SB 2016-006: Muslim Brotherhood Terrorist Designation Act of 2016 (Passed Sen.)

[tmthforu94]

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Senate Sponsor: Goldwater
House Sponsor: Classic Conservative

Sponsors are welcome to present their bill. 72 hours for debate.

[tmthforu94]

I look forward to hearing the sponsor's argument for this bill.

My questions:
- What evidence is there that the Muslim Brotherhood has caused for the destruction of Atlasia?
- In recent years, what terrorist activities has the Muslim Brotherhood engaged in?
- How do you think this bill will affect Atlasia's perception in the Middle East?

[Classic Conservative]

I look forward to hearing the sponsor's argument for this bill.

My questions:
- What evidence is there that the Muslim Brotherhood has caused for the destruction of Atlasia?
- In recent years, what terrorist activities has the Muslim Brotherhood engaged in?
- How do you think this bill will affect Atlasia's perception in the Middle East?

Thank You for your question Senator Tmth,

In response yo your first question, The Muslim Brotherhood released a document in 1991, this document was used as evidence in the Holyland Terror Funding Trial of 2008. It was found in the home of a supporter of the Muslim Brotherhood. The document states for the destruction of the west and a global Islamic State, a common theme in Radical Islam. Here is the document. You don't have to believe all of the subject information from this document, but this has been used as offical federal court evidence before. http://www.clarionproject.org/Muslim_Brotherhood_Explanatory_Memorandum

In response to question two, The Muslim Brotherhood has committed one terrorist attack in the 1970's in Syria. This attack is the only attack in a country other than Egypt. The Muslim Brotherhood had committed many attacks against the Coptic Christian community in Egypt including 70 churches and over 1,000 homes and businesses. This information is from a United States Congressional Act, https://www.congress.gov/bill/114th-congress/senate-bill/2230/text
The Egyptian Government has also said that the Muslim Brotherhood was responsible for a bomb attack near the Pyramids of Giza that killed six innocent civilians.

In response to question three, this wouldn't hurt our reputation in the Middle East. The Government of Syria, Egypt, Russia, Bahrain and The Anti-Defamation League have all declared The Muslim Brotherhood, a terrorist organization.

I would ask that all members read the two sources which, I presented as they are both believable sources.

[tmthforu94]

Thank you for your answers, Representative Classic. It is appreciated.

One follow-up question: why now? From your information, the last threat was over 20 years ago. Why is it important that we designate the Muslim Brotherhood a terrorist group today?

[Classic Conservative]

Thank you for your answers, Representative Classic. It is appreciated.

One follow-up question: why now? From your information, the last threat was over 20 years ago. Why is it important that we designate the Muslim Brotherhood a terrorist group today?

Why, Tmth because not a single congressperson has beforehand. I can't determine what people did beforehand in the US Congress. This bill has been introduced by a senator before IRL. But, it hasn't before. I would have liked to declared them earlier, but I wasn't a congressman beforehand. It's been later than never doing it, if you agree.

[Blair]

I'd like to thank Classic for answering our questions, and hope that the Senate will take a deeper look at this bill than the House did- It was disappointing that a vote on a national security issue was a simple party vote where few House members discussed the issue, and simply pushed it aside. I hope the Senate doesn't do the same thing.

I have a number of concerns over this bill.

+ The evidence provided was not 'credible'. The site mentioned- the Clarion Project is a well a know anti-Muslim group as outlined by the Southern Poverty Law Centre who said...

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The document was a book from 1991; at the same time groups like the IRA, FARC and others were also publishing 'terrorist literature'. Should we outlaw those groups as well? We can't make such a broad sweep based on a single book- from a Federal trial that fell apart in 2007, and was then re-tried in rather suspect circumstances. I'm happy to into the court case in more depth, but it really shouldn't be held up as anything good.

+ Citing the Government of Syria, Bahrain and Russia as hallmarks of what we should follow in the Middle east is well not very convincing for me considering well the obvious faults with those governments.

