Assault on gun owners

[RightBehind]

There is blame to go around for the gun owning lunatics and the culture they create, yes. Sure, they're not at fault the way like the shooter(s) but they are not innocent.

How many gun owners are "lunatics" and how many of those are responsible for this "culture" that you're talking about? This argument is basically the equivalent of saying that American Muslims are to blame for Islamist jihad culture. Most gun owners are not members of the NRA, and many NRA members disagree with the NRA's approach to the gun debate.

Guns don't make people want to harm others, they are simply an instrument that allows them to. If someone wants to commit murder or other violent crimes, they will do so regardless of whether they have a gun or not. I am convinced that there are cultural factors that influence people who kill others, but it is not "gun culture" that causes it. Unfortunately, this is a deeply-ingrained flaw with American culture, but chipping away at the Bill of Rights or vilifying law-abiding people who only want to defend themselves or shoot for sport is not at all productive.

The problem with guns is their purpose is essentially one thing and one thing only. You can look at other weapons, but those weapons also have different functions.

I have never bought into the government tyranny argument because government leaders of different parties at both the federal and state levels have engaged in tyrannical acts since the John Adams Administration. How many armed overthrows of the government have occured since then?

Keep in mind every citizen is a law abiding citizen until they no longer are.

[Santander]

I have never bought into the government tyranny argument because government leaders of different parties at both the federal and state levels have engaged in tyrannical acts since the John Adams Administration. How many armed overthrows of the government have occured since then?

The Second Amendment alone does not protect people from government tyranny but the Constitution as a whole provides individuals protection from tyranny. The Second Amendment is currently the structural weak point in the Bill of Rights, and either repealing or effectively nullifying the Second Amendment is basically paving the way for the destruction of the Bill of Rights. Protecting the Second Amendment is not about guns, it's about freedom.

Keep in mind every citizen is a law abiding citizen until they no longer are.

If you think in this way, you might as well just advocate a police state.

[RightBehind]

I have never bought into the government tyranny argument because government leaders of different parties at both the federal and state levels have engaged in tyrannical acts since the John Adams Administration. How many armed overthrows of the government have occured since then?

The Second Amendment alone does not protect people from government tyranny but the Constitution as a whole provides individuals protection from tyranny. The Second Amendment is currently the structural weak point in the Bill of Rights, and either repealing or effectively nullifying the Second Amendment is basically paving the way for the destruction of the Bill of Rights. Protecting the Second Amendment is not about guns, it's about freedom.

Keep in mind every citizen is a law abiding citizen until they no longer are.

If you think in this way, you might as well just advocate a police state.

I see a true gun obsession in this country. This is about guns. People are more concerned with the Second Amendment than they are the rest of the Bill of Rights. I've seen gun nuts more defensive about their guns than the people who died in a mass shooting.

I am against a police state. I'd love for a repeal of the Patriot Act, the NDAA and if I ran for president, one of my top priorities for the Supreme Court would be overturning Korematsu, but it's true, every criminal was a law abiding citizen at one point.

[dead0man]

The problem with guns is their purpose is essentially one thing and one thing only. You can look at other weapons, but those weapons also have different functions.

Great job!  You made what is normally just a bad argument (guns have only one purpose) and somehow made it dumber by making the extremely broad statement that "other weapons also have different functions".  What function do brass knuckles server other than making a punch 2.8 times more devastating?  Making douchebags in 1978 look cool perhaps?  A very dangerous and sh**tty hammer?  What about a mace?  Or Mace?  And guns have at least two other very valid uses:target shooting and getting people off that get off on extremely high precision machinery and loud noises.

but you know what's even dumber than all that?  It doesn't matter if guns have other uses or not.  People have a right to defend themselves with small arms.  Period.

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I have never bought into the government tyranny argument because you're never going to convince the human beings in the military to shoot their uncle and brother because DC passed a law.

[Santander]

I see a true gun obsession in this country. This is about guns. People are more concerned with the Second Amendment than they are the rest of the Bill of Rights. I've seen gun nuts more defensive about their guns than the people who died in a mass shooting.

There is no widespread obsession with guns in this country. It's liberals who are obsessed with either taking away or making it harder to own guns, and gun owners are just fighting back. Public debate about the First Amendment is just as prominent, if not more than the debate over the Second Amendment. Look at religious liberty, freedom of speech in universities, etc. Politicians and state governments publicly fight for the Tenth Amendment very publicly as well. And every single day in courtrooms, jails and police stations across America, there are fights over the Fourth, Fifth, Sixth and Seventh Amendments. You only see people fighting for the Second Amendment because that's all you choose to see.

[Landslide Lyndon]

Oh look, another thread where deadoman is doing his usual "I am not a gun nut but..." schtick.

BTW, you know you've hit rock bottom when you're defending the paranoid ramblings of a bona fide fascist like MK.   

[MK]

Hawaii attempting to do this makes you wonder the real motive.

[dead0man]

Oh look, another thread where deadoman is doing his usual "I am not a gun nut but..." schtick.

BTW, you know you've hit rock bottom when you're defending the paranoid ramblings of a bona fide fascist like MK.   

Thanks for the (strange) play by play. <thumbs up>

[RightBehind]

The problem with guns is their purpose is essentially one thing and one thing only. You can look at other weapons, but those weapons also have different functions.

