The South will rise again.

[Wisconsin+17]

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My vote is more effective as a Laborite than as an indy due to how this game is set up with the parties.

You don't tackle the Empire by yourself.

[Wisconsin+17]

Quite happy to have Classic Conservative out at the ranch again.

[Classic Conservative]

Quite happy to have Classic Conservative out at the ranch again.

Glad to have joined you for a few hours today. The ranch was beautiful as always. Thanks for your hospitality.

[Wisconsin+17]

Indeed. It really is beautiful country.

[Former Senator Haslam2020]

can I come 'round sometime?

[SUSAN CRUSHBONE]

Quite happy to have Classic Conservative out at the ranch again.

Glad to have joined you for a few hours today. The ranch was beautiful as always. Thanks for your hospitality.

oh jeez don't tell me this is jcl 2.0

[Wisconsin+17]

You're always welcome, Haslam.

[Wisconsin+17]

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As anyone will confirm, we're brothers by another mother. He's a good man, better than me.

[Wisconsin+17]

Now that Labor has won the house election, I will be leaving the Labor party.

I will be starting up a new party that is social conservative first, pro life and pro traditional marriage. I think that it's important for everyone in Atlasia to have a voice that represents them, even if they are in the minority and especially in the minority.

I would like to invite all like-minded social conservatives to join the party. I have not yet settled on a name but will post up the platform and the constitution of the party over the next few days as I have time.

Thank you everybody!

[Southern Senator North Carolina Yankee]

In 2009, Hamilton claimed a certain old Party didn't represent Libertarians and so he created his own even though he was hardly a libertarian himself.

At least when he did so though, he didn't actively sabotage and reduce the size of the libertarian contingent in the Legislature to facilitate his argument.

[The world will shine with light in our nightmare]

I knew we were gonna get an Atlasian UKIP sooner or later.

[Wisconsin+17]

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Are you suggesting I'm not a conservative?

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And there we have it. An official unendorsement from the chief of the Federalists. Next time pass a prolife bill first rather than ramming through evergreens crap.

At least now the Feds are out of power again.

[Associate Justice PiT]

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Are you suggesting I'm not a conservative?

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And there we have it. An official unendorsement from the chief of the Federalists. Next time pass a prolife bill first rather than ramming through evergreens crap.

At least now the Feds are out of power again.

     Having worked with him for years, I would not expect Mr. Yankee to support a vain project that will not suffice to advance its own goals, but rather promote the success of Labor.

[Wisconsin+17]

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Which explains TM's reaching around the aisle to collaborate with Evergreen? Sir - the Federalists have become Labor.

[Associate Justice PiT]

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Which explains TM's reaching around the aisle to collaborate with Evergreen? Sir - the Federalists have become Labor.

     Suppose you could work with a Labor politician to advance an issue you believed in. Would you refuse the opportunity because it would involve working with Labor? If tmth disagreed with you on this issue and objected to you working with a Labor politician, would you subsequently give it up?

[NeverAgain]

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Which explains TM's reaching around the aisle to collaborate with Evergreen? Sir - the Federalists have become Labor.

Bipartisanship is a strength, not a vice.

[Wisconsin+17]

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Not when there's only one voice being heard.

[Adam Griffin]

So sorry to see you go!

I completely understand the sentiment. When I joined the game, the Lieberal Party was the predominant force in the game (and had been for years; previously known as JCP before dissolution) but was all too willing to give into conservative fantasies and functioned more as a self-serving cult of Napoleon (who turned out to be Hamilton, a right-winger, so no surprise there). Poor Labor was close to half of the left-voting bloc but was completely subservient to their demands and basically fueled their electoral prowess with little to no benefit in return. I said enough was enough and decided to restore the Glorious Left's rightful position among our hemisphere, and unfortunately had to wage a war of attrition against the Lieberals. Unfortunately for them, they did not make it, but Labor was bestowed with its glorious crown as Queen Party of the Left and it hasn't looked back ever since.

You may very well have to follow a similar trajectory in order to be taken seriously by the power-brokers that be.

[Wisconsin+17]

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The problem was twofold. One - we had just won an election. We could pass stuff without Labor's assistance. There was no need to work to pass their bills because we had our own agenda. If, as you said, the only way to get business done was to work with Labor, then heck, cut a deal do the best you can.

Two, not only did we not cut a deal, we gave away the store. TM knew it was sh**tty legislation and rammed it through anyways. I was left with the choice of endorsing TM, and then fighting on with that albatross, or resigning my campaign and taking the route that you've seen. I had an epiphany when I realized that TM was trying to ram the bill through ASAP and that's when I decided to take a different tack.

