Bernie now dictating to Hillary how to pick her VP

[Attorney General, Senator-Elect, & Former PPT Dwarven Dragon]

Who can you think of that rings "good enough" with Sanders Supporters but wouldn't alienate the middle? Warren and Brown would alienate the middle. Sanders himself is probably fine with Kaine or Booker, but his supporters probably aren't. Names that come to mind are the Castros - but only because they're unknown and therefore have few enemies - and Al Franken, who doesn't bring in a single voter Hillary wouldn't get otherwise.

Bernie polls better with the middle than Hillary. The idea that she has to move even further right wing to win is so ridiculous and disgusting.

In a general election, while Bernie would continue to do well with Sawx-type independents who believe that the democratic party has abandoned "real leftism", he would see his numbers fall off dramatically with the independents who actually decide elections, the ones whose ideologies lie between the two major parties. The attack ads against Sanders, which have never been run because VT is socialist and the rest of the nation had no reason to care about him before 2015, write themselves. "Socialism! Isolationism! Destruction of the Health Care Industry!" His current 10 or 12 point lead against TRUMP? It would evaporate to a two or three point lead at most overnight, pretty much literally.

[○∙◄☻¥tπ[╪AV┼cVê└]

Who can you think of that rings "good enough" with Sanders Supporters but wouldn't alienate the middle? Warren and Brown would alienate the middle. Sanders himself is probably fine with Kaine or Booker, but his supporters probably aren't. Names that come to mind are the Castros - but only because they're unknown and therefore have few enemies - and Al Franken, who doesn't bring in a single voter Hillary wouldn't get otherwise.

Bernie polls better with the middle than Hillary. The idea that she has to move even further right wing to win is so ridiculous and disgusting.

In a general election, while Bernie would continue to do well with Sawx-type independents who believe that the democratic party has abandoned "real leftism", he would see his numbers fall off dramatically with the independents who actually decide elections, the ones whose ideologies lie between the two major parties. The attack ads against Sanders, which have never been run because VT is socialist and the rest of the nation had no reason to care about him before 2015, write themselves. "Socialism! Isolationism! Destruction of the Health Care Industry!" His current 10 or 12 point lead against TRUMP? It would evaporate to a two or three point lead at most overnight, pretty much literally.

You've bought in way too much to the myth of the centrist swing voter who votes for the most centrist candidate. People know Bernie is a democratic socialist, and he's polling much better and has much better favorables than unethical lying Hillary. And sure, I wasn't going to vote for her anyways, but the further to the right Hillary goes, the more Bernie people she will lose.

[Xing]

Whenever Bernie opens his mouth, two groups of people foam at the mouth. His most diehard supporters, to whom he can do no wrong, and the anti-Sanders hacks (of which there are 4-5 on this forum), to whom he can do no right.

I just hope all this rhetoric hasn't turned you off to voting for good, undecided voter. You and your kind may very well be the last glimmer of hope in 2016, otherwise known for the election from hell.

I'm still making up my mind whether Hillary eating pizza with her hands or Trump's plans, great plans, are more important.

[Attorney General, Senator-Elect, & Former PPT Dwarven Dragon]

Who can you think of that rings "good enough" with Sanders Supporters but wouldn't alienate the middle? Warren and Brown would alienate the middle. Sanders himself is probably fine with Kaine or Booker, but his supporters probably aren't. Names that come to mind are the Castros - but only because they're unknown and therefore have few enemies - and Al Franken, who doesn't bring in a single voter Hillary wouldn't get otherwise.

Bernie polls better with the middle than Hillary. The idea that she has to move even further right wing to win is so ridiculous and disgusting.

In a general election, while Bernie would continue to do well with Sawx-type independents who believe that the democratic party has abandoned "real leftism", he would see his numbers fall off dramatically with the independents who actually decide elections, the ones whose ideologies lie between the two major parties. The attack ads against Sanders, which have never been run because VT is socialist and the rest of the nation had no reason to care about him before 2015, write themselves. "Socialism! Isolationism! Destruction of the Health Care Industry!" His current 10 or 12 point lead against TRUMP? It would evaporate to a two or three point lead at most overnight, pretty much literally.

