Did the right side win the Cold War?

[NeverAgain]

Democracy won, sure.

The fact that it was interpreted as a victory for muh free market instead is what turned the post-Cold War era into a growing disaster.

[SWE]

Given that Bernie Sanders got more than a single vote, I'm not so sure that we've won yet.

It's pretty insulting to the millions who suffered under Stalinist dictatorships that you consider slightly expanding the role of the United States to be comparable to these atrocities.

[White Trash]

Democracy won, sure.

The fact that it was interpreted as a victory for muh free market instead is what turned the post-Cold War era into a growing disaster.

[Intell]

Neither side was right.

This, thogh I would be fine to have the soviet union, and the US co-exist, hopefully having more civic rights in the USSR, and more social equity and solidarity in the west. The collapse of the soviet union,  caused a lot of harm (and has not been perfect merry-good)

[Fitzgerald]

Given that Bernie Sanders got more than a single vote, I'm not so sure that we've won yet.

Oh, sweet Jesus. Who are you, Joseph McCarthy?

Anyway: yes, but the hard swing into Reaganism that this country took in the process has been slowly strangling us ever since.

[OSR stands with Israel]

Given that Bernie Sanders got more than a single vote, I'm not so sure that we've won yet.

Oh, sweet Jesus. Who are you, Joseph McCarthy?

Anyway: yes, but the hard swing into Reaganism that this country took in the process has been slowly strangling us ever since.

It's hilarious that his screen name is literally 'Cold Warrior'.

Its a pretty awesome name

[bagelman]

The Soviets were about as communist as modern China after the rise of Stalin, simply replace corporatism in modern china with brutal totalitarianism. The USA was closer to practicing what it preached.

[Chunk Yogurt for President!]

I like not going to the gulag.

[🦀🎂🦀🎂]

With Russia's current behaviour, I would argue that is too early to say it has ended. After all, despite the beliefs of the ideological true believers on both sides, the Cold War eventually became a matter of moronic nationalistic dickwaving on both sides (although the fact that the west was infinitely better to its population should be taken into account, lest we fall into silly "ACTUALLY ALL SIDES ARE AS BAD AS EACH OTHER" traps) - with both parties distorting their doctrine to fit the central aim of beating the other side.

Has the world improved because of the fall of the Cold War? Well, in some cases yes, and immeasurably so. The fall of the Eastern Bloc was enormously beneficial for the populations of those countries. Various authoritarian regimes in the developing world - sponsored by both sides for geopolitical reasons - fell as their backers lost interest; which in many cases has helped the beleaguered inhabitants. Other countries found themselves a bit more lost in the shuffle. Russia itself is a country that certainly hasn't really benefited from the end of the Cold War. I doubt even the most hardened capitalist can say Yeltsin or Putin were preferable to Gorby staying in power perestroiking up the place.

[FEMA Camp Administrator]

Has the world improved because of the fall of the Cold War? Well, in some cases yes, and immeasurably so. The fall of the Eastern Bloc was enormously beneficial for the populations of those countries. Various authoritarian regimes in the developing world - sponsored by both sides for geopolitical reasons - fell as their backers lost interest; which in many cases has helped the beleaguered inhabitants. Other countries found themselves a bit more lost in the shuffle. Russia itself is a country that certainly hasn't really benefited from the end of the Cold War.

That's about what I would say. To those that believe the collapse of the Soviet Union resulted in some ever-lasting battle cry of freedom, obviously things haven't been perfect, especially for Russia. Nevertheless, I'd dare you to go tell a Pole that he or she'd be better off as a citizen of a Warsaw Pact member state.

[Vosem]

Yes, obviously, and it's integral that the victory of the free market be defended.

[Cashew]

Yes, the lesser evil.

[HisGrace]

The Soviets were about as communist as modern China after the rise of Stalin, simply replace corporatism in modern china with brutal totalitarianism. The USA was closer to practicing what it preached.

Stalin was the one who implemented all the forced collectivization, thus pushing them further towards "Full Communism". Pre-Stalin they actually let peasants operate farms individually and keep their own yield, which is basically capitalism.

[Mr. Reactionary]

I like not going to the gulag.

[Sedona]

Of course.  The US had its fair share of flaws, but democracy is generally preferable to despotism.

[MASHED POTATOES. VOTE!]

