Obama's Last Tango in Havana.
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  Obama's Last Tango in Havana.
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Author Topic: Obama's Last Tango in Havana.  (Read 1744 times)
Atlas Has Shrugged
ChairmanSanchez
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« on: March 21, 2016, 03:33:35 PM »

Am I the only one who is feeling sorry for the President? I support the Cuba opening and I strongly support the President's visit, but so far it has been a disaster.

Raul Castro didn't greet Obama at the airport, and instead made him travel to the Palace of the Revolution to kiss his ring.

Then, Castro did this today to make sure that Obama would return home to the wolves. Obama usually has a good poker face, but he knew exactly what was going on when Raul did this and his face showed it.

Lastly, I'm sure Fidel will show up uninvited and get in the picture with Obama. That is the last step in the process. The Castros are dragging Obama around like he's some type of parlor game.
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RightBehind
AlwaysBernie
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« Reply #1 on: March 21, 2016, 03:39:25 PM »

Slamming the U.S. on human rights isn't wrong.
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Atlas Has Shrugged
ChairmanSanchez
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« Reply #2 on: March 21, 2016, 04:21:34 PM »

Slamming the U.S. on human rights isn't wrong.
....while keeping hundreds of dissidents in prison at the same time?
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Blue3
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« Reply #3 on: March 21, 2016, 05:27:41 PM »

The trip is fine. Castro is Castro.

Obama is more interested in reaching out to the Cuban people, and opening up the world to the Cuban people, and is willing to put up with Raul to do that.
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RightBehind
AlwaysBernie
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« Reply #4 on: March 21, 2016, 06:16:38 PM »

Slamming the U.S. on human rights isn't wrong.
....while keeping hundreds of dissidents in prison at the same time?

I'm not saying Cuba is perfect either, but my fellow Americans need to realize we're not as saintly as often indoctrinated.
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CapoteMonster
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« Reply #5 on: March 21, 2016, 07:59:06 PM »

CS makes a good point, the Castro's behavior and oppression needs to affect our policy in terms of travel and trade. We can't empower the current regime.
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Stand With Israel. Crush Hamas
Ray Goldfield
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« Reply #6 on: March 21, 2016, 08:45:58 PM »

Obama got played hard by this entire visit and he probably doesn't even know it.

The Che photo may be the worst of the lot. I'd almost think the Castros want Trump to be elected.
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Vosem
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« Reply #7 on: March 21, 2016, 09:47:01 PM »

I'd almost think the Castros want Trump to be elected.

Of course they do. A man like that as President would certainly strengthen their regime (unless he invaded, but I guess they're gambling on him getting pissed at some other random countries).
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Atlas Has Shrugged
ChairmanSanchez
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« Reply #8 on: March 21, 2016, 10:48:08 PM »

Slamming the U.S. on human rights isn't wrong.
....while keeping hundreds of dissidents in prison at the same time?

I'm not saying Cuba is perfect either, but my fellow Americans need to realize we're not as saintly as often indoctrinated.
Of course not, but who are THEY to judge? Who are anyone to judge? With the exception of Canada perhaps, we're probably #1 in the world in terms of not having literally any political prisoners. 
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Gass3268
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« Reply #9 on: March 22, 2016, 01:09:56 AM »

How Obama set a trap for Castro
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Lexii, harbinger of chaos and sexual anarchy
Alex
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« Reply #10 on: March 22, 2016, 10:34:54 AM »

Slamming the U.S. on human rights isn't wrong.
....while keeping hundreds of dissidents in prison at the same time?

I'm not saying Cuba is perfect either, but my fellow Americans need to realize we're not as saintly as often indoctrinated.
Of course not, but who are THEY to judge? Who are anyone to judge? With the exception of Canada perhaps, we're probably #1 in the world in terms of not having literally any political prisoners. 

wutt?
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RightBehind
AlwaysBernie
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« Reply #11 on: March 22, 2016, 10:43:47 AM »
« Edited: March 22, 2016, 09:00:23 PM by AlwaysBernie »

Slamming the U.S. on human rights isn't wrong.
....while keeping hundreds of dissidents in prison at the same time?

I'm not saying Cuba is perfect either, but my fellow Americans need to realize we're not as saintly as often indoctrinated.
Of course not, but who are THEY to judge? Who are anyone to judge? With the exception of Canada perhaps, we're probably #1 in the world in terms of not having literally any political prisoners.  