You've bought in way too much to the myth of the centrist swing voter who votes for the most centrist candidate. People know Bernie is a democratic socialist, and he's polling much better and has much better favorables than unethical lying Hillary. And sure, I wasn't going to vote for her anyways, but the further to the right Hillary goes, the more Bernie people she will lose.

Ultimately, even if they hold their nose in the voting booth, 85% or so of Bernie supporters will vote for Hillary, because the alternative is well, a literal fascist. The other 15% or so that vote for Stein, Johnson, TRUMP, or stay home probably didn't vote for Obama either so who cares.

[○∙◄☻¥tπ[╪AV┼cVê└]

Who can you think of that rings "good enough" with Sanders Supporters but wouldn't alienate the middle? Warren and Brown would alienate the middle. Sanders himself is probably fine with Kaine or Booker, but his supporters probably aren't. Names that come to mind are the Castros - but only because they're unknown and therefore have few enemies - and Al Franken, who doesn't bring in a single voter Hillary wouldn't get otherwise.

Bernie polls better with the middle than Hillary. The idea that she has to move even further right wing to win is so ridiculous and disgusting.

In a general election, while Bernie would continue to do well with Sawx-type independents who believe that the democratic party has abandoned "real leftism", he would see his numbers fall off dramatically with the independents who actually decide elections, the ones whose ideologies lie between the two major parties. The attack ads against Sanders, which have never been run because VT is socialist and the rest of the nation had no reason to care about him before 2015, write themselves. "Socialism! Isolationism! Destruction of the Health Care Industry!" His current 10 or 12 point lead against TRUMP? It would evaporate to a two or three point lead at most overnight, pretty much literally.

You've bought in way too much to the myth of the centrist swing voter who votes for the most centrist candidate. People know Bernie is a democratic socialist, and he's polling much better and has much better favorables than unethical lying Hillary. And sure, I wasn't going to vote for her anyways, but the further to the right Hillary goes, the more Bernie people she will lose.

Ultimately, even if they hold their nose in the voting booth, 85% or so of Bernie supporters will vote for Hillary, because the alternative is well, a literal fascist. The other 15% or so that vote for Stein, Johnson, TRUMP, or stay home probably didn't vote for Obama either so who cares.

How does one draw the line of literal fascist so that it includes Trump and not Hillary? That's a very fine line.

[Attorney General, Senator-Elect, & Former PPT Dwarven Dragon]

If you literally think Hillary is a fascist, you need to see a therapist.

[○∙◄☻¥tπ[╪AV┼cVê└]

If you literally think Hillary is a fascist, you need to see a therapist.

How's he a fascist while Hillary isn't?

[Attorney General, Senator-Elect, & Former PPT Dwarven Dragon]

Fascism is defined as: an authoritarian and nationalistic right-wing system of government and social organization.

Hillary:

Nationalistic - Yep.
Authoritarian - Hmmm.....you can make the argument, I guess.
Right-Wing - LOL No

TRUMP:

Nationalistic - Yep.
Authoritarian - Yep.
Right-Wing - Yep.

[○∙◄☻¥tπ[╪AV┼cVê└]

Fascism is defined as: an authoritarian and nationalistic right-wing system of government and social organization.

Hillary:

Nationalistic - Yep.
Authoritarian - Hmmm.....you can make the argument, I guess.
Right-Wing - LOL No

TRUMP:

Nationalistic - Yep.
Authoritarian - Yep.
Right-Wing - Yep.

Hillary is more of a hawk than Trump.

[Shameless Lefty Hack]

Gorsh, all of this talk about moderate independents while Sanders and Trump are raking in Indy votes. I too enjoyed August 2015, but it's about time to leave it, eh?

In any case, I think it's silly to think that concessions shouldn't be made to a candidate who has 45% of pledged delegates so far (IIRC), or that Bernie is an EVIL, SELFISH, OH SO WRONG person for demanding them. This was/is (respect, Cali) at least the second most contested Dem primary since the modern system came about, second only to when Clinton got Secretary of State as a condition of her surrender.

