Mass shooting at LGBT nightclub in Orlando.

[Badger]

Apparently the Lt. Gov. of Texas tweeted a Bible verse saying that we "reap what we sow" when we "mock God."

Disguisting.

Texas

[Taco Truck 🚚]

www.washingtonpost.com/news/worldviews/wp/2016/06/12/orlando-shooting-suspects-father-hosted-a-political-tv-show-and-even-tried-to-run-for-the-afghan-presidency/

Apparently, the shooter's father was a prominent Afghan public figure and a Taliban supporter.

Apparently they didn't bring him up to be very religious.

You must be logged in to read this quote.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/world/national-security/ex-wife-of-suspected-orlando-shooter-he-beat-me/2016/06/12/8a1963b4-30b8-11e6-8ff7-7b6c1998b7a0_story.html

He's been into guns for a long time though.

[Santander]

Tolerate?

A fascinating choice of word, given that, as we all know, the point about toleration is that it is conditional and can be withdrawn.

And a careful choice of word. I'm not comfortable with homosexuality, but I accept that some people are gay and they deserve to live with dignity like the rest of us. I have gay friends and I don't see them as gay, I see them as my friends. I don't think my position is at all abnormal.

[ingemann]

Terrorist in general fail because of their own stupidity in the planning phase, my municipality alone have had two (Islamist) terror cells, which have failed because they ordered large amount of fertiliser.

There was a guy over here convicted last year; he'd been arrested after walking into a cookshop and buying the biggest scariest looking knife he could find. As he'd never been in before, obviously wasn't a professional chef and was acting as shiftily as hell, naturally the staff called the police as soon as he left the shop and he was arrested on arrival home...

Yes, it's important element in terror is talent mass, you need a relative large group having rather horrible views, a minority among them support violence to reach their goal, a minority among them being willing to use violence. At that point you have a relative small group of people unless you start with a lot of people, and when you need someone with the intelligence and necessary skills. It's why you see more (Islamist) terror in France than Germany, because fewer Turks than Arabs have the horrible views from the start. It's also why Germany have some of the most successful right-wing terrorist groups in western Europe, simply because Germany with its size have quantitive larger extreme right than most West European countries.

It's why in smaller countries or communities (like American Muslims) Lone Wolves are the most successful, while in large countries or communities (like the French-Belgian Arab community) we see cells being more successful.  

[ingemann]

The main difference is that far-right terrorist usual don't swear allegiance to some organisation, they seem to take pride in the fact, that they're lone wolves.

More of an emphasis on the idea of the individual's will and so on in their propaganda I suppose.

They're also less likely to realise that trying to buy explosives over the internet is a bit stupid.

Terrorist in general fail because of their own stupidity in the planning phase, my municipality alone have had two (Islamist) terror cells, which have failed because they ordered large amount of fertiliser.

I am sorry, I just snorted.

Yes it's a little funny, when in a Copenhagen working class suburb someone living in a apartment decides to buy several hundred kilos of fertiliser.

[Atlas Has Shrugged]

Looks like this monster bought his guns in the last week.  Republicans killed a bill which would have stopped him from buying these guns last year.  Look at who has even more blood on there hands.

1 man has blood on his hands.

Jerry, I like you, but you aren't helping anyone here. Direct the anger at the man who'd kill you just for being who you are if he had the chance.

[Joe Republic]

You can lead a horse to water, but you can't make it drink, I suppose.  Whatever, this shooting will pass, and we won't change a thing. We won't institute common sense gun control, and we won't do anything about the flow of people into this country who hate our values and want to kill us.

Dude was an American citizen, so what does this have to do with immigration?

Importing thousands upon thousands of people with similar beliefs will surely do nothing but inflame what is going on with Muslims in the US.  It's that simple.

Preventing others from entering the country wouldn't have stopped this from happening. Seriously, you are trying to tie two issues that aren't related to each other whatsoever.

Yes, actually.  It would have stopped this from happening.

How, exactly?  The shooter was American.

[Green Line]

You can lead a horse to water, but you can't make it drink, I suppose.  Whatever, this shooting will pass, and we won't change a thing. We won't institute common sense gun control, and we won't do anything about the flow of people into this country who hate our values and want to kill us.

Dude was an American citizen, so what does this have to do with immigration?

Importing thousands upon thousands of people with similar beliefs will surely do nothing but inflame what is going on with Muslims in the US.  It's that simple.

Preventing others from entering the country wouldn't have stopped this from happening. Seriously, you are trying to tie two issues that aren't related to each other whatsoever.

Yes, actually.  It would have stopped this from happening.

How, exactly?  The shooter was American.

His parents were not.

