Current Trump Press Conference: I hope Russia finds Hillary's emails
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  Current Trump Press Conference: I hope Russia finds Hillary's emails
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Author Topic: Current Trump Press Conference: I hope Russia finds Hillary's emails  (Read 7045 times)
ProudModerate2
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« Reply #150 on: July 27, 2016, 04:31:00 PM »

I think Trump critics are playing this one wrong.

With the outrage, undecided voters aren't hearing that Trump is relying on a hostile power. They're hearing that Trump critics are afraid that there is stuff out there that is so bad and disgusting that it could cost Hillary Clinton the election.

No, I think you are wrong. It's the opposite.
They are hearing that trump would allow Russia an easy path to do whatever they want.
That trump would do nothing to help our allies, or nations neighboring Russia, that no longer want anything to do with "Mother Putin."
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Atlas Has Shrugged
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« Reply #151 on: July 27, 2016, 04:39:25 PM »

I think Trump critics are playing this one wrong.

With the outrage, undecided voters aren't hearing that Trump is relying on a hostile power. They're hearing that Trump critics are afraid that there is stuff out there that is so bad and disgusting that it could cost Hillary Clinton the election.

No, I think you are wrong. It's the opposite.
They are hearing that trump would allow Russia an easy path to do whatever they want.
That trump would do nothing to help our allies, or nations neighboring Russia, that no longer want anything to do with "Mother Putin."
No. You're wrong. You're wrong. I win.
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Virginiá
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« Reply #152 on: July 27, 2016, 04:46:46 PM »

Personally, I wouldn't even give a hoot about this if Trump hadn't already shown how friendly he wants to be with Russia. Between the Ukraine provision in the platform, the anti-NATO stuff, the constant favorable remarks, and on and on, well, it really doesn't look good to me.

My opinion is that Trump said this in a half-joking manner as he sees more leaks beneficial to him, so he cracked a poorly-chosen joke about it. The serious half is that Trump no doubt does want more leaks and he would be very happy if Russia did indeed leak more data. Does this make Trump some Manchurian candidate, spy or have direct ties/plans with Putin? Hells no. However, it does make him a reckless asshole who is so willing to do anything to win, that he would gladly invite a foreign power to hack government/private systems so as to tip the election to him.

Trump doesn't care about things such as the repercussions of foreign powers meddling in American elections. He just cares about winning, and Putin knows how good it would be for Russia if Trump was president. Trump's comment was so dangerous (imo) because he is so pro-Russia that Putin is probably likely to continue trying to help him, unless international pressure is too much for him.

If you guys think it's OK to even semi-seriously invite foreign powers to screw with our elections, or think Trump was 100% joking, you are delusional.
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True Federalist (진정한 연방 주의자)
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« Reply #153 on: July 27, 2016, 04:47:32 PM »

It's fairly clear to me that this was just another of Trump's attempts at humor. This is not a game changer, and I say that as someone who thanks to Trump decided that the GOP had gone so far around the bend into Crazyville that I abandoned being an Independent and am now a Democrat. Besides, the Russians need no encouragement to hack computers. Unless Trump is funneling passwords to the Russians, calling his comment traitorous is excessive hyperbole.
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diskymike44
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« Reply #154 on: July 27, 2016, 04:53:30 PM »

Trump says he didn't have anything to do with DNC email hack.

Quote
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https://mobile.twitter.com/reidepstein/status/758401289889935361


This is unreal you can't make this stuff up.
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Storebought
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« Reply #155 on: July 27, 2016, 04:58:06 PM »

All this complaining about Trump's trumpery of Russia does is make the US, and particularly this Administration, look very weak: "Oh, my gracious!, a country with 1/3rd our population and 1/5th our wealth is stealing our election! Mother, make them stop." It's pathetic and distracting. Just chalk this up as another one of Trump's inanities and move on.
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Virginiá
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« Reply #156 on: July 27, 2016, 05:01:24 PM »

All this complaining about Trump's trumpery of Russia does is make the US, and particularly this Administration, look very weak: "Oh, my gracious!, a country with 1/3rd our population and 1/5th our wealth is stealing our election! Mother, make them stop." It's pathetic and distracting. Just chalk this up as another one of Trump's inanities and move on.

Uh, the hack on the DNC is not outside the capabilities of many criminal organizations, let alone a country like Russia, who is known for its expertise is technology. Russian hackers (state sponsored or not) contribute massively to the number of hacks around the world.

