Hillary's trip to west virginia didn't go too well

[IceSpear]

Some people on this forum might not realize that most people from West Virginia are literate. And I don't think this type of talk makes them want to vote Democrat.

The liberal blogosphere and media had no problem smearing them as ignorant racists in 2008. But now that they're (possibly) voting the "correct" way in the primary, they're populist heroes who should be pandered to? lol

It will be very interesting to see the media's reaction if Bernie wins WV and to compare/contrast it with their reaction when Hillary won it in 2008. Here's some snippets from that:

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http://www.nytimes.com/2008/05/21/us/politics/21clinton.html?sq=

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http://www.mediaite.com/tv/scarborough-slams-media-for-abusing-clinton-in-08-msnbc-called-entire-states-racist/

Daily Kos: The Most Racist State: West Virginia in the May 13 Primary

http://www.dailykos.com/story/2008/5/14/515353/-

Who wants to bet that if Bernie wins, Daily Kos will suddenly see the people of West Virginia as populist working class True Democrat massive freedom fighters?

And of course this video that was passed around the blogosphere showing how racist and ignorant WV voters are: https://youtu.be/ODaxZSz3Awg

[IceSpear]

Crap like this makes me thankful that West Virginia is now a Republican state. You guys can have them. Thank God the coal industry is dying.

Joe Manchin won't be very happy to hear that.

Manchin will retire. He's not going to willingly put himself through a Blanching. I hope sticks it to WV in the last 2 years of his term though by going ultra liberal.

[○∙◄☻¥tπ[╪AV┼cVê└]

Some people on this forum might not realize that most people from West Virginia are literate. And I don't think this type of talk makes them want to vote Democrat.

The liberal blogosphere and media had no problem smearing them as ignorant racists in 2008. But now that they're (possibly) voting the "correct" way in the primary, they're populist heroes who should be pandered to? lol

It doesn't have to do with Bernie. Before this election I didn't understand why they'd vote Republican over a Democrat. This election has made it very clear what the Democratic party actually stands for. When you peel back the facade, things aren't too pretty. It's much more understandable that someone might try the other party.

[IceSpear]

Some people on this forum might not realize that most people from West Virginia are literate. And I don't think this type of talk makes them want to vote Democrat.

The liberal blogosphere and media had no problem smearing them as ignorant racists in 2008. But now that they're (possibly) voting the "correct" way in the primary, they're populist heroes who should be pandered to? lol

It doesn't have to do with Bernie. Before this election I didn't understand why they'd vote Republican over a Democrat. This election has made it very clear what the Democratic party actually stands for. When you peel back the facade, things aren't too pretty. It's much more understandable that someone might try the other party.

I was talking more in general than to you specifically. We all know the same liberal blogosphere sites like Daily Kos which called WV voters ignorant racists in 08 will be celebrating next week if Bernie wins it.

Of course, you could argue the opposite applies to Hillary supporters...but speaking for myself, I personally hope she loses it. Go Keith Russell Judd!

[○∙◄☻¥tπ[╪AV┼cVê└]

Some people on this forum might not realize that most people from West Virginia are literate. And I don't think this type of talk makes them want to vote Democrat.

The liberal blogosphere and media had no problem smearing them as ignorant racists in 2008. But now that they're (possibly) voting the "correct" way in the primary, they're populist heroes who should be pandered to? lol

It doesn't have to do with Bernie. Before this election I didn't understand why they'd vote Republican over a Democrat. This election has made it very clear what the Democratic party actually stands for. When you peel back the facade, things aren't too pretty. It's much more understandable that someone might try the other party.

I was talking more in general than to you specifically. We all know the same liberal blogosphere sites like Daily Kos which called WV voters ignorant racists in 08 will be celebrating next week if Bernie wins it.

Of course, you could argue the opposite applies to Hillary supporters...but speaking for myself, I personally hope she loses it. Go Keith Russell Judd!

Actually Daily Kos is mostly Hillary hacks now.

[○∙◄☻¥tπ[╪AV┼cVê└]

Crap like this makes me thankful that West Virginia is now a Republican state. You guys can have them. Thank God the coal industry is dying.

Joe Manchin won't be very happy to hear that.

Manchin will retire. He's not going to willingly put himself through a Blanching. I hope sticks it to WV in the last 2 years of his term though by going ultra liberal.

Evan Bayh and Zell Miller went ultra conservative in their final 2 years, so there's not good precedent there.

[Hnv1]

Considering the levels of poverty and loss of population I can't really blame them, don't think HRC has anything to offer (nor would Sanders or anyone else) it's a dying state, I think Trump can break 70% here in GE

[IceSpear]

Crap like this makes me thankful that West Virginia is now a Republican state. You guys can have them. Thank God the coal industry is dying.