Establishment Dems need to realize that we're here to stay, and they need us in their tent. And that's just the way it is. Unless you want Trump to be President. Does the establishment want a President Trump on its hands?! It would be just awful if the establishment didn't do *everything * in its power to prevent President Trump. (see what I did there?)

[SUSAN CRUSHBONE]

Who can you think of that rings "good enough" with Sanders Supporters but wouldn't alienate the middle? Warren and Brown would alienate the middle. Sanders himself is probably fine with Kaine or Booker, but his supporters probably aren't. Names that come to mind are the Castros - but only because they're unknown and therefore have few enemies - and Al Franken, who doesn't bring in a single voter Hillary wouldn't get otherwise.

Bernie polls better with the middle than Hillary. The idea that she has to move even further right wing to win is so ridiculous and disgusting.

In a general election, while Bernie would continue to do well with Sawx-type independents who believe that the democratic party has abandoned "real leftism", he would see his numbers fall off dramatically with the independents who actually decide elections, the ones whose ideologies lie between the two major parties. The attack ads against Sanders, which have never been run because VT is socialist and the rest of the nation had no reason to care about him before 2015, write themselves. "Socialism! Isolationism! Destruction of the Health Care Industry!" His current 10 or 12 point lead against TRUMP? It would evaporate to a two or three point lead at most overnight, pretty much literally.

You've bought in way too much to the myth of the centrist swing voter who votes for the most centrist candidate. People know Bernie is a democratic socialist, and he's polling much better and has much better favorables than unethical lying Hillary. And sure, I wasn't going to vote for her anyways, but the further to the right Hillary goes, the more Bernie people she will lose.

Ultimately, even if they hold their nose in the voting booth, 85% or so of Bernie supporters will vote for Hillary, because the alternative is well, a literal fascist. The other 15% or so that vote for Stein, Johnson, TRUMP, or stay home probably didn't vote for Obama either so who cares.

How does one draw the line of literal fascist so that it includes Trump and not Hillary? That's a very fine line.

ಠ_ಠ

[Shameless Lefty Hack]

I see.

Did Clinton only stay in through June in '08 because she was racist?

[○∙◄☻¥tπ[╪AV┼cVê└]

I see.

Did Clinton only stay in through June in '08 because she was racist?

She was waiting to see if her opponent got assassinated in June. She specifically mentioned RFK.

[Shameless Lefty Hack]

I dunno, he seems to have a pretty good shot at changing the party platform and maybe the next nominating process.

Which, ya know, it's been about since basically March 15.

[○∙◄☻¥tπ[╪AV┼cVê└]

I see.

Did Clinton only stay in through June in '08 because she was racist?

She was waiting to see if her opponent got assassinated in June. She specifically mentioned RFK.

You don't actually believe those crazy conspiracy theories, do you? Sanders' hate campaign is toast. Deal with it and stop whining.

"We all remember Bobby Kennedy was assassinated in June in California.” - Hillary in 2008

Check and mate, buddy.

[IceSpear]

The real story here is that he's acknowledging she, not him, will be choosing a VP. Last time I checked he was still in "we can still win!" mode.

[HAnnA MArin County]

Can you imagine how unimaginably pissed the Sandernistas would be had Hillary behaved this way towards Obama in 2008? The double standard is sickening. It's time to remove this thorn from our side known as Bernie Sanders and his unhinged bohemian supporters. We've tolerated their immature tactics and shenanigans for far too long. Of course, Bernie cares as much about party unity as I care as much as to how jfern is going to spin this post.

[IceSpear]

I look forward to seeing Jfern's reaction when Hillary wins California.

And HockeyDude's when she wins New Jersey. In a week both states will officially join the Confederacy.

Don't worry guys, the Confederacy's not all bad. I've been in it for about a month now. We have fried foods, big women, even bigger guns, and great hodowns. You guys will love it!

[IceSpear]

Gorsh, all of this talk about moderate independents while Sanders and Trump are raking in Indy votes. I too enjoyed August 2015, but it's about time to leave it, eh?