[/]

You can lead a horse to water, but you can't make it drink, I suppose.  Whatever, this shooting will pass, and we won't change a thing. We won't institute common sense gun control, and we won't do anything about the flow of people into this country who hate our values and want to kill us.

Dude was an American citizen, so what does this have to do with immigration?

Importing thousands upon thousands of people with similar beliefs will surely do nothing but inflame what is going on with Muslims in the US.  It's that simple.

Preventing others from entering the country wouldn't have stopped this from happening. Seriously, you are trying to tie two issues that aren't related to each other whatsoever.

Yes, actually.  It would have stopped this from happening.

How, exactly?  The shooter was American.

His parents were not.

GREAT point. The refugees themselves aren't the problem; their hypothetical children are.

[Green Line]

You can lead a horse to water, but you can't make it drink, I suppose.  Whatever, this shooting will pass, and we won't change a thing. We won't institute common sense gun control, and we won't do anything about the flow of people into this country who hate our values and want to kill us.

Dude was an American citizen, so what does this have to do with immigration?

Importing thousands upon thousands of people with similar beliefs will surely do nothing but inflame what is going on with Muslims in the US.  It's that simple.

Preventing others from entering the country wouldn't have stopped this from happening. Seriously, you are trying to tie two issues that aren't related to each other whatsoever.

Yes, actually.  It would have stopped this from happening.

How, exactly?  The shooter was American.

His parents were not.

GREAT point. The refugees themselves aren't the problem; their hypothetical children are.

Yeah, radicals breed more radicals, who would have thought.  They're both a problem.

[Yank2133]

You can lead a horse to water, but you can't make it drink, I suppose.  Whatever, this shooting will pass, and we won't change a thing. We won't institute common sense gun control, and we won't do anything about the flow of people into this country who hate our values and want to kill us.

Dude was an American citizen, so what does this have to do with immigration?

Importing thousands upon thousands of people with similar beliefs will surely do nothing but inflame what is going on with Muslims in the US.  It's that simple.

Preventing others from entering the country wouldn't have stopped this from happening. Seriously, you are trying to tie two issues that aren't related to each other whatsoever.

Yes, actually.  It would have stopped this from happening.

How, exactly?  The shooter was American.

His parents were not.

GREAT point. The refugees themselves aren't the problem; their hypothetical children are.

Yeah, radicals breed more radicals, who would have thought.  They're both a problem.

You seriously blaming the parents for this?

[Green Line]

You can lead a horse to water, but you can't make it drink, I suppose.  Whatever, this shooting will pass, and we won't change a thing. We won't institute common sense gun control, and we won't do anything about the flow of people into this country who hate our values and want to kill us.

Dude was an American citizen, so what does this have to do with immigration?

Importing thousands upon thousands of people with similar beliefs will surely do nothing but inflame what is going on with Muslims in the US.  It's that simple.

Preventing others from entering the country wouldn't have stopped this from happening. Seriously, you are trying to tie two issues that aren't related to each other whatsoever.

Yes, actually.  It would have stopped this from happening.

How, exactly?  The shooter was American.

His parents were not.

GREAT point. The refugees themselves aren't the problem; their hypothetical children are.

Yeah, radicals breed more radicals, who would have thought.  They're both a problem.

A

You seriously blaming the parents for this?

YOU said we couldn't have prevented this. The fact is his family immigrated here from Afghanistan. If they hadn't, he wouldnt be here and this shooting wouldnt have happened.  What arent you understanding?

[This account no longer in use.]

Why did I expect anything good to come from this thread?

[Yank2133]

You can lead a horse to water, but you can't make it drink, I suppose.  Whatever, this shooting will pass, and we won't change a thing. We won't institute common sense gun control, and we won't do anything about the flow of people into this country who hate our values and want to kill us.

Dude was an American citizen, so what does this have to do with immigration?

Importing thousands upon thousands of people with similar beliefs will surely do nothing but inflame what is going on with Muslims in the US.  It's that simple.

Preventing others from entering the country wouldn't have stopped this from happening. Seriously, you are trying to tie two issues that aren't related to each other whatsoever.

Yes, actually.  It would have stopped this from happening.

How, exactly?  The shooter was American.

His parents were not.

GREAT point. The refugees themselves aren't the problem; their hypothetical children are.

Yeah, radicals breed more radicals, who would have thought.  They're both a problem.

A

You seriously blaming the parents for this?

YOU said we couldn't have prevented this. The fact is his family immigrated here from Afghanistan. If they hadn't, he wouldnt be here and this shooting wouldnt have happened.  What arent you understanding?

So basically you just want the country to adopt some xenophobic immigration policy and punish people who have done nothing wrong.

[HagridOfTheDeep]

You can lead a horse to water, but you can't make it drink, I suppose.  Whatever, this shooting will pass, and we won't change a thing. We won't institute common sense gun control, and we won't do anything about the flow of people into this country who hate our values and want to kill us.