Point is, even Ukraine could orchestrate such a hack (Ukraine is also a major source of cybercrime, in addition to Russia). It really doesn't take a whole lot of resources or manpower for something like this.
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windjammer
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« Reply #157 on: July 27, 2016, 05:03:13 PM »

But, yes, I wrote a very long mea culpa on Trump over on AAD a few months back. I think my main issue was a blindness, due to not living in the horrifying 24/7 US media environment, to the corrosive impact the Trump thing was having outside of politics.

e: That blindness was also partly wilful, probably. Hey, it was fun! Best not to think of the implications.

Fair enough. As someone who might directly suffer from a Drumpf victory (far less seriously than most Americans, admittedly, but still), I accept your apology.

I'm glad to hear that.

Just curious, have other "fellow travelers" recanted as well? I'd like to know which posters I can go back to valuing at least somewhat.
I don't regret having ironically supported Trump in the republican primaries.
This is the worst party in the occidental world, even worse than the National Front. Watching him destroying so many careers, well, it makes me feel so good.
And additionnally, his nomination has definitely increased the likelihood of Clinton winning the presidency, doesn't mean she will win, but truly her best chance is against him.
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Averroës Nix
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« Reply #158 on: July 27, 2016, 05:05:10 PM »

All this complaining about Trump's trumpery of Russia does is make the US, and particularly this Administration, look very weak: "Oh, my gracious!, a country with 1/3rd our population and 1/5th our wealth is stealing our election! Mother, make them stop." It's pathetic and distracting. Just chalk this up as another one of Trump's inanities and move on.

Uh, the hack on the DNC is not outside the capabilities of many criminal organizations, let alone a country like Russia, who is known for its expertise is technology. Russian hackers (state sponsored or not) contribute massively to the number of hacks around the world.

Point is, even Ukraine could orchestrate such a hack (Ukraine is also a major source of cybercrime, in addition to Russia). It really doesn't take a whole lot of resources or manpower for something like this.
This is also a reason to be somewhat skeptical of claims that the hack *must* have been backed by the Kremlin. There are plenty of groups that possess the resources and skill to pull off what we have seen, even without anything resembling a state sponsor.
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Mister Mets
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« Reply #159 on: July 27, 2016, 05:05:25 PM »

Trump isn't joking.


He's now doubling-down on Twitter.
It's not that kind of a joke. It isn't just a random quip. He raises ideas for the reactions, which are always more severe among the media than they are among the audience.

I want to know why Putin can't interfere in our elections and Obama can go over and campaign for the Remain side in the Brexit? The same Obama who didn't attempt to undermine Netanyahu and Likud's campaign? Putin plays by the same rules that Obama does, he just has more balls.

There's a difference between campaigning openly and violating laws.

If Putin wants to discuss why he prefers Trump to Hillary Clinton, he's welcome to do so.

But it doesn't mean that he can pay people to steal information.
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Atlas Has Shrugged
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« Reply #160 on: July 27, 2016, 05:11:50 PM »

If you guys think it's OK to even semi-seriously invite foreign powers to screw with our elections, or think Trump was 100% joking, you are delusional.
AIPAC?
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windjammer
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« Reply #161 on: July 27, 2016, 05:13:00 PM »

If you guys think it's OK to even semi-seriously invite foreign powers to screw with our elections, or think Trump was 100% joking, you are delusional.
AIPAC?
¨
Dear ing god, on this one, you're right. AIPAC should be banned as well.

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Beet
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« Reply #162 on: July 27, 2016, 05:15:29 PM »

The other point is that it's not like Democrats didn't want positive relations with Russia. Clinton herself helped negotiate New START, Obama campaigned on the Cold War is over (true), and Kerry wants to align with Russia against ISIS. Trump is acting like these are all his ideas when Obama has been implementing them for years. But you can't expect us to react positively to getting hacked.
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Storebought
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« Reply #163 on: July 27, 2016, 05:16:38 PM »

All this complaining about Trump's trumpery of Russia does is make the US, and particularly this Administration, look very weak: "Oh, my gracious!, a country with 1/3rd our population and 1/5th our wealth is stealing our election! Mother, make them stop." It's pathetic and distracting. Just chalk this up as another one of Trump's inanities and move on.

Uh, the hack on the DNC is not outside the capabilities of many criminal organizations, let alone a country like Russia, who is known for its expertise is technology. Russian hackers (state sponsored or not) contribute massively to the number of hacks around the world.

Point is, even Ukraine could orchestrate such a hack (Ukraine is also a major source of cybercrime, in addition to Russia). It really doesn't take a whole lot of resources or manpower for something like this.

What you are speaking of is a matter of law enforcement and intelligence gathering. Let the investigation proceed: when the FBI can make a fact-based report about the breach, then, and only then, should it become a campaign issue. Until then it's only impotent rage.
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Seriously?
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« Reply #164 on: July 27, 2016, 05:26:39 PM »
« Edited: July 27, 2016, 05:28:27 PM by Seriously? »

Trump now receives intelligence briefings and he's calling for foreign nations to commit cyber warfare against his opponent. How is this happening?!?
How can you commit "cyber warfare" if the data doesn't exist and Hillary! deleted the e-mails in question?

