Hillary Clinton is not a good candidate (based on ability to win)

[Attorney General & PPT Dwarven Dragon]

Recently, I posted this in another thread:

Honestly, Hillary has just been really lucky throughout her career of running for public office. I mean look at it:

2000: Hillary was supposed to face Rudy Giuliani, who would have been a very strong opponent. However, he dropped out of the race for health reasons, leaving her with the far weaker Rick Lazio, who put his foot in his mouth in a debate. Even then, she significantly underperformed Gore.

2006: YUGE Democratic Wave. Republicans were preoccupied with just trying to just hold on to the chamber, and Hillary was allowed to run basically unopposed.

2008 Primary: Hillary's only serious challenge. She loses.

2016 Primary: Prominent democrats endorse Hillary very early on, donating large chunks of money to her campaign to scare away a serious challenger. Her most notable challenger is a self-declared independent socialist from Vermont who nobody had ever heard of before. The DNC limited debate, took away Bernie's Voter Database until he sued them over it, gave her extra help behind the scenes, and got her several hundred superdelegate endorsements before a single vote was cast. But when the actual elections happened, Hillary hobbled through the first three contests. She then built up an insurmountable lead through victories in the South and Northeast on the backs of the black vote, but Bernie continued to maintain a significant presence and surprise people - the michigan miracle, nearly winning Obama-loving Illinois, winning every contest except Arizona that was held between March 16th and April 18th (including Democrats Abroad), and winning every caucus held in March or later. In the end, Hillary didn't clinch the nomination until June, and Sanders got several notable concessions in terms of the platform and redesigning the primary rules for 2020.

2016 General: Hillary's running against the worst out of the entire 17 candidate republican field and she's just barely ahead. Yeah, it's a polarized country. But she could still get 53,54,55 percent of the vote. Instead she just can't put Trump away, and is bleeding significant numbers of votes to Gary Johnson and Jill Stein.

Hillary is just a lucky candidate. She's not a good candidate. Against Kasich, Rubio, Christie, Pataki, Paul, Walker, Jebra, or Graham, she'd be toast.

Now, a week later, she is clearly behind in Ohio and ME-2, and at best tied in Florida, Iowa, Nevada, and North Carolina. If Trump can win those states, he gets to 266 EVs (assuming there are no surprises in Arizona or whatever). At that point, the fate of the entire nation rests on PA. A D+1 state in 2012 that trended republican in both 2008 and 2012. I'm just not comfortable with that at all. Yeah, I think Trump has a shot at actually pull this off. And not just a "technical shot". Probably close to a 40% chance. How can a fascist have that sort of a chance? It's just sad how terrible of a candidate the democrats put up this year.

Can we just agree as a forum that Clinton is a bad candidate, that her past success was based on luck, and that the dems should have run Biden instead?

[afleitch]

Obama was behind McCain at this point.

[elcorazon]

this country is not ready to elect a female President

[Attorney General & PPT Dwarven Dragon]

Obama was behind McCain at this point.

Hillary doesn't have a unpopular administration of the opposing party and a crashing economy to get a huge boost out of.

[Erich Maria Remarque]

Obama was behind McCain at this point.

Convention bump

[elcorazon]

Obama was behind McCain at this point.

Hillary doesn't have a unpopular administration of the opposing party and a crashing economy to get a huge boost out of.

but she has a massively popular administration of her own party and a solid economy!

[Erich Maria Remarque]

this country is not ready to elect a female President

Sigh. Women Card over here.

[Yank2133]

Concern trolling is the best.

[elcorazon]

this country is not ready to elect a female President

Sigh. Women Card over here.

yup. Women aren't Presidential. They lack the stamina and strength to do the job. They are irritating. They remind me of the annoying schoolteacher, not a true leader. They are shrill. How can we elect such people?

[Trapsy]

I don't think she is a strong candidate but not for the reasons you posted. You also ignore external factors affecting HRC. If anything has to do with luck, I say she is unlucky in many ways.

[Xing]

She's a better candidate than Trump, and that should be enough, unless she totally blows it in the debates.

[Erich Maria Remarque]

I don't think she is a strong candidate but not for the reasons you posted. You also ignore external factors of how affecting HRC. If anything has to do with luck, I say she is unlucky in many ways.

She is running against Donald J Trump. What else does she need?

[Ljube]

She's a better candidate than Trump, and that should be enough, unless she totally blows it in the debates.

No, Trump is the better candidate. That's why I think he will win.