Dude was an American citizen, so what does this have to do with immigration?

Importing thousands upon thousands of people with similar beliefs will surely do nothing but inflame what is going on with Muslims in the US.  It's that simple.

Preventing others from entering the country wouldn't have stopped this from happening. Seriously, you are trying to tie two issues that aren't related to each other whatsoever.

Yes, actually.  It would have stopped this from happening.

How, exactly?  The shooter was American.

His parents were not.

GREAT point. The refugees themselves aren't the problem; their hypothetical children are.

Yeah, radicals breed more radicals, who would have thought.  They're both a problem.

A

You seriously blaming the parents for this?

YOU said we couldn't have prevented this. The fact is his family immigrated here from Afghanistan. If they hadn't, he wouldnt be here and this shooting wouldnt have happened.  What arent you understanding?

Forgive me, but you actually seem like a fantastic fit for Donald Trump.

[World politics is up Schmitt creek]

The saddest thing about this thread is that the usual played-out arguments about Islam and about gun control and about 'mental illness' (which as we all know is the same thing as both legal insanity and a propensity to violence) would have been emotionally exhausting enough, but instead we have pages and pages of #analysis over whether or not Salafi jihadism is right-wing and at least one poster implicitly demanding that the president use a specific phrase that he would probably be likelier to use if the Republicans hadn't made a shibboleth of it, so the usual played-out arguments are looking awfully good right now in comparison. I only read the first five pages. I don't even want to know where the thread has gone since then.

[True Federalist (진정한 연방 주의자)]

The saddest thing about this thread is that the usual played-out arguments about Islam and about gun control and about 'mental illness' (which as we all know is the same thing as both legal insanity and a propensity to violence) would have been emotionally exhausting enough, but instead we have pages and pages of #analysis over whether or not Salafi jihadism is right-wing and at least one poster implicitly demanding that the president use a specific phrase that he would probably be likelier to use if the Republicans hadn't made a shibboleth of it, so the usual played-out arguments are looking awfully good right now in comparison. I only read the first five pages. I don't even want to know where the thread has gone since then.

Not downhill, but that's more because it never headed uphill.

[MaxQue]

You can lead a horse to water, but you can't make it drink, I suppose.  Whatever, this shooting will pass, and we won't change a thing. We won't institute common sense gun control, and we won't do anything about the flow of people into this country who hate our values and want to kill us.

Dude was an American citizen, so what does this have to do with immigration?

Importing thousands upon thousands of people with similar beliefs will surely do nothing but inflame what is going on with Muslims in the US.  It's that simple.

Preventing others from entering the country wouldn't have stopped this from happening. Seriously, you are trying to tie two issues that aren't related to each other whatsoever.

Yes, actually.  It would have stopped this from happening.

How, exactly?  The shooter was American.

His parents were not.

GREAT point. The refugees themselves aren't the problem; their hypothetical children are.

Yeah, radicals breed more radicals, who would have thought.  They're both a problem.

And idiots breed idiots, so let's hope you never impregnate someone, Brown.

[True Federalist (진정한 연방 주의자)]

Anyone find it odd that the FBI was Johnny on the spot soon as things went down?    They were wacthing this guy imo ,but probably not given the green light to scoop him up from Administration.

Due process can be a birch at times, but it it what's keeping the ATF agents you've been paranoid about from knocking down your door to take away your guns. Due process isn't about protecting criminals, it's about protecting the rights of the rest of us.

[Bojack Horseman]

Oh like Marco Rubio actually gives a flying f*** about the LGBT community. Give me a break.

[True Federalist (진정한 연방 주의자)]

Why did I expect that Atlas would react normally to this issue?

Hope?

Why did I expect anything good to come from this thread?

Experience?

Seriously, this thread has skirted awfulness with some posters skirting closer than others, but it easily could be worse.

[afleitch]

What's sad about this thing media wise is that yet again something actually affecting LGBT people now about everyone and everything else.

[Taco Truck 🚚]

Why did I expect anything good to come from this thread?

We've had decades of mass killings in this country with the situation getting worse and worse.  Is there somewhere where people are having "good" conversations about this topic?

It's a mass shooting.  If you say anything other than, "this is unfortunate" it is going to offend someone.

[Taco Truck 🚚]

What's sad about this thing media wise is that yet again something actually affecting LGBT people now about everyone and everything else.

Same thing happens with every mass shooting... because mass shootings aren't about gay people, or little kids, or black people, or Islam.  Their frequency and magnitude are a uniquely American phenomenon that has one common and unique theme.

[Kingpoleon]

Why did I expect anything good to come from this thread?

What good could it bring?

All these shootings do is give people an excuse to politicize tragedy and demand more or less gun control.