If the Confederacy Existed Today

[Progressive]

What would the confederate government look like? What national offices would exist? Who would hold these offices?

[Kingpoleon]

A Ted Cruz, Rand Paul, Mike Huckabee, and Bobby Jindal coalition controls AR, OK, KY, LA, and TX in most elections. I'll call this the "Nationalist Party", which is presumably a fair trade and non interventionist right wing group.

People like Jason Carter, Charlie Crist, Tom Davis, Lindsey Graham, and Peter Kander lead VA, NC, GA, SC, and FL, while MO tilts towards them. Let's call this the "Liberal Party".

MS, AL, WV, and TN are the main toss-ups. WV and TN probably lean towards the Liberals, while MS and AL seem more likely to be Nationalist.

Segregation is outlawed beginning in 1969, and everything except busing is gone by 1975. I'll say busing leaves in 1980 or so. By now, the Confederacy probably looks like this nationally:

President: Winthrop P. Rockefeller(L-AR)
Vice President: Harold Ford, Jr.(L-TN)


Speaker of the Senate

[Mike Thick]

I wonder how relations would have been between Cuba and the Confederacy.

[Sumner 1868]

It would be a WASP Protestant version of Saudi Arabia.

[Obama-Biden Democrat]

A Ted Cruz, Rand Paul, Mike Huckabee, and Bobby Jindal coalition controls AR, OK, KY, LA, and TX in most elections. I'll call this the "Nationalist Party", which is presumably a fair trade and non interventionist right wing group.

People like Jason Carter, Charlie Crist, Tom Davis, Lindsey Graham, and Peter Kander lead VA, NC, GA, SC, and FL, while MO tilts towards them. Let's call this the "Liberal Party".

MS, AL, WV, and TN are the main toss-ups. WV and TN probably lean towards the Liberals, while MS and AL seem more likely to be Nationalist.

Segregation is outlawed beginning in 1969, and everything except busing is gone by 1975. I'll say busing leaves in 1980 or so. By now, the Confederacy probably looks like this nationally:

President: Winthrop P. Rockefeller(L-AR)
Vice President: Harold Ford, Jr.(L-TN)


Speaker of the Senate

There is no way in hell the Confederacy would have outlawed segregation in 1969. The South had to be dragged in kicking and screaming by the federal courts and Liberals to force them to accept racial equality.  There is a good chance that segregation would have lasted into the late 1990's or even today in the deep south.

[bagelman]

Americans who want sunny weather wouldn't consider FL, meaning SoCal would be even more crowded.

[Captain Chaos]

I doubt very much that West Virginia would join the CSA.

[KingSweden]

I began writing an alternative history novel last year imagining a Confederacy in the early 1970s where slavery had been outlawed but the conditions were essentially that of apartheid South Africa, with fluid politics among whites largely defined election-to-election and by the President's attitude towards the USA, which in this case had thoroughly embarrassed the CSA in WWI. The CSA is instead essentially a petrostate with a large agricultural sector, and minimal heavy industry. In the context of the plot, George Wallace enacts an oil embargo against the United States after Hubert Humphrey "insults" the South over its racial policies.

Sadly, I wasn't happy with the half-finished manuscript and a part of me died every time I wrote the n-word, so it will probably never see the light of day.

[beaver2.0]

I highly doubt Bobby Jindal would be elected in the Confederacy.  Catholics might have a lot of trouble as well, and without Northern investment, Northern Virginia and Florida could be much less urbanized, and therefore conservative.

[100% pro-life no matter what]

Well, I wouldn't exist, since my Southern WASP mom's side of the family and my Northern Irish Catholic dad's side of the family would have never met.

[Obama-Biden Democrat]

I highly doubt Bobby Jindal would be elected in the Confederacy.  Catholics might have a lot of trouble as well, and without Northern investment, Northern Virginia and Florida could be much less urbanized, and therefore conservative.