You can nitpick and probably find something every country has done that wasn't morally right. We may not have political prisoners, but we have also committed war crimes and torturing is not something I support. The CIA papers released information that we did torture innocent people at Gitmo.

I stand with Obama's opinion that the embargo needs to be lifted. This isn't the Cold War anymore. Cuba is not the enemy. Look at Brussels and the perpetrators of the attacks. That is the enemy.

I also laugh when people stand in opposition to lifting the embargo or having some kind of relations with Cuba when one of our biggest allies is Saudi Arabia.
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Atlas Has Shrugged
ChairmanSanchez
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« Reply #12 on: March 22, 2016, 05:17:10 PM »

Slamming the U.S. on human rights isn't wrong.
....while keeping hundreds of dissidents in prison at the same time?

I'm not saying Cuba is perfect either, but my fellow Americans need to realize we're not as saintly as often indoctrinated.
Of course not, but who are THEY to judge? Who are anyone to judge? With the exception of Canada perhaps, we're probably #1 in the world in terms of not having literally any political prisoners. 


You can nitpick and probably find something every country has done that wasn't morally right. We may not have political prisoners, but we have also committed war crimes and torturing is not something I support. The CIA papers released information that we did torture innocent people at Gitmo.

I stand with Obama's opinion that the embargo needs to be lifted. This isn't the Cold War anymore. Cuba is not the enemy. Look at Brussels and the perpetrators of the attacks. That is the enemy.

I also laugh when people stand in opposition to lifting the embargo or having some kind of relations with Cuba when one of out biggest allies is Saudi Arabia.
I also am in favor of ending the embargo, stopping aid to the brutal Saudi regime, and closing Gitmo. Sure. That's all good.

Still doesn't change the fact that Cuba was and is worse when it comes to human rights.
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RightBehind
AlwaysBernie
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« Reply #13 on: March 22, 2016, 08:58:48 PM »

Slamming the U.S. on human rights isn't wrong.
....while keeping hundreds of dissidents in prison at the same time?

I'm not saying Cuba is perfect either, but my fellow Americans need to realize we're not as saintly as often indoctrinated.
Of course not, but who are THEY to judge? Who are anyone to judge? With the exception of Canada perhaps, we're probably #1 in the world in terms of not having literally any political prisoners. 


You can nitpick and probably find something every country has done that wasn't morally right. We may not have political prisoners, but we have also committed war crimes and torturing is not something I support. The CIA papers released information that we did torture innocent people at Gitmo.

I stand with Obama's opinion that the embargo needs to be lifted. This isn't the Cold War anymore. Cuba is not the enemy. Look at Brussels and the perpetrators of the attacks. That is the enemy.

I also laugh when people stand in opposition to lifting the embargo or having some kind of relations with Cuba when one of out biggest allies is Saudi Arabia.
I also am in favor of ending the embargo, stopping aid to the brutal Saudi regime, and closing Gitmo. Sure. That's all good.

Still doesn't change the fact that Cuba was and is worse when it comes to human rights.

So while Cuba may be worse, it might not equate to them being wrong when they criticized us.
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Atlas Has Shrugged
ChairmanSanchez
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« Reply #14 on: March 22, 2016, 09:29:39 PM »

Slamming the U.S. on human rights isn't wrong.
....while keeping hundreds of dissidents in prison at the same time?

I'm not saying Cuba is perfect either, but my fellow Americans need to realize we're not as saintly as often indoctrinated.
Of course not, but who are THEY to judge? Who are anyone to judge? With the exception of Canada perhaps, we're probably #1 in the world in terms of not having literally any political prisoners. 


You can nitpick and probably find something every country has done that wasn't morally right. We may not have political prisoners, but we have also committed war crimes and torturing is not something I support. The CIA papers released information that we did torture innocent people at Gitmo.

I stand with Obama's opinion that the embargo needs to be lifted. This isn't the Cold War anymore. Cuba is not the enemy. Look at Brussels and the perpetrators of the attacks. That is the enemy.

I also laugh when people stand in opposition to lifting the embargo or having some kind of relations with Cuba when one of out biggest allies is Saudi Arabia.
I also am in favor of ending the embargo, stopping aid to the brutal Saudi regime, and closing Gitmo. Sure. That's all good.

Still doesn't change the fact that Cuba was and is worse when it comes to human rights.