[Ljube]

I think she's the only reason this race is even competitive. Any other Democrat and this race would probably be over.

[Buffalo Bill]

She's in bad health too.  Lots of people have pneumonia but don't fall from being "overheated" when it's 77 degrees with a breeze and low humidity.  In other words it was basically air conditioning.  At her age though...

[elcorazon]

I think she's the only reason this race is even competitive. Any male Democrat and this race would probably be over.

fixed

[Trapsy]

I don't think she is a strong candidate but not for the reasons you posted. You also ignore external factors of how affecting HRC. If anything has to do with luck, I say she is unlucky in many ways.

She is running against Donald J Trump. What else does she need?

in 2008 she was likely going to be the nominee and Obama a gifted pol spoils it for her. 2016 is a grounds year for an outsider. and then you compile all the scandals some self-inflicted but mostly dragged on by the media.

Now don't get me wrong I think she isn't a strong candidate in the sense that she doesn't have the gifts Bill or Barack or Biden.

[HagridOfTheDeep]

Perhaps you are right, but it's mostly for reasons completely beyond her control.

[Trapsy]

I don't think she is a strong candidate but not for the reasons you posted. You also ignore external factors of how affecting HRC. If anything has to do with luck, I say she is unlucky in many ways.

She is running against Donald J Trump. What else does she need?

The notion that just because she is running against Trump = she needs to win automatically really misses the point of why Trump is here in the first place.

[Fusionmunster]

Unhelpful.

[Buffalo Bill]

Perhaps you are right, but it's mostly for reasons completely beyond her control.

Sure! Right!!  Like Benghazi, using an unprotected server for her e-mails, her demeanor, mocking a grieving mother, paying her staff minimum wage while arguing it needs to be higher, supporting gay rights while taking money from Saudi-Arabia who throws gays off of buildings, the man she's chosen to be married to for decades, her daughter getting a $600,000 a year job with no qualifications except a last name of white privilege, name calling those who aren't sure if she should be the most powerful person in the world, donating to her own foundation and writing it off on her taxes while criticizing Republicans for doing the same thing, and hopefully I shouldn't have to name more.

[Trapsy]

Perhaps you are right, but it's mostly for reasons completely beyond her control.

Sure! Right!!  Like Benghazi, using an unprotected server for her e-mails, her demeanor, mocking a grieving mother, paying her staff minimum wage while arguing it needs to be higher, supporting gay rights while taking money from Saudi-Arabia who throws gays off of buildings, the man she's chosen to be married to for decades, her daughter getting a $600,000 a year job with no qualifications except a last name of white privilege, name calling those who aren't sure if she should be the most powerful person in the world, donating to her own foundation and writing it off on her taxes while criticizing Republicans for doing the same thing, and hopefully I shouldn't have to name more.

Bullsh**t like this is why HRC is losing.  

[Buffalo Bill]

Perhaps you are right, but it's mostly for reasons completely beyond her control.

Sure! Right!!  Like Benghazi, using an unprotected server for her e-mails, her demeanor, mocking a grieving mother, paying her staff minimum wage while arguing it needs to be higher, supporting gay rights while taking money from Saudi-Arabia who throws gays off of buildings, the man she's chosen to be married to for decades, her daughter getting a $600,000 a year job with no qualifications except a last name of white privilege, name calling those who aren't sure if she should be the most powerful person in the world, donating to her own foundation and writing it off on her taxes while criticizing Republicans for doing the same thing, and hopefully I shouldn't have to name more.

Bullsh**t like this without any context is why HRC is losing. 

Thank you for proving my point. Democrat ^

[Erich Maria Remarque]

Perhaps you are right, but it's mostly for reasons completely beyond her control.

Lol, stop it.

[Trapsy]

Perhaps you are right, but it's mostly for reasons completely beyond her control.

Sure! Right!!  Like Benghazi, using an unprotected server for her e-mails, her demeanor, mocking a grieving mother, paying her staff minimum wage while arguing it needs to be higher, supporting gay rights while taking money from Saudi-Arabia who throws gays off of buildings, the man she's chosen to be married to for decades, her daughter getting a $600,000 a year job with no qualifications except a last name of white privilege, name calling those who aren't sure if she should be the most powerful person in the world, donating to her own foundation and writing it off on her taxes while criticizing Republicans for doing the same thing, and hopefully I shouldn't have to name more.

Bullsh**t like this without any context is why HRC is losing. 

Thank you for proving my point. Democrat ^

HRC can't swim in mud, while others can.