Great job!  You made what is normally just a bad argument (guns have only one purpose) and somehow made it dumber by making the extremely broad statement that "other weapons also have different functions".  What function do brass knuckles server other than making a punch 2.8 times more devastating?  Making douchebags in 1978 look cool perhaps?  A very dangerous and sh**tty hammer?  What about a mace?  Or Mace?  And guns have at least two other very valid uses:target shooting and getting people off that get off on extremely high precision machinery and loud noises.

but you know what's even dumber than all that?  It doesn't matter if guns have other uses or not.  People have a right to defend themselves with small arms.  Period.

You must be logged in to read this quote.

I have never bought into the government tyranny argument because you're never going to convince the human beings in the military to shoot their uncle and brother because DC passed a law.

A hammer could be used for other things. Same for a knife, a cae, a baseball bat, etc. There's no use for guns in this country. You don't need to do target practice.

[RightBehind]

I see a true gun obsession in this country. This is about guns. People are more concerned with the Second Amendment than they are the rest of the Bill of Rights. I've seen gun nuts more defensive about their guns than the people who died in a mass shooting.

There is no widespread obsession with guns in this country. It's liberals who are obsessed with either taking away or making it harder to own guns, and gun owners are just fighting back. Public debate about the First Amendment is just as prominent, if not more than the debate over the Second Amendment. Look at religious liberty, freedom of speech in universities, etc. Politicians and state governments publicly fight for the Tenth Amendment very publicly as well. And every single day in courtrooms, jails and police stations across America, there are fights over the Fourth, Fifth, Sixth and Seventh Amendments. You only see people fighting for the Second Amendment because that's all you choose to see.

I've come across many pro gun commenters abd also Second Amendment politicians who suggest and take positions which violate aspects of the Bill of Rights.

[Santander]

A hammer could be used for other things. Same for a knife, a cae, a baseball bat, etc. There's no use for guns in this country. You don't need to do target practice.

There's no need to play baseball either. That's a ridiculous argument and you know it.

In addition to target shooting, which is an Olympic sport and popular worldwide, guns are also used for:
- wildlife control/hunting
- scaring away birds at airports
- protection from animals in places like Alaska
- scientific research

Being able to defend yourself is a minor benefit of having a gun, too. That's probably more legitimate uses than a baseball bat, actually.

[Mr. Reactionary]

Shooting rapists is a pretty good use for guns too ...

[Landslide Lyndon]

Shooting rapists is a pretty good use for guns too ...

Why don't you immigrate to Somalia? I'm sure you will fit like a glove there.

[RightBehind]

A hammer could be used for other things. Same for a knife, a cae, a baseball bat, etc. There's no use for guns in this country. You don't need to do target practice.

There's no need to play baseball either. That's a ridiculous argument and you know it.

In addition to target shooting, which is an Olympic sport and popular worldwide, guns are also used for:
- wildlife control/hunting
- scaring away birds at airports
- protection from animals in places like Alaska
- scientific research

Being able to defend yourself is a minor benefit of having a gun, too. That's probably more legitimate uses than a baseball bat, actually.

For what it's worth, I can't stand hunting/hunters.

You fire gunshots at the airport to scare away birds? What's wrong with you?

[dead0man]

Can somebody explain the point of the last two posts?  I'd assume they posted to the wrong thread somehow, but they are quotes so....

[Attorney General, LGC Speaker, and Former PPT Dwarven Dragon]

ELECT BERNIE! A TRUE SUPPORTER OF THE SECOND AMENDMENT!

[Santander]

Can somebody explain the point of the last two posts?  I'd assume they posted to the wrong thread somehow, but they are quotes so....

I've given up trying to understand.

[MK]

Can somebody explain the point of the last two posts?  I'd assume they posted to the wrong thread somehow, but they are quotes so....

I've given up trying to understand.

The orgin was the state of Hawaii considering database for gun owners.    I want to add that looking at the other sides view(Hawaii dems ) with it being a island in the middle of the Pacific maybe they are worried that armed citizens could overtake the island.   Ok, that's prob a stretch.   It seems like the garden variety liberal disarmament.


"Database that will automatically notify police if an island resident is arrested anywhere else in the country."  - http://insider.foxnews.com/2016/05/25/hawaii-may-enter-gun-owners-federal-database

[Landslide Lyndon]

Can somebody explain the point of the last two posts?  I'd assume they posted to the wrong thread somehow, but they are quotes so....

Is that really so hard or are you just playing coy?

[Virginiá]

I love political discussions on the 2nd amendment. It always brings out the maximum amount of delusion in people

[dead0man]

Can somebody explain the point of the last two posts?  I'd assume they posted to the wrong thread somehow, but they are quotes so....

Is that really so hard or are you just playing coy?

You said something about Somalia after someone said guns are great for stopping rapists.  WTF does Somalia have to do with that?  Are Somalian women armed and shooting rapists more than other places?  I wouldn't be surprised if it was higher than average, but I'd be shocked if they were far outside the norm.

[Atlas Has Shrugged]

It's funny, because AlwaysBernie is probably the most likely poster to commit mass murder.

[RightBehind]

It's funny, because AlwaysBernie is probably the most likely poster to commit mass murder.

You have proof of this how? Or is this just imitating your dear leader with off the cuff remarks?

[Gass3268]

Hawaii continues to be a model example for the rest of America. FF state!

[Atlas Has Shrugged]

It's funny, because AlwaysBernie is probably the most likely poster to commit mass murder.

You have proof of this how? Or is this just imitating your dear leader with off the cuff remarks?

Remember when you posted this?

I confess I sometimes have the urge to just blow peoples heads off you know I just want to kill. I want to kill. KILL!