I don't blame Trump for hoping the Russians find the e-mails deleted by Hillary! in an act of treason/affront to the Sunshine laws.

If the FBI can't find them, I hope someone can. Preferably someone like Wikileaks.
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ProudModerate2
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« Reply #165 on: July 27, 2016, 05:32:58 PM »

One of the best posts on why this does not help trump :
(Red color print is my emphasis.)

What your missing is that Trump doesn't need to be labeled as a Kremlin agent. Russia is unpopular as is Putin. Trump is clearly showing that he holds pro-Russian views. Trump may have tapped into alot of hidden sentiments in America, but I guarantee you pro-Russian will not be one of them.
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Seriously?
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« Reply #166 on: July 27, 2016, 05:37:31 PM »

One of the best posts on why this does not help trump :
(Red color print is my emphasis.)

What your missing is that Trump doesn't need to be labeled as a Kremlin agent. Russia is unpopular as is Putin. Trump is clearly showing that he holds pro-Russian views. Trump may have tapped into alot of hidden sentiments in America, but I guarantee you pro-Russian will not be one of them.
No, Trump wants the 30,000 e-mails that were illegally deleted by Hillary Clinton to be found.

And he's an evil genius. He got the Clinton camp to concede that her e-mails posed a national security risk

Further, Russia can't hack anything right now. The basement Hillary! server is no longer in operation, so contrary to liberal heads spinning, Trump can't ask Russia to hack anything. If Russia does have the e-mails, however, they should release them to the FBI.

Finally, Trump has shifted the narrative from your DNC convention to a spat about e-mails, which Clinton is most vulnerable on.
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DrScholl
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« Reply #167 on: July 27, 2016, 05:38:45 PM »

Since hacking is apparently a-okay, someone should hack Trump's tax records and release them. The public has a right to know, so hack away!!!
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Seriously?
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« Reply #168 on: July 27, 2016, 05:39:47 PM »

Since hacking is apparently a-okay, someone should hack Trump's tax records and release them. The public has a right to know, so hack away!!!
All you need is one IRS employee to do that.. Too bad your friend Lois no longer works there.
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Virginiá
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« Reply #169 on: July 27, 2016, 05:43:37 PM »
« Edited: July 27, 2016, 05:45:44 PM by Virginia »

All this complaining about Trump's trumpery of Russia does is make the US, and particularly this Administration, look very weak: "Oh, my gracious!, a country with 1/3rd our population and 1/5th our wealth is stealing our election! Mother, make them stop." It's pathetic and distracting. Just chalk this up as another one of Trump's inanities and move on.

Uh, the hack on the DNC is not outside the capabilities of many criminal organizations, let alone a country like Russia, who is known for its expertise is technology. Russian hackers (state sponsored or not) contribute massively to the number of hacks around the world.

Point is, even Ukraine could orchestrate such a hack (Ukraine is also a major source of cybercrime, in addition to Russia). It really doesn't take a whole lot of resources or manpower for something like this.

What you are speaking of is a matter of law enforcement and intelligence gathering. Let the investigation proceed: when the FBI can make a fact-based report about the breach, then, and only then, should it become a campaign issue. Until then it's only impotent rage.

Trump's comments today are absolutely fair game. If Trump says in a press conference "pls Putin pls hack more and release them emails", then yes, Hillary has every right to smear him on that. I'm not saying Clinton's campaign should go around saying definitively that Russia hacked the DNC, but when Trump says anything, it's open to attack. Trump certainly does not give Hillary a pass on anything, so it's not unreasonable to respond in kind. This election is already hyper-negative, so at this point, it's whatever.

If Trump hadn't opened his big mouth, I'd have said that pushing the Russian angle too much would be wrong, but now Trump has given Clinton something to go on.
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ProudModerate2
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« Reply #170 on: July 27, 2016, 05:46:54 PM »

One of the best posts on why this does not help trump :
(Red color print is my emphasis.)

What your missing is that Trump doesn't need to be labeled as a Kremlin agent. Russia is unpopular as is Putin. Trump is clearly showing that he holds pro-Russian views. Trump may have tapped into alot of hidden sentiments in America, but I guarantee you pro-Russian will not be one of them.

No, Trump wants the 30,000 e-mails that were illegally deleted by Hillary Clinton to be found.
And he's an evil genius. He got the Clinton camp to concede that her e-mails posed a national security risk
Further, Russia can't hack anything right now. The basement Hillary! server is no longer in operation, so contrary to liberal heads spinning, Trump can't ask Russia to hack anything. If Russia does have the e-mails, however, they should release them to the FBI.
Finally, Trump has shifted the narrative from your DNC convention to a spat about e-mails, which Clinton is most vulnerable on.