This was a bad deal that we did not need to sign.

[Wisconsin+17]

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If it were power that were my first priority, I'd be the sitting Speaker of the South. Power is not nearly as important as principles. Given that the Federalists no longer believe that traditional marriage is something worth fighting for, and I do, this is a breach that could not be mended.

So I'll fight, tilt the windmills if it may, but I will continue to stand behind a concrete and cohesive conservativism, not this hodgepodge patchwork that is the Federalists.

[Associate Justice PiT]

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The problem was twofold. One - we had just won an election. We could pass stuff without Labor's assistance. There was no need to work to pass their bills because we had our own agenda. If, as you said, the only way to get business done was to work with Labor, then heck, cut a deal do the best you can.

Two, not only did we not cut a deal, we gave away the store. TM knew it was sh**tty legislation and rammed it through anyways. I was left with the choice of endorsing TM, and then fighting on with that albatross, or resigning my campaign and taking the route that you've seen. I had an epiphany when I realized that TM was trying to ram the bill through ASAP and that's when I decided to take a different tack.

This was a bad deal that we did not need to sign.

     The point is that not everyone agreed with you or agreed with him there. I wouldn't have proposed it or signed it. But tmth thought differently than you did. He wanted to put his name to the bill; he doesn't have to agree with the Federalist Party platform to do that. Any one of us has the right to support policies that they personally support. We can differ from each other on this.

[Wisconsin+17]

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Then why did he try to muzzle me? No, we can't 'disagree' on this anymore, PiT. TM crossed a line. What did the party do when it found out that TM was muzzling federalists? Nothing. Not a tinker's damn.

I don't think any one of you believe that what he did was appropriate conduct. However, the fact remains is that there were no consequences for TM. What that tells me is that you're so petrified with offending TM that he can pretty much do whatever he likes.

Sad, but that's the reality.

[The world will shine with light in our nightmare]

[Southern Senator North Carolina Yankee]

So I'll fight, tilt the windmills if it may, but I will continue to stand behind a concrete and cohesive conservativism, not this hodgepodge patchwork that is the Federalists.

And what happens when you are done and you find yourself alone, having basically pulled a Trump (regarding his constantly fighting back). Fighting and Fighting on losing fronts, that your knocked yourself and your movement, completely out of existence. Can you honestly say at that point, that such was sell served for your principles? You mentioned the pro-life bill. Such could be passed before, this new majority you voted for never would. That is the problem, and that is exactly what Adam wants. When you lose the Tmth's and the Goldwaters, you lose the four and fifth votes on those social issues that you can win on. If going on a rino safari suits your fancy, then don't be surprised if you end up locking yourself into the losing side of a 7-3 spread.

It is easy for Adam to compare the right to the left, but what he fails to mention in his role as the little horned devil on your shoulder (which I would note that post was dripping with such patronizing language), that it is easy to go full socialist and succeed on the internet, because it is the Internet there are millions to be found. Social conservatives are a finite commodity. Adam knows full well the Atlasian right is propped up by social libertarians and he knows there is know way a Conservative Party can succeed taking the Labor path.

Politics is at the end of the day, demographic. It is why Trump is the GOP nominee, why Obama is President, it is why Labor is the dominant leftwing party in Atlasia, and it is why the general composition of the Right's coalition regardless of party has not changed in Atlasia for close to nine years.

[Wisconsin+17]

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Been alone for a long time, Yankee.

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You're already on a 7-3 split.

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You believe that the party should be nothing but a loose coalition of folks who are vaguely to the right of Labor.

How is that working for you, Yankee? Does that suggest that you have a vision? A dream a goal, a purpose?

I have a vision and a dream and a purpose, and I think traditional marriage is something worth fighting for. Adam is laughing not at me, but at you because he knows he's won the argument. When the debate is over how far will we go, not whether, "why are we travelling in this direction", Adam has won without firing a shot.

That's what you're not getting Yankee. You have a 'party' of folks that don't agree on anything. Everytime you bring up goldwater but how often do you go and say, "hey, maybe that's not cool for Ben Kenobi? Never heard that.

Why is goldwater's fiscal conservativism more important than social conservativism? If goldwater wants to join labor because he wants homosexual marriage. let him. Let all of them go. So long as they love homosexual marriage more than they do the Federalists, you will continue to lose. Every election.