I've yet to see any evidence that the Muslim Brotherhood is a terrorist group. It's an awful group, that has curtailed civil liberties and has been a force opposed to Progress. I've yet to see any evidence- aside from a 1991 book that they're a terrorist

[Classic Conservative]

To respond to what Senator Blair was stating, I was trying to find the document in full that wasn't in Arabic and The Clairon Project was the first full document, I could find. If, I saw a better site without a bias that had the document, I would've posted a link to that.

[Classic Conservative]

The evidence actually, is credible though, Mr. Senator. A federal judge has ruled that this document was significant evidence in the Holyland Terror Funding Trail that took place in 2008. There is a link about the the trial. https://www.fbi.gov/news/stories/2008/november/hlf112508

The trial didn't fall apart five leaders of The Holyland Foundation were convicted of funneling money to Hamas, a terrorist organization which is propped up by The Muslim Brotherhood. Hamas, which we can all agree is a terrorist organization was influenced by this terrorist organization known as The Muslim Brotherhood.

The question you had about Russia, Syria and Bahrain were merely an answer that, I had to Tmth's answer about will this hurt our perception in the Middle East. In fact, Syria declared this a terrorist organization in the 1970's and Russia in the early 2000's. Egypt declared this a terrorist organization after the people threw out The Muslim Brotherhood and Bahrain followed Egypt's lead in 2011.

[Blair]

Well that's certainly stretching it- the 2008 case (which had some questionable outcomes) was about funding Hamas through charitable givings to the Gaza. Nothing to do with the Muslim Brotherhood.

This is what I want Senators to understand- there's no evidence that the Muslim Brotherhood is a terrorist group towards Atlasian citizens.

If anyone has a Jstor login (You need to be a University/College student) you can read this brilliant paper from Robert Leiken. I'll give Senators some quotes that give an accurate view of the Muslim Brotherhood...

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[Classic Conservative]

Actually, the Holy Land Foundation Case was about the Muslim Brotherhood and Hamas. The FBI states "HLF became the chief fundraising arm for the Palestine Committee in the U.S. created by the Muslim Brotherhood to support Hamas."

https://www.fbi.gov/dallas/press-releases/2009/dl052709.htm

[Blair]

Actually, the Holy Land Foundation Case was about the Muslim Brotherhood and Hamas. The FBI states "HLF became the chief fundraising arm for the Palestine Committee in the U.S. created by the Muslim Brotherhood to support Hamas."

https://www.fbi.gov/dallas/press-releases/2009/dl052709.htm

Again, it's a stretch to say that the Muslim Brotherhood is a terror group because a fundraising committee it set up in 1991 is being used by Hamas (the Government of the Gaza) It's like saying that me as a UK citizen is responsible for the US foreign policy if I donate money to a US charity

[Blair]

Do other Senators have any thoughts on this bill?

[Classic Conservative]

Yes, I'd like to here what our other Senators think of this.

[Pingvin]

Muslim Brotherhood for many years had served as a springboard for terrorists. It should be designated as such ASAP.

[tmthforu94]

Since debate has slowed and the bill has been on the floor for over 72 hours, we will now move into a final vote. Senators, please vote Aye, Nay or Abstain.


Aye

[Goldwater]

AYE

[Pingvin]

Aye

[Blair]

It's worth asserting for the 10th time there is no credible evidence that the Muslim Brotherhood is a terrorist group, there is none what so-ever. Let's rule with our heads guys,

Nay

[This account no longer in use.]

Abstain.

[Prince of Salem]

Abstain

 thereWhilemostly) himoshistorical evidence of the Muslim Brotherhood acting as a terrorist group, a real determination for such an issue would require much further investigation. Something which, while it was tried, wasn't fully achieved, and it would've required a much deeper and organized investigation. Anyway…

[tmthforu94]

This bill currently has enough votes to pass. Senators have 24 hours to change their votes.

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3/6 is enough?

[Pragmatic Conservative]

3/6 is enough?

A bunch abstained so a Majority  will have voted yes.

[/]

Ohh.

[Blair]

Worth noting that if my colleagues change their vote to Nay this bill will not pass, rather than pass with only 50% of the Senate