Joe Manchin won't be very happy to hear that.

Manchin will retire. He's not going to willingly put himself through a Blanching. I hope sticks it to WV in the last 2 years of his term though by going ultra liberal.

Evan Bayh and Zell Miller went ultra conservative in their final 2 years, so there's not good precedent there.

Miller was an attention whore and I think Bayh still has future ambitions. Manchin is pushing 70 and has no political future after retiring or getting Blanched. I think it's possible.

[Xing]

PPP said they'd be releasing their poll of WV tomorrow, so I guess we'll see what the story is then.

[IceSpear]

Considering the levels of poverty and loss of population I can't really blame them, don't think HRC has anything to offer (nor would Sanders or anyone else) it's a dying state, I think Trump can break 70% here in GE

That's another reason Manchin is doomed. If Hillary wins, it's self explanatory. But even if Trump wins and is a disaster, WV is one of the few states where he'd still be popular even with a toxic approval nationally.

[The world will shine with light in our nightmare]

I don't really see how the Democrats in WV, at least on a presidential level, can get much worse than Obama.  Not after that disastrous primary result.  Manchin is still extremely popular there, and he would've been well on his way to the governor's mansion this year had he decided to run.  But even without him in the race, Jim Justice appears slightly favored to keep the governorship for the Democrats.  And I think that unless someone like David McKinley challenges Manchin for the Senate, he'll probably have little trouble getting reelected as long as he wants.

West Virginia isn't quite like Kentucky just yet.

[Eraserhead]

PPP said they'd be releasing their poll of WV tomorrow, so I guess we'll see what the story is then.

Interesting. It's about time we got a decent poll out of here.

[136or142]

I wouldn't say West Virginia is a "microcosm" of the Democratic Party's relationship with the white working class at all. More like West Virginia is a macrocosm of their issues with the coal industry and those that depend on it, along with Kentucky, SW Pennsylvania, SE Ohio, some areas of Virginia, etc. Anyway, kudos to her for visiting I guess, but the state is and will remain hostile territory to Democrats for a long time. Just like Vermont was a reliable Republican state that went hard towards the Democratic party in a short amount of time, West Virginia was a reliable Democratic state that is (has) going hard towards the Republican party in a short amount of time. I can see Trump getting 65-70% in the state even if Hillary wins nationwide by double digits.

The problem is that the Democrats have gone hard left on the issues that matter to them most.  The Dems went from being moderate environmentalists (I'm pretty sure most people would support the Clean Water Act, for example) to hardcore hippie Sierra Club activists about it.  Considering WV is a coal state, that doesn't play too well there.  If the Democrats could shift a bit more to the middle on environmental issues, while still supporting labor rights and the basics of the New Deal, WV could shift back to the blue column.

I could see a moderate like Evan Bayh, Jim Webb, John Bel Edwards, etc. putting it into play in a future election.

Not trying to pick on you personally, but there's good reason the Democrats have gone "hard left" on coal. It's a major contributor towards climate change, which the Department of Defense considers a significant threat to national security.

"Shifting a bit more to the middle" on the environment at this point is like shifting a little towards the middle on allowing poison in baby food. It doesn't frelling matter how much of WV's economy depends on poisonous baby food, it's still a bad idea.

Your radical environmental positions are stealing baby food from babies and starving the people Appalachia by crushing their income so think about that before you pretend to hold the righteous ground.

Labeling a position as 'radical' does not make it so.  While I recognize that all industrial production is going to have some effect on the environment, beyond it's contribution to AGW, coal also releases fine particulate matter that:

a 2010 study by the Clean Air Task Force estimated that air pollution from coal-fired power plants accounts for more than 13,000 premature deaths, 20,000 heart attacks, and 1.6 million lost workdays in the U.S. each year. The total monetary cost of these health impacts is over $100 billion annually.

Even if you don't trust this group's numbers, the evidence from China in addition to this both show  coal is the fossil fuel that is the most unhealthy to humans (and to the environment) and ending its use for energy purposes (coal is also used in steel making) in as quick but responsible a manner as possible is in nearly everybody's best interests.

This is a bit over the top, but imagine if murder wasn't illegal but that most people who wanted to murder others were uncomfortable doing it personally and so hired others to kill for them and the government proposed outlawing murder and the 'hitman' industry and lobby said 'but think of the job losses!"  

I think the burning of coal is basically legalized killing and harming of the health of third parties.

[Figueira]

I've heard people on Atlas suggest that the Democrats should abandon environmentalism in order to appeal to West Virginia. Seriously.