Wrong.
Read the headlines on all the major media outlets.
The talk is that trump's words are "treacherous" and that trump's continued views and foreign policy suggestions, lean more and more "pro-Russian."
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Crumpets
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« Reply #171 on: July 27, 2016, 05:47:43 PM »

One of the best posts on why this does not help trump :
(Red color print is my emphasis.)

What your missing is that Trump doesn't need to be labeled as a Kremlin agent. Russia is unpopular as is Putin. Trump is clearly showing that he holds pro-Russian views. Trump may have tapped into alot of hidden sentiments in America, but I guarantee you pro-Russian will not be one of them.

No, Trump wants the 30,000 e-mails that were illegally deleted by Hillary Clinton to be found.
And he's an evil genius. He got the Clinton camp to concede that her e-mails posed a national security risk
Further, Russia can't hack anything right now. The basement Hillary! server is no longer in operation, so contrary to liberal heads spinning, Trump can't ask Russia to hack anything. If Russia does have the e-mails, however, they should release them to the FBI.
Finally, Trump has shifted the narrative from your DNC convention to a spat about e-mails, which Clinton is most vulnerable on.

Wrong.
Read the headlines on all the major media outlets.
The talk is that trump's words are "treacherous" and that trump's continued views and foreign policy suggestions, lean more and more "pro-Russian."


But that's the media! Americans hate the media!
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Seriously?
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« Reply #172 on: July 27, 2016, 05:50:11 PM »

One of the best posts on why this does not help trump :
(Red color print is my emphasis.)

What your missing is that Trump doesn't need to be labeled as a Kremlin agent. Russia is unpopular as is Putin. Trump is clearly showing that he holds pro-Russian views. Trump may have tapped into alot of hidden sentiments in America, but I guarantee you pro-Russian will not be one of them.

No, Trump wants the 30,000 e-mails that were illegally deleted by Hillary Clinton to be found.
And he's an evil genius. He got the Clinton camp to concede that her e-mails posed a national security risk
Further, Russia can't hack anything right now. The basement Hillary! server is no longer in operation, so contrary to liberal heads spinning, Trump can't ask Russia to hack anything. If Russia does have the e-mails, however, they should release them to the FBI.
Finally, Trump has shifted the narrative from your DNC convention to a spat about e-mails, which Clinton is most vulnerable on.

Wrong.
Read the headlines on all the major media outlets.
The talk is that trump's words are "treacherous" and that trump's continued views and foreign policy suggestions, lean more and more "pro-Russian."

Because the DNC media is as dumb as a rock. You cant hack an offline server that's in FBI custody.
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cinyc
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« Reply #173 on: July 27, 2016, 05:56:30 PM »

As usual, Atlas doesn't get it.  Trump has Hillary Clinton talking about her e-mails again.  Every day Clinton is talking about her e-mails instead of something else is a day Donald Trump is winning.  The Russia angle is just a tar baby - the more Democrats and the press get into a hissy fit about it, the more it reinforces Americans that Hillary lied about her e-mails.  Releasing them are now a danger to national security, don't you know?  But she never sent or received classified information through her e-mails, right.  So how can that be?
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Absentee Voting Ghost of Ruin
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« Reply #174 on: July 27, 2016, 05:57:54 PM »

All this complaining about Trump's trumpery of Russia does is make the US, and particularly this Administration, look very weak: "Oh, my gracious!, a country with 1/3rd our population and 1/5th our wealth is stealing our election! Mother, make them stop." It's pathetic and distracting. Just chalk this up as another one of Trump's inanities and move on.

Uh, the hack on the DNC is not outside the capabilities of many criminal organizations, let alone a country like Russia, who is known for its expertise is technology. Russian hackers (state sponsored or not) contribute massively to the number of hacks around the world.

Point is, even Ukraine could orchestrate such a hack (Ukraine is also a major source of cybercrime, in addition to Russia). It really doesn't take a whole lot of resources or manpower for something like this.
This is also a reason to be somewhat skeptical of claims that the hack *must* have been backed by the Kremlin. There are plenty of groups that possess the resources and skill to pull off what we have seen, even without anything resembling a state sponsor.

The evidence, reviewed and confirmed not just by intelligence community flaks but by multiple respected companies and individuals in the cybersecurity field, shows multiple seperate indicators of Russian intelligence agencies.

https://www.schneier.com/blog/archives/2016/07/russian_hack_of.html

This is real, not just an attempt to smear Trump.
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