So while Cuba may be worse, it might not equate to them being wrong when they criticized us.
Might? No, it is wrong for them to criticize us on human rights issues. The embargo is different, but when it comes to our own human rights situation, they have no right to talk. At all.
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RightBehind
AlwaysBernie
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« Reply #15 on: March 22, 2016, 09:55:46 PM »

Slamming the U.S. on human rights isn't wrong.
....while keeping hundreds of dissidents in prison at the same time?

I'm not saying Cuba is perfect either, but my fellow Americans need to realize we're not as saintly as often indoctrinated.
Of course not, but who are THEY to judge? Who are anyone to judge? With the exception of Canada perhaps, we're probably #1 in the world in terms of not having literally any political prisoners. 


You can nitpick and probably find something every country has done that wasn't morally right. We may not have political prisoners, but we have also committed war crimes and torturing is not something I support. The CIA papers released information that we did torture innocent people at Gitmo.

I stand with Obama's opinion that the embargo needs to be lifted. This isn't the Cold War anymore. Cuba is not the enemy. Look at Brussels and the perpetrators of the attacks. That is the enemy.

I also laugh when people stand in opposition to lifting the embargo or having some kind of relations with Cuba when one of out biggest allies is Saudi Arabia.
I also am in favor of ending the embargo, stopping aid to the brutal Saudi regime, and closing Gitmo. Sure. That's all good.

Still doesn't change the fact that Cuba was and is worse when it comes to human rights.

So while Cuba may be worse, it might not equate to them being wrong when they criticized us.
Might? No, it is wrong for them to criticize us on human rights issues. The embargo is different, but when it comes to our own human rights situation, they have no right to talk. At all.

Wrong not in the sense of should or shouldn't, but wrong in terms of accuracy.

Should they talk about it while they've been terrible on human rights? No. Is the content of their criticisms valid? Probably.
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ag
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« Reply #16 on: March 22, 2016, 10:21:57 PM »
« Edited: March 22, 2016, 10:23:32 PM by ag »

Slamming the U.S. on human rights isn't wrong.

It is.

Saying otherwise is both stupid and completely amoral.

US has always been and remains the major force for human rights in the world. This is why, not being an American, I love that country.
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ag
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« Reply #17 on: March 22, 2016, 10:26:06 PM »

Slamming the U.S. on human rights isn't wrong.
....while keeping hundreds of dissidents in prison at the same time?

I'm not saying Cuba is perfect either, but my fellow Americans need to realize we're not as saintly as often indoctrinated.

I am not saying salt is extremely sweet, but definitely honey is a bit too salty. What the hell...
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The Last Northerner
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« Reply #18 on: March 22, 2016, 10:29:55 PM »

US has always been and remains the major force for human rights in the world. This is why, not being an American, I love that country.

What? Have you been sleeping for the last two administrations?





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The Last Northerner
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« Reply #19 on: March 22, 2016, 10:32:25 PM »

Anyways, this is a tiny step in the right direction. Hopefully, some sort of deal can be reach that would beneficial both to the USA and the Cuban people. If a thaw with Viet Nam can be achieved, Cuba shouldn't be that far of a stretch.
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Atlas Has Shrugged
ChairmanSanchez
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« Reply #20 on: March 22, 2016, 10:45:34 PM »

US has always been and remains the major force for human rights in the world. This is why, not being an American, I love that country.

What? Have you been sleeping for the last two administrations?






I totally agree with you, for whatever it's worth. But this is accepted as part of life in Cuba. It isn't here.
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Blue3
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« Reply #21 on: March 23, 2016, 06:58:48 PM »

Snowden isn't a whistleblower. He should be prosecuted. I'm not one for harsh sentences, but what he did was not justified. And most of the stuff he "revealed", people who have been paying attention already knew.
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RightBehind
AlwaysBernie
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« Reply #22 on: March 23, 2016, 09:47:25 PM »

Slamming the U.S. on human rights isn't wrong.

It is.

Saying otherwise is both stupid and completely amoral.

US has always been and remains the major force for human rights in the world. This is why, not being an American, I love that country.

This country cares about human rights when it wants to. The government has no problem forgoing human rights during invasions of other countries in exchange for profiteering off of it.

There's a lot of good about this country. There's much to love. We take for granted freedoms other parts of the world could get harshly punished for.

At the same time, there's also areas we can improve on both home and abroad. Our human rights record on the world's stage isn't completely spotless historically or in recent memory. The America I was taught about as a little kid isn't the same America I've learned about as an adult.
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