[Hydera]

I've heard people on Atlas suggest that the Democrats should abandon environmentalism in order to appeal to West Virginia. Seriously.

Whats the point?



The real "War on Coal" is coal failing to compete with natural gas because there has been a boom in cheap natural gas due to fracking.

Also if they wanted to "save coal jobs" then they could both just demand the coal industry itself go back to 1800's technology in digging up coal so people can be hired to just shovel that stuff instead draglines and trucks.

[MK]

I've heard people on Atlas suggest that the Democrats should abandon environmentalism in order to appeal to West Virginia. Seriously.

Lets not do that.   Seems its better to abandon working class Americans in order to appeal to flag burning illegal immigrants.

[Wiz in Wis]

Some people on this forum might not realize that most people from West Virginia are literate. And I don't think this type of talk makes them want to vote Democrat.

Here we see the left-wing delusion that certain segments of the populace are just waiting, practically begging, to vote Democrat if we nominate someone who says nice things about them, but vote GOP year after year for some mysterious reason that can't possibly rhyme with "racism"

[KingSweden]

I think it should be pointed out that Sanders' blanket fracking ban (which I do not support) could play well here despite WV not being a "green" state since more than anything else it's cheap natural gas that is killing coal rather than the big bad EPA. I highly, highly doubt Sanders would ever frame the debate that way, but I wouldn't be surprised if that helped boost his numbers.

[Comrade Funk]

The amount of condescension and elitism coming from some Democrats is disgusting. Yes, we liberals should not budge on the environment. The stakes are too high for our children. Certainly more important than the an artificial number like the national debt.

That being said, West Virginians have been given a slate of lies by Republicans. We liberals know conservatism will do nothing, but bring more misery to some of the poorest people in our nation. Instead of treating them like inbred morons, treat them like human beings and fellow Americans. Are there racists there? Yes. Are there black racists who wouldn't vote for a white man? Yes. The vast majority of West Virginians, however, want to live how we all wanna live; with respect and economic security. Stop acting like latte liberals and take the torch from Martin Luther King Jr., whose last great movement was going to be a Poor People's March, uniting white and black in solidarity against the poverty both are dealt with.

[Chief Justice Keef]

I don't want Sanders to win WV, mainly because of what people will make of that, but also because WV has never backed my preferred candidate as long as I've been able to vote (in a primary or GE.) I'd like it to stay that way.

At least one person on this forum has used Sanders winning Oklahoma as evidence of the Sanders campaign being racist.

Heh, keep telling yourselves that and maybe it'll come true.

[Bigby]

Acting like snooty Yankees towards them will only make them turn further away from you. Just saying.

[Hydera]

The amount of condescension and elitism coming from some Democrats is disgusting. Yes, we liberals should not budge on the environment. The stakes are too high for our children. Certainly more important than the an artificial number like the national debt.

That being said, West Virginians have been given a slate of lies by Republicans. We liberals know conservatism will do nothing, but bring more misery to some of the poorest people in our nation. Instead of treating them like inbred morons, treat them like human beings and fellow Americans. Are there racists there? Yes. Are there black racists who wouldn't vote for a white man? Yes. The vast majority of West Virginians, however, want to live how we all wanna live; with respect and economic security. Stop acting like latte liberals and take the torch from Martin Luther King Jr., whose last great movement was going to be a Poor People's March, uniting white and black in solidarity against the poverty both are dealt with.

You can try as hard as you want but when all they scream is OBUMMER!!!!, WAR ON COAL, MUH GUNZ, MUH BIBLE, FCUK THE GAYS!!!!!

You know their not a group that will ever be convinced.

[libertpaulian]

I've heard people on Atlas suggest that the Democrats should abandon environmentalism in order to appeal to West Virginia. Seriously.

Not just West Virginia, but also to make sure that they keep a firm, solid grip on PA and OH, and possibly win back KY.  Considering the Sun Belt is trending D, adding Coal Country to the D column only further complicates things for the GOP.

[Hnv1]

I've heard people on Atlas suggest that the Democrats should abandon environmentalism in order to appeal to West Virginia. Seriously.

Not just West Virginia, but also to make sure that they keep a firm, solid grip on PA and OH, and possibly win back KY.  Considering the Sun Belt is trending D, adding Coal Country to the D column only further complicates things for the GOP.

They will be a backlash I reckon, especially in western states. Plus, coal's is dead, it's not coming back.

[136or142]

Acting like snooty Yankees towards them will only make them turn further away from you. Just saying.

And Republicans referring to those concerned about the environment as 'radicals' will only turn them further away from you.  Just saying.