Yes, obviously, and it's integral that the victory of the free market be defended.

I see the political freedom is secondary to you.

[Antonio the Sixth]

Yes, obviously, and it's integral that the victory of the free market be defended.

I see the political freedom is secondary to you.

Are you surprised? This is Vosem.

[Green Line]

Yes, obviously, and it's integral that the victory of the free market be defended.

I see the political freedom is secondary to you.

Political freedom is but a vehicle for economic freedom, silly man.

[IceAgeComing]

Funny joke there pal, you could make a good living from lines like that...  To be a little more serious, I could probably say that I agree that (I mean who doesn't really), although I'm pretty sure that my description of "economic freedom" (in a perfect world based on democratising the economy by involving workers in the management of their companies: may it be through encouraging the formation of co-operatives or common ownership practices, through encouraging unionisation in all areas of the economy to provide better and more equitable employer/employee relationships and through mandating that after companies had grown to a particular side they had to have workers representatives on their board to ensure that the interests of workers are represented in corporate decisions) wouldn't ever match up with yours.

Although it is fair to say that in some cases (thinking of East Germany primarily here) the economic differences between the West and the East (or at least the perceived differences, people did find themselves comparing real life experiences with the sort of one-sided perspective that you saw through the television) did play a role in popular discontent over the regime, although political concerns were probably more important.  I think you probably would find that when people in ex-Communist countries were exposed to the true harshness of capitalism rather than the utopianistic perspective portrayed through Western media that - it would explain the rise of things like Ostnostalgia in East Germany and also the fact that "right-wing" parties often favour state invention - indeed in some post-Communist states in the 1990s the ex-communist "socialist" or "social-democratic" (as much as ideology matters in CEE states, which often isn't a lot) parties were often the biggest advocates of shock therapy and rapid economic reforms while the "conservative" allegedly right-wing parties favoured more gradual progress, although generally with the same aim in mind.

In terms of whether the "right side" (as much as right sides really exist in the world which really isn't that often) won then from the perspective of someone who identifies as both a democrat and a socialist I feel that we do live in a better world now than we would have if an authoritarian Soviet Union was the dominant power, although that may well have democratised over time, who knows (certainly if you look at orthodox Marxist theory then after you achieved "communism" then the state would begin to disappear but honestly the USSR really wasn't following that sort of thing much after the 30s or 40s anyway - the person who described the Cold War as being inherently nationalistic rather than ideological probably has the right idea.

Posted this in a quiet period at work and the language on this computer is French I *think*; if this lapses into gibberish then I must apologise, couldn't proof-read it like I normally try to do.

[Intell]

The Soviets were about as communist as modern China after the rise of Stalin, simply replace corporatism in modern china with brutal totalitarianism. The USA was closer to practicing what it preached.

Stalin was the one who implemented all the forced collectivization, thus pushing them further towards "Full Communism". Pre-Stalin they actually let peasants operate farms individually and keep their own yield, which is basically capitalism.

No...

[Since I'm the mad scientist proclaimed by myself]

Yes, obviously, and it's integral that the victory of the free market be defended.

I see the political freedom is secondary to you.

Political freedom is but a vehicle for economic freedom, silly man.

I'd laugh if it wasn't for the fact that you're probably serious...

[Zioneer]

I'd make a joke about the Non-Aligned Movement not winning, but eh.

[Lyin' Steve]

Yes, the side that promoted the mass slaughter of innocents and the eradication of all free will as state policy, thankfully, lost.

[Murica!]

The Soviets were about as communist as modern China after the rise of Stalin, simply replace corporatism in modern china with brutal totalitarianism. The USA was closer to practicing what it preached.

Stalin was the one who implemented all the forced collectivization, thus pushing them further towards "Full Communism". Pre-Stalin they actually let peasants operate farms individually and keep their own yield, which is basically capitalism.

No.

[All Along The Watchtower]

ITT (mostly) young (??) people stuck in the late 1940s/1950s

Of course Communism was awful and an utter failure (who seriously argues that it wasn't? Besides some fringe cults on the Far Left I guess?) but I'm not certain that that's a good argument for muh free markets. If "at least we're way better than Stalin lol" is the main argument than we might as well also say "but then again Stalin played a big role in defeating the Nazis so I guess it all evens out in the end ."