Agree on Florida, no way you get Disney World and West Palm Beach in the Confederacy, but Virginia would still become a hub for the college/postgrad educated over time due to Richmond being the national capital and a large diplomatic service in the DC area.  Nashville probably does still exist and against those surroundings, would likely be monolithically liberal in the way Hollywood is today.  Plus East Tennessee would resent the Confederate occupation to this day.  So the more I think about it, Tennessee and eventually Virginia would be the most politically moderate Confederate states.  Florida probably stays a backwater, almost to the degree it was in 1915. 

Yea the South historically was a huge backwater with large amounts of poverty and little industrialization. It wasn't until the 1930's with the New Deal and the 1940's with WW2 that you saw massive federal investments in the south. The federal government has also built up a gigantic network of military bases in the South, partially to provide jobs and boost the economy.  Those investments were largely fueled by Northern states, so the South would be really screwed here.

[RINO Tom]

A Ted Cruz, Rand Paul, Mike Huckabee, and Bobby Jindal coalition controls AR, OK, KY, LA, and TX in most elections. I'll call this the "Nationalist Party", which is presumably a fair trade and non interventionist right wing group.

People like Jason Carter, Charlie Crist, Tom Davis, Lindsey Graham, and Peter Kander lead VA, NC, GA, SC, and FL, while MO tilts towards them. Let's call this the "Liberal Party".

MS, AL, WV, and TN are the main toss-ups. WV and TN probably lean towards the Liberals, while MS and AL seem more likely to be Nationalist.

Segregation is outlawed beginning in 1969, and everything except busing is gone by 1975. I'll say busing leaves in 1980 or so. By now, the Confederacy probably looks like this nationally:

President: Winthrop P. Rockefeller(L-AR)
Vice President: Harold Ford, Jr.(L-TN)


Speaker of the Senate

There is no way in hell the Confederacy would have outlawed segregation in 1969. The South had to be dragged in kicking and screaming by the federal courts and Liberals Northerners (both conservative and liberal) to force them to accept racial equality.  There is a good chance that segregation would have lasted into the late 1990's or even today in the deep south.

Fixed that for ya.

[White Trash]

A Ted Cruz, Rand Paul, Mike Huckabee, and Bobby Jindal coalition controls AR, OK, KY, LA, and TX in most elections. I'll call this the "Nationalist Party", which is presumably a fair trade and non interventionist right wing group.

People like Jason Carter, Charlie Crist, Tom Davis, Lindsey Graham, and Peter Kander lead VA, NC, GA, SC, and FL, while MO tilts towards them. Let's call this the "Liberal Party".

MS, AL, WV, and TN are the main toss-ups. WV and TN probably lean towards the Liberals, while MS and AL seem more likely to be Nationalist.

Segregation is outlawed beginning in 1969, and everything except busing is gone by 1975. I'll say busing leaves in 1980 or so. By now, the Confederacy probably looks like this nationally:

President: Winthrop P. Rockefeller(L-AR)
Vice President: Harold Ford, Jr.(L-TN)


Speaker of the Senate

There is no way in hell the Confederacy would have outlawed segregation in 1969. The South had to be dragged in kicking and screaming by the federal courts and Liberals Northerners (both conservative and liberal) to force them to accept racial equality.  There is a good chance that segregation would have lasted into the late 1990's or even today in the deep south.

Fixed that for ya.

Don't mean to sound nastier than a honeybee in June, but every time anyone suggests that it was a liberal policy to end segregation, or even mentions that the Republicans of the 19th century were a tad more liberal than they are today, it's always you that comes to correct them. Is this your personal crusade on Atlas? You do understand that there are many ways to skin the cat when it comes to historical analysis, especially politically?

[FEMA Camp Administrator]

Devolves into a third world petro-state after the fall of the Soviet Union due to the United States withdrawing its funding. Free trade pact in the 1990's ensures its temporary survival as the US dumps its manufacturing into the largely un-unionized American South.

[Leinad]

Rand Paul never would've been in the CSA--Ron Paul grew up in Pennsylvania. Cruz's parents come from Delaware and Cuba, so I doubt he'd be in the Confederacy, either. And Jindal's parents come from India--they probably would've settled in the Union instead of the racist CSA, don't you think?

