which law is worse?
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  which law is worse?		 « previous next »
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Poll
Question: inspired by an argument between Phillip and Texasgurl
#1
The Patriot Act		  
#2
The emminent domain ruling		  
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Partisan results
Total Voters: 28

Author Topic: which law is worse?  (Read 1769 times)
MaC
Milk_and_cereal
Junior Chimp
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« on: June 29, 2005, 07:26:22 PM »
They both brought up good points.  If they'd have a discussion (without bashing eachother) I think it would be very interesting.

Honestly, I can't say which is worse.
Emminent domain violates property rights.
Patriot Act violates the fourth amendment.

vote and discuss (discussion open to all members by the way)
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opebo
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« Reply #1 on: June 29, 2005, 07:28:38 PM »
The Patriot Act is far worse.  The emminent domain thing is fine as long as the property is paid for.
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Cashcow
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« Reply #2 on: June 29, 2005, 07:33:37 PM »
They're both absolutely terrible.
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Emsworth
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« Reply #3 on: June 29, 2005, 08:38:08 PM »
The Patriot Act is much worse. The abrogations of civil liberties involved are terrible.
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The Dowager Mod
texasgurl
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« Reply #4 on: June 29, 2005, 08:41:46 PM »
The patriot act.
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A18
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« Reply #5 on: June 29, 2005, 09:00:13 PM »
The eminent domain ruling was correct. The Patriot Act is a solid piece of legislation. Nothing is remotely bad, though using eminent domain in the way that was ruled constitutional is very bad.
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Erc
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« Reply #6 on: June 29, 2005, 10:27:48 PM »
Eminent Domain, by far.
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Cubby
Pim Fortuyn
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« Reply #7 on: June 30, 2005, 12:54:38 AM »
I don't like either law, but the PATRIOT Act (most artificial acronym ever!) is more offensive to my sense of civil liberties.

I disagree with the court on eminent domain, but I'm not clear on all its ramifications for private property owners.
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StatesRights
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« Reply #8 on: June 30, 2005, 01:29:10 AM »
Oh yeah, the patriot act has been so terrible. What exactly has it done that has been bad?
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2952-0-0
exnaderite
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« Reply #9 on: June 30, 2005, 02:29:57 AM »
being forced off your land vs. snooping around without proper procedure? At least the first one is out and open.
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Ebowed
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« Reply #10 on: June 30, 2005, 04:27:23 AM »
Quote from: Cashcow on June 29, 2005, 07:33:37 PM
They're both absolutely terrible.
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MasterJedi
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« Reply #11 on: June 30, 2005, 01:19:09 PM »
The Supreme Court ruling, I support the Patriot Act. Smiley
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The Dowager Mod
texasgurl
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« Reply #12 on: June 30, 2005, 02:54:12 PM »
I would rather be homeless and keep my civil rights than live in a mansion and have none.
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Bono
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« Reply #13 on: June 30, 2005, 02:55:48 PM »
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A18
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« Reply #14 on: June 30, 2005, 03:05:16 PM »
You just posted a topic on states' rights, and now when they're honored you call it a 'bad ruling?'
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Bono
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« Reply #15 on: June 30, 2005, 03:20:32 PM »
Quote from: Laissez-faire on June 30, 2005, 03:05:16 PM
You just posted a topic on states' rights, and now when they're honored you call it a 'bad ruling?'

They didn't honor states' rights becuase they didn't use that doctrine when issuing the ruling. They followed the same old anti states' rights rationale, only by cohincidence they achieved the good result.
EDIT: and if you read the topic, post there then. Tongue
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Joe Republic
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« Reply #16 on: June 30, 2005, 03:24:18 PM »
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Brandon H
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« Reply #17 on: June 30, 2005, 05:46:09 PM »

Keep it going. Both are bad. But we still have the second amendment. So I think it would be easier to defend property than freedom. So the Providing Appropriate Tools
Required to Intercept and Obstruct Terrorism Act is worse.
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nclib
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« Reply #18 on: June 30, 2005, 07:07:16 PM »
Patriot Act is far worse.
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MaC
Milk_and_cereal
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« Reply #19 on: June 30, 2005, 10:26:01 PM »
okay, I have to wonder now, is this actually a partisan thing.  We (mostly) all agree both are bad, but Democrats think the Patriot Act is worse and Republicans think emminent domain is worse?  And if it is a partisan thing, then why? 
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A18
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« Reply #20 on: June 30, 2005, 10:33:35 PM »
« Edited: June 30, 2005, 10:37:22 PM by Laissez-faire »
Both are good.

Gallup Poll
February 2004

Based on what you have read or heard, do you think the Patriot Act --  Goes too far (27.14%), Is about right (44.73%), Does not go far enough (19.18%), DON'T KNOW (8.35%), REFUSED (0.60%)
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opebo
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« Reply #21 on: June 30, 2005, 10:39:31 PM »
February 2004 is a long time ago, and opinion has turned against all that 'war on terror' nonsense since then.

Besides, most people would be happy to see freedom and individual rights eliminated.
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Cubby
Pim Fortuyn
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« Reply #22 on: June 30, 2005, 10:50:29 PM »
Quote from: StatesRights™ on June 30, 2005, 01:29:10 AM
Oh yeah, the patriot act has been so terrible. What exactly has it done that has been bad?

The library and bookstore provision. Our government actually thinks terrorists will go into one and take out a book on bomb-making! (There probably aren't any anyway).

Therefore I think this part of the Patriot Act is intended to let big (conservative) government keep tabs on what innocent citizens are reading, since they fear a citizenry that questions things. Just look at all of Bush's staged "town-hall meetings" where everyone is required to love the President and anyone else is litteraly hustled out by goons.
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MaC
Milk_and_cereal
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« Reply #23 on: June 30, 2005, 10:52:37 PM »
Quote from: opebo on June 30, 2005, 10:39:31 PM
Besides, most people would be happy to see freedom and individual rights eliminated.

I disagree, I think people are way too complacent about it.  They don't pay much mind to it, until it personally affects them, and then when it does, they rarely try to change it because they're lazy.  They don't like it, but they're too damn lazy to care much about it.
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nini2287
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« Reply #24 on: June 30, 2005, 11:13:08 PM »
Patriot Act-excellent law, although some specific abuses need to be examined

eminent domain ruling-terrible

I guess I'm a Republican then.
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