Democratic National Convention **live commentary thread**

[angus]

If you guys got through Dudabides and KCDEM, then you guys can handle me calling Bernie a socialist for a roll call duration.

I mean, Bernie Sanders has called himself a socialist himself. There is no (further) harm there.

So would it be fair to say then that he personally is a socialist, (of course his voters aren't), since why doesn't he call himself a social democrat??

It would not.  He was thoroughly vetted by both the Socialist Party USA and the Socialist Workers Party and they decided he was not a Socialist.  In fact, he is a Democrat.  He ran as a Democrat candidate in the Democrat Primaries this year.  You only add to confusion when you label him a socialist.  Many of his voters may be socialist, but Sanders, despite his self-identification as a socialist, is not recognized as a socialist by either of the main two socialist organizations, and to continue doing so generates confusion.  That said, Wulfric is just having fun.  Let him have fun.  I'm not knocking what he is doing, but your question needs to be answered:  Sanders, at the moment, is a Democrat.  If you don't understand that, you must have been asleep in a cave like Rumplestiltskin.  The whole Feel the Bern thing and the Sandernistas and the BernieBots and the Bernie Bros and the like, attacking Clintonistas, would not have occurred if Sanders ran as a Socialist instead of a Democrat.

[angus]

He is definitely not a Socialist. But he is a socialist.

I don't regard him as one.  You have to remember that gringos use the term very, very loosely.  I suspect you do as well, and that this may be part of your point, but I cannot accept that definition.  Socialism is a legitimate and thorough economic system, and it offers many advantages.  It is an economic system by which the means of production and distribution of goods are in the control of the state.  If Sanders were genuinely a socialist, and genuinely rallied in favor of socialism, then he might achieve many wonderful ends--then again, he might achieve many horrible ones as socialist policies can have some disastrous unintended consequences.  In any case, he is a Democrat and a capitalist.  What he idealizes is something like Scandanavian-style democracy, replete with welfare net and a healthy injection of collectivism.  It is a little disingenuous to try to spin his policy proposals otherwise.

[angus]

Sanders is coming on?  Is he going to nominate Clinton?

Hell, I might actually watch.  I haven't watched any of the RNC or DNC--although I do like watching these threads--Sanders nominating Clinton actually be worth a watch.  We don't have to head out till about 7:15.  Reckon he'll speak and be finished before then?


ag:  I'm conflicted about Mitterand.  I remember being in high school and learning of the "socialist" policies of Mitterand at the time, but they seemed to conflict with what we were actually learning in school, especially regarding socialism, its definition and origins.  It's always tough to be smarter than the teachers, isn't it.  I'm sure you know how exactly what I'm talking about.  

[angus]

And, no, I do not know what you are talking about. I used to have good teachers.

haha.  not gonna bite, are you smartass?  Fair enough.  

Sanders is a Democrat and a capitalist.  Not a Socialist.  Not a socialist.  It may be his "brand" but it's a ruse.

By the way, I must have missed something.  I turned on the TV and I'm getting McAuliffe bashing Trump.  Yadayadayada.  Turning it off.  Maybe I'll catch the Bernie speech later on CSPAN or on the internet.