[/]

Rand Paul never would've been in the CSA--Ron Paul grew up in Pennsylvania. Cruz's parents come from Delaware and Cuba, so I doubt he'd be in the Confederacy, either. And Jindal's parents come from India--they probably would've settled in the Union instead of the racist CSA, don't you think?

But what if the Confederacy magically popped into existence in 2010?

[RINO Tom]

A Ted Cruz, Rand Paul, Mike Huckabee, and Bobby Jindal coalition controls AR, OK, KY, LA, and TX in most elections. I'll call this the "Nationalist Party", which is presumably a fair trade and non interventionist right wing group.

People like Jason Carter, Charlie Crist, Tom Davis, Lindsey Graham, and Peter Kander lead VA, NC, GA, SC, and FL, while MO tilts towards them. Let's call this the "Liberal Party".

MS, AL, WV, and TN are the main toss-ups. WV and TN probably lean towards the Liberals, while MS and AL seem more likely to be Nationalist.

Segregation is outlawed beginning in 1969, and everything except busing is gone by 1975. I'll say busing leaves in 1980 or so. By now, the Confederacy probably looks like this nationally:

President: Winthrop P. Rockefeller(L-AR)
Vice President: Harold Ford, Jr.(L-TN)


Speaker of the Senate

There is no way in hell the Confederacy would have outlawed segregation in 1969. The South had to be dragged in kicking and screaming by the federal courts and Liberals Northerners (both conservative and liberal) to force them to accept racial equality.  There is a good chance that segregation would have lasted into the late 1990's or even today in the deep south.

Fixed that for ya.

Don't mean to sound nastier than a honeybee in June, but every time anyone suggests that it was a liberal policy to end segregation, or even mentions that the Republicans of the 19th century were a tad more liberal than they are today, it's always you that comes to correct them. Is this your personal crusade on Atlas? You do understand that there are many ways to skin the cat when it comes to historical analysis, especially politically?

You don't sound nasty, much less nastier than this summertime bee you describe!  However, he didn't just say that Republicans of the past were a tad more liberal than today or that there are multiple ways to interpret political history; I would have had no issue with that.

He very clearly insinuated that liberals were solely responsible for pushing civil rights on the South, and that's literally a lie.

[White Trash]

A Ted Cruz, Rand Paul, Mike Huckabee, and Bobby Jindal coalition controls AR, OK, KY, LA, and TX in most elections. I'll call this the "Nationalist Party", which is presumably a fair trade and non interventionist right wing group.

People like Jason Carter, Charlie Crist, Tom Davis, Lindsey Graham, and Peter Kander lead VA, NC, GA, SC, and FL, while MO tilts towards them. Let's call this the "Liberal Party".

MS, AL, WV, and TN are the main toss-ups. WV and TN probably lean towards the Liberals, while MS and AL seem more likely to be Nationalist.

Segregation is outlawed beginning in 1969, and everything except busing is gone by 1975. I'll say busing leaves in 1980 or so. By now, the Confederacy probably looks like this nationally:

President: Winthrop P. Rockefeller(L-AR)
Vice President: Harold Ford, Jr.(L-TN)


Speaker of the Senate

There is no way in hell the Confederacy would have outlawed segregation in 1969. The South had to be dragged in kicking and screaming by the federal courts and Liberals Northerners (both conservative and liberal) to force them to accept racial equality.  There is a good chance that segregation would have lasted into the late 1990's or even today in the deep south.

Fixed that for ya.

Don't mean to sound nastier than a honeybee in June, but every time anyone suggests that it was a liberal policy to end segregation, or even mentions that the Republicans of the 19th century were a tad more liberal than they are today, it's always you that comes to correct them. Is this your personal crusade on Atlas? You do understand that there are many ways to skin the cat when it comes to historical analysis, especially politically?

You don't sound nasty, much less nastier than this summertime bee you describe!  However, he didn't just say that Republicans of the past were a tad more liberal than today or that there are multiple ways to interpret political history; I would have had no issue with that.

He very clearly insinuated that liberals were solely responsible for pushing civil rights on the South, and that's literally a lie.

That's quite reasonable. I simply misunderstood your verbiage. My sincerest apologies