms. That's fine. But men using women's bathrooms is just nonsensical. This is common sense. You shouldn't need a law to tell you this. But I also think this whole "gender is between your ears" thing is just more new age "Special Snowflake" bulls**it.

What about transmen?

Should they be forced to use the women's bathroom despite looking like this?

(pic)

OK well now I'm confused. So unisex bathrooms are wrong? I'm not expecting every trans person to magically have the same view here, but this is completely contradicting the "it's just a bathroom, no need for segregation" argument.

[This account no longer in use.]

I am genuinely shocked that Daugaard vetoed that bill. I can't believe it.

Maybe it's a good time for you to reassess your views on the issue. 

For some reason the existance of trans people really really offends him for some reason.

It's more of the idea of men in women's bathrooms and women in men's bathrooms that offends me. I don't see this as a partisan issue, I don't see it as right vs. left, I see it as right vs. wrong.

Fun fact: There is such a thing as unisex bathrooms. What excuse do you have for your obsessive transphobia now?

I don't have a problem with unisex bathrooms. That's fine. But men using women's bathrooms is just nonsensical. This is common sense. You shouldn't need a law to tell you this. But I also think this whole "gender is between your ears" thing is just more new age "Special Snowflake" bulls**it.

What about transmen?

Should they be forced to use the women's bathroom despite looking like this?

(pic)

OK well now I'm confused. So unisex bathrooms are wrong? I'm not expecting every trans person to magically have the same view here, but this is completely contradicting the "it's just a bathroom, no need for segregation" argument.

Unisex bathrooms are wrong. It's just that putting transmen into women's bathrooms would make the same people who want trans women to be forced into men's bathrooms feel awfully squeamish. Ironic, eh?

[Firestorm]

Being gay is genetic and biological. I have two lesbian aunts, a gay uncle, four gay cousins, and I'm gay. It runs in my family.

O_o How has your family not gone extinct?

[Ban my account ffs!]

Why not come up with a phrase like Gender and Sexual Minorities (GSM) or something?

The idea is good in theory but hard to pull off. GSM is broad enough to include, and may have been intended to include, pedophiles. The similarly-intended MOGAI is broad enough to include all women.

The term "queer" is all inclusive and many use it to identify themselves as such.
btw has it it occured to anyone that the term "gay" itself is problematic to describe a male? It seems to imply being effeminate, and although there is nothing wrong with being sensitive or effeminate, not all homosexual males are.

No.. I'm not a queer or queer.  That is an offensive term and I refuse to "own it" or wear it as some badge of honor. 

[World politics is up Schmitt creek]

btw has it it occured to anyone that the term "gay" itself is problematic to describe a male? It seems to imply being effeminate, and although there is nothing wrong with being sensitive or effeminate, not all homosexual males are.

jfc

[afleitch]

btw has it it occured to anyone that the term "gay" itself is problematic to describe a male? It seems to imply being effeminate, and although there is nothing wrong with being sensitive or effeminate, not all homosexual males are.

jfc

Indeed.

[SUSAN CRUSHBONE]

btw has it it occured to anyone that the term "gay" itself is problematic to describe a male? It seems to imply being effeminate, and although there is nothing wrong with being sensitive or effeminate, not all homosexual males are.

not really. the concept of homosexuality itself is socially associated with beïng effeminate and thus any word would have the same connotation.

[Bojack Horseman]

Veto override failed in the SD House today.

What other states could this possibly pass in?

[SUSAN CRUSHBONE]

Veto override failed in the SD House today.

this is a good thing, you sociopath.

[°Leprechaun]

btw has it it occured to anyone that the term "gay" itself is problematic to describe a male? It seems to imply being effeminate, and although there is nothing wrong with being sensitive or effeminate, not all homosexual males are.

not really. the concept of homosexuality itself is socially associated with beïng effeminate and thus any word would have the same connotation.

The point is that many, if not a majority of gay men, are not effeminate. Again, I don't see anything wrong with being effeminate, some straight men are as well, but why is that not a stereotype? That was the point of my question. (btw I didn't want to derail this thread, perhaps this question is off topic)

[This account no longer in use.]

Veto override failed in the SD House today.

What other states could this possibly pass in?

In a perfect world, none of them.

[SUSAN CRUSHBONE]

btw has it it occured to anyone that the term "gay" itself is problematic to describe a male? It seems to imply being effeminate, and although there is nothing wrong with being sensitive or effeminate, not all homosexual males are.

not really. the concept of homosexuality itself is socially associated with beïng effeminate and thus any word would have the same connotation.

The point is that many, if not a majority of gay men, are not effeminate. Again, I don't see anything wrong with being effeminate, some straight men are as well, but why is that not a stereotype? That was the point of my question. (btw I didn't want to derail this thread, perhaps this question is off topic)

of course it's a stereotype. but it's a stereotype of the people themselves, and swapping out the word won't suddenly end it.

[°Leprechaun]

btw has it it occured to anyone that the term "gay" itself is problematic to describe a male? It seems to imply being effeminate, and although there is nothing wrong with being sensitive or effeminate, not all homosexual males are.

not really. the concept of homosexuality itself is socially associated with beïng effeminate and thus any word would have the same connotation.

The point is that many, if not a majority of gay men, are not effeminate. Again, I don't see anything wrong with being effeminate, some straight men are as well, but why is that not a stereotype? That was the point of my question. (btw I didn't want to derail this thread, perhaps this question is off topic)

of course it's a stereotype. but it's a stereotype of the people themselves, and swapping out the word won't suddenly end it.

I agree, of course, I don't think it would. Although the stereotype is used in a negative way to insult men. "Girly man" "Nancy" etc. These are obviously meant as insults. By the way, some take it as offensive to women as well.

edit: btw I am also aware that the term "queer" is considered offensive. It has used as a put down for gays for a long time. Most people don't use it to mean strange anymore (except in the phrase "There's none so queer as folk", in which the meaning of the term should be obvious).

[Antonio the Sixth]

Veto override failed in the SD House today.

What other states could this possibly pass in?

Seriously, f**k off.

[DavidB.]

btw has it it occured to anyone that the term "gay" itself is problematic to describe a male? It seems to imply being effeminate, and although there is nothing wrong with being sensitive or effeminate, not all homosexual males are.

not really. the concept of homosexuality itself is socially associated with beïng effeminate and thus any word would have the same connotation.

I agree with tmcusa that the word "gay" has that connotation more "inherently", others would have it just by association. But yes, it is likely that other words would, in fact, get that connotation in time, and the connotation is what matters most. In Dutch, the term "homo" is more neutral / less "effeminate" than "gay" (but in English it's the other way around).

of course it's a stereotype. but it's a stereotype of the people themselves, and swapping out the word won't suddenly end it.

Hmmm, most gay people seem to have a love/hate relationship with the stereotype.

As for the term queer, I find it... just very queer.

[Bojack Horseman]

I have to apologize for how hateful my comments were earlier. After some thought and introspection, I think this is another one of today's issues that is better resolved for both sides of the debate with Xanax. And that includes myself. I'm sorry for my comments.

[🦀🎂🦀🎂]

The problem with queer is that, as a reclaimed insult, it can't really be used by non- LGBT's without sounding wrong.