In any case, I think it's silly to think that concessions shouldn't be made to a candidate who has 45% of pledged delegates so far (IIRC), or that Bernie is an EVIL, SELFISH, OH SO WRONG person for demanding them. This was/is (respect, Cali) at least the second most contested Dem primary since the modern system came about, second only to when Clinton got Secretary of State as a condition of her surrender.

Establishment Dems need to realize that we're here to stay, and they need us in their tent. And that's just the way it is. Unless you want Trump to be President. Does the establishment want a President Trump on its hands?! It would be just awful if the establishment didn't do *everything * in its power to prevent President Trump. (see what I did there?)

Hillary did not get SoS as "condition of her surrender." She was initially reluctant to even accept the position, and had to be heavily convinced to do it. She arguably won the popular vote, and two entire states (one of which Hillary won in a landslide) were disenfranchised. I could only imagine the reactions of the Bernie folks if say, Washington or Oregon were disenfranchised this time. And I recall, despite her doing much better, Hillary and her supporters being treated terribly. High profile Obama surrogates called on her to drop out, which has not happened with Bernie this time. The Democratic establishment called her and her supporters dead ender racists, and said that she was entitled to nothing, coming from many of the same people who now insist Bernie should get concessions such as jfern and the "online activist left."

I do find it quite amusing though.

Hillary barely loses -> "It is Hillary's responsibility to unite the party, but she is entitled nothing"

Hillary wins easily -> "It is Hillary's responsibility to unite the party, and Bernie is entitled to lots of goodies and concessions"

I guess uniting the party is a woman's job. But yeah, sure, sexism has nothing to do with it.

I see.

Did Clinton only stay in through June in '08 because she was racist?

She was waiting to see if her opponent got assassinated in June. She specifically mentioned RFK.

Thank you for proving my point. Yes, "Hillary and her supporters are racists" was a major talking point all throughout 2008. I find it quite amusing how much whinging there is when the shoe is on the other foot.

[IceSpear]

Can you imagine how unimaginably pissed the Sandernistas would be had Hillary behaved this way towards Obama in 2008? The double standard is sickening. It's time to remove this thorn from our side known as Bernie Sanders and his unhinged bohemian supporters. We've tolerated their immature tactics and shenanigans for far too long. Of course, Bernie cares as much about party unity as I care as much as to how jfern is going to spin this post.

Whether or not the hammer comes down will depend on his actions after June 7th. But yeah, so many of the Bernie people have no sense of context. Hillary and her supporters were treated FAR worse in 2008 despite her doing much better. Bernie has been treated with kid gloves, by both Hillary's campaign and the Democratic establishment.

[Sir Mohamed]

Frankly, Bernie just can’t get over it that he has lost to her.

[RaphaelDLG]

Frankly, Bernie just can’t get over it that he has lost to her.

I think Bernie got over the fact that he lost on April 30, 2015, and has just been trying to extract concessions ever since.

[Angrie]

Hillary is more of a hawk than Trump.

It is possible to be a hawk without being a fascist. The label can be reasonably applied to Trump, but it is not a catch-all to describe anyone who is more militaristic than one might like. It is reserved for more serious things than that.

[Angrie]

The real story here is that he's acknowledging she, not him, will be choosing a VP. Last time I checked he was still in "we can still win!" mode.

That's actually a good point.

[Sir Mohamed]

Hillary is more of a hawk than Trump.

It is possible to be a hawk without being a fascist. The label can be reasonably applied to Trump, but it is not a catch-all to describe anyone who is more militaristic than one might like. It is reserved for more serious things than that.

Well, the Trumpster isn’t a fascist; he’s narcissist and a psychopath.

Trump is definitely more hawkish. An example: He has no strategy on ISIS so far expect just bombing. Bombing is vital, but that alone won’t solve the problem. And, last but not least, he wants to increase military spending. That’s ridiculous, since we’re already spending trillions of dollars while our infrastructure falls apart and we can’t afford health care, social security and more renewable energies.