Tobacco 21 passes first vote in St. Louis County

[Antonio the Sixth]

What is the point of preserving human life if all of life is pain?

Because it'd be a lot more painful with a black lung.

Rather have a good life with black lungs than a bad one without them. We all die of something sometime.

That's exactly the level of immature teenage mindset that makes such a compelling argument in favor of this measure.

No, that's the mindset of a smoker.

And that's why tobacco must be eradicated.

[TheDeadFlagBlues]

If the government was serious about reducing smoking rates, patches/lozenges and the like would be heavily subsidized for perpetuity or provided for free indefinitely. Presumably there'd have to be a ban on marketing this kind of nicotine and the institution of strict price controls and so on but I think this would be more effective than making tobacco expensive or banning it outright.

As a note, I'd wager that Nicotine Replacement Therapy is only somewhat effective because those undertaking it are encouraged to quit nicotine altogether - which isn't easy and, frankly, isn't really desirable from a health standpoint - and, from this point forward, presuming that the NRT patient in question received a limited supply of free patches or gum, nicotine patches become about as expensive, even more expensive in some circumstances, as cigarettes or chewing tobacco. In this case, why would NRT work? Knowing that withdrawing from nicotine is a painful process that takes months to fully adjust to, whether tapered or going "cold turkey", it's little wonder that grown adults, with responsibilities and children, would avoid the process at all costs. Give them nicotine patches...

I'd suggest vaping being subsidized but that's sketchy from a health perspective and also...not behavior that should be promoted.

[I spent the winter writing songs about getting better]

How does not smoking result in a "bad life without black lungs"?

[🦀🎂🦀🎂]

Tbh I prefer this to the ever creeping tobacco tax, beloved by all lazy treasury ministers worldwide.

[TheDeadFlagBlues]

How does not smoking result in a "bad life without black lungs"?

It'll lead to a harrowing few months for the person trying to quit. It takes more than a month for "nicotinic" receptors to normalize so those attempting to quit can expect to experience chronic fatigue for this period, sleep deprivation, feelings of depression etc. There's a reason why quitting is so difficult and why there's so much resistance to restrictions on tobacco: to put it simply, it's a nightmarish experience. Those who suggest otherwise are either lying to themselves to appear stoic or to feel better or they've never been addicted to nicotine. I think it's important to understand this because, otherwise, no one will ever understand why smoking rates are persistently high or why there's so much resistance to these proposals.

There's a reason why those diagnosed with cancer of the lung tend to continue smoking before they die, as my grandpa did...

[FEMA Camp Administrator]

My quitting experience, for whatever reason, was incredibly unrepresentative and I've felt since then that I got relatively lucky. That said, there's always that part of me, no matter how small, that despises the fact that I quit. Specifically, when depressed, I regret it significantly more, and when nervous--especially when drinking--I'll void my vows, as I did last Saturday.

[Badger]

The weird, cold hearted truth, is that according to Actuarial reports lowering taxes on cigarettes at this point would actually be o-net increase for the government Treasury. Yes, there are additional Health costs involved for the government, but more people dying younger from smoking-related illnesses and that's the savings on retirement costs and non-smoking related Health costs, reportedly actually more than make up for the loss and tobacco tax revenue and increased tobacco-related Health costs combined.

Even though I'm not the one that did these studies come I still feel a little bit like I'm going to hell for even posting that.

[Chancellor Tanterterg]

What is the point of preserving human life if all of life is pain?

Because it'd be a lot more painful with a black lung.

Rather have a good life with black lungs than a bad one without them. We all die of something sometime.

That's exactly the level of immature teenage mindset that makes such a compelling argument in favor of this measure.

No, that's the mindset of a smoker.

I'm sure most cocaine addicts believe that cocaine should be legalized (obviously not the same thing, but still).  Even if you are a smoker, the idea that anyone's happiness is exclusively dependent upon smoking is ridiculous.  I don't pretend quitting is easy (my grandfather said it was absolutely brutal for about one and a half months after he quit and he relapsed every now and then for about a year), but I don't see how you can credibly claim that smoking is a good thing.  At the end of the day, it is highly addictive, very dangerous, and can lead to other people getting addicted too.  Part of why I have no issue with marijuana is that it simply isn't a danger to the user or anyone else.  With alcohol (arguably one of the more dangerous legal drugs), I can easily see the argument for raising the drinking age to 23, but I think that wouldn't do much since society sees underage drinking as a harmless vice at most and you have to be realistic about this sort of thing.  Smoking is generally seen in American society as a fundamentally bad thing, so I don't think you'd see the same level of effective long-term resistance that you would to raising the drinking age.

[YaBoyNY]

This will have about as much effect on teenagers and young adults smoking as the age to purchase alcohol being 21 does.

That is to say none at all.