Why it should be Elizabeth Warren
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  Why it should be Elizabeth Warren
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Author Topic: Why it should be Elizabeth Warren  (Read 520 times)
Blue3
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« on: July 22, 2016, 04:35:40 PM »
« edited: July 22, 2016, 04:51:27 PM by Blue3 »

Why it should be Elizabeth Warren

1. She'd be an effective governing partner for Hillary, able to rally the progressive coalition to her, and make progressives feel like they have an important voice in the administration. Bill Clinton will already be there to speak for the moderates.

2. She'd help win the general election against Donald Trump. Already proven to be an effective attack dog against Trump. Held a "high energy" rally with Hillary that was well choreographed with the two of them working closely together flawlessly.

3. She'd help give some enthusiasm to Bernie supporters (maybe not the die-hard's, but they're a small fraction... most have already come around to Hillary, but they need to get more enthusiastic about her too)

4. Hillary doesn't need someone with a diverse, highly-experienced political background like Kaine's... she already is herself. And Elizabeth Warren is still a US Senator who has experienced presidential-level attention for years, and served in the Obama administration.

5. This ticket would underline and draw back attention to Hillary's liberal roots, and underline the historic nature of how far women have come in this country in just 100 years with this ticket. She doesn't have to pick Warren for party unity. She already has it. It would show that she really is a progressive at heart. As well as different from her husband, and even Obama in some respects, who both like moderates more.

6. It would fight against the narrative that Hillary is "bought" by the banks, or corrupt. Which it seems Trump is even more likely to use than Bernie did (despite the irony of it coming from Trump).

 
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Blue3
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« Reply #1 on: July 22, 2016, 05:16:12 PM »

Thoughts?

What's the Kaine supporter or Vilsack supporter response?
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skoods
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« Reply #2 on: July 22, 2016, 05:17:10 PM »

I would prefer Liz. But, unlike the little crybaby progressives who care more about their own knickers than the good of the party, I won't really care no matter who she picks.
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ag
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« Reply #3 on: July 22, 2016, 06:01:08 PM »

Thoughts?

What's the Kaine supporter or Vilsack supporter response?

1. Being VP is not about being a "governing partner". It is, largely, about not interfeering and, on occasion, doing whatever you are told to do.

2. In the end, far left does not have many places to go to. At worst, they would vote Stein or stay home. Most of them will vote Clinton anyway. It is the mainline Republicans and centrist independents Clinton has to be appealing to. Warren is as disliked among those as she herself is, or more. Choice of Warren would help those parts of the electorate in justifying their vote for Trump. Kaine would not provide that justification.

3. Kaine would be very useful appealing to the Hispanic vote. Yes, of course, that vote is already energized, but there is nothing like a Spanish speaker to really bring it out.

4. If, per chance, Clinton needed a "governing partner", I am sure she would much rather have somebody as experienced as Kaine than a Warren.

5. Virginia is a swing state. Massachussetts is not. Kaine is a southerner.

6. Warren can be easily linked to the "university elites" - playing exactly into Trump's narrative. In fact, long before this election I have heard this argument made by potential Trump voters about Warren: she is "one of them", "she is an insider", etc.

7. If she is the VP, her seat goes Republican for the early stage of the administration: right when most things could be done. If that results in a 49:51 Senate, that would not be good.

8. Even if you care about her having an impact on the administration, she would have a lot more impact from the Senate (or from the cabinet) than she can possibly have as VP.

I could continue.
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MASHED POTATOES. VOTE!
Kalwejt
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« Reply #4 on: July 22, 2016, 06:04:40 PM »

It's not really about competitive states. Biden and Cheney were from a non-competitive states.

Warren is already being an excellent attack dog against Trump. Also, nominating her would confirm the Democratic Party's progressive direction, while Kaine just smell with DLC-ism.
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Chief Justice Keef
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« Reply #5 on: July 22, 2016, 06:42:11 PM »

2. In the end, far left does not have many places to go to. At worst, they would vote Stein or stay home. Most of them will vote Clinton anyway. It is the mainline Republicans and centrist independents Clinton has to be appealing to. Warren is as disliked among those as she herself is, or more. Choice of Warren would help those parts of the electorate in justifying their vote for Trump. Kaine would not provide that justification.

When it comes to most winning tickets, it's actually the other way around. Jay Heinrichs, a rhetor, actually detailed this before. Winning candidates position themselves in the middle, rather than their VP. That's why they choose a running mate with more extreme opinions of their own, to energize all factions of the base.

It's what you saw with Nixon and Agnew, Clinton and Gore, Bush and Cheney and Obama and Biden.
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ag
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« Reply #6 on: July 22, 2016, 06:48:36 PM »

2. In the end, far left does not have many places to go to. At worst, they would vote Stein or stay home. Most of them will vote Clinton anyway. It is the mainline Republicans and centrist independents Clinton has to be appealing to. Warren is as disliked among those as she herself is, or more. Choice of Warren would help those parts of the electorate in justifying their vote for Trump. Kaine would not provide that justification.

When it comes to most winning tickets, it's actually the other way around. Jay Heinrichs, a rhetor, actually detailed this before. Winning candidates position themselves in the middle, rather than their VP. That's why they choose a running mate with more extreme opinions of their own, to energize all factions of the base.

It's what you saw with Nixon and Agnew, Clinton and Gore, Bush and Cheney and Obama and Biden.

It does not normally happen that a big chunk of what should be the electorate of the other party is so uncomfortable of their nominee. Clinton has difficulty appealing to a moderate Republican because of her history. But Warren simply has no chance there: she is, in almost every other sense, worse for this electorate than Clinton herself. Clinton needs somebody who can help her highlight the "normalcy of her ticket." Not everybody wants a revolution, you know.
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Hermit For Peace
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« Reply #7 on: July 22, 2016, 07:51:02 PM »


Here's why it shouldn't be her. Because she has the charisma and the drive and the high energy to be President herself. She is too strong and outspoken to be anyone's VP.

(Of course this is a moot point now that Kaine has been chosen already.)
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