If the source, should Rove be jailed?

[??????????]

First off it hasn't even been proven she was undercover. Many have said she wasn't. This case will be impossible to prove. This is a JFERN bitch and whine issue and nothing more.

[MODU]

If he is guilty of intentionally "outing" her, he should be fired.  If he is guilty of a crime, he should be jailed.  If neither is the case, everyone needs to insert foot in mouth.  And finally, when all is said and done, and Rove is found to be clear of any wrong doing, I say he should step down graciously, just to remove the potential lightning rod out of the White House.

[○∙◄☻¥tπ[╪AV┼cVê└]

First off it hasn't even been proven she was undercover. Many have said she wasn't. This case will be impossible to prove. This is a JFERN bitch and whine issue and nothing more.

So you support people who commit grand treason? Why do you hate America?

[Speed of Sound]

First off it hasn't even been proven she was undercover. Many have said she wasn't. This case will be impossible to prove. This is a JFERN bitch and whine issue and nothing more.

So you support people who commit grand treason? Why do you hate America?

the world may never know

[Swing low, sweet chariot. Comin' for to carry me home.]

All "reasonable" people should remember the context of Rove's conversation given that "intent" is part of the law.

In those days, the administration was under fire for not reading and listening to the Niger reports, which the administration supposedly commissioned.  Rove pointed out to the reporters that not only was the administration not neglecting the reports, but that the administration did not commission the reports, rather that the CIA commissioned the trip and that Wilson's wife, who works for the CIA, pulled strings to get Wilson selected for the trip.

So, Rove's "intent" was to point out that the trip to Niger and the report about Niger were not "commissioned" by the administration; therefore the administration can't be blamed for ignoring the results of it’s own supposedly commissioned investigations.

Clearly, Rove's "intent" was also to discredit the author of the report by stating that Wilson landed the job somewhat unethically because his wife, who works at the CIA, recommended him for the job.  (The independent 9/11 Report confirmed that Wilson's wife recommended Wilson for the job and that the recommendation didn't pass the smell test).

---

So not only did Rove not break the law, Rove's actions weren’t even unethical.

[MODU]

So you support people who commit grand treason?

Do you mean "high treason?"

[MissCatholic]

He is innocent at the moment.

Yet the democrats should attack him and drag it out.

First six months = Tom Delay.
Next Six Months = Karl Rove.

The Republicans will use Saddams trail to get re-elected while the dems need to keep the pressure on. The Republicans have gone way to close to Mr. Theocracy and this will scare alot of moderates.

[Blue Rectangle]

not to mention this jepordizes basically every operation they've ever been on. All foreign governments they've had contact with now know tha was a CIA agent, could get quite messy.

indeed

Let's assume that her cover overseas (if one existed, we don't know if she worked undercover overseas at all): A) didn't use her real name and B) didn't link her by marriage to a career diplomat.  What then was "blown"?  The information in Novak's article only revealed that Joe Wilson's wife was named Valerie Plame (common knowledge) and that she worked for the CIA.  That second fact was likely common knowledge as well, because Plame made little effort to conceal that she worked for a known CIA front company.  There are also stories that she often disclosed at social gatherings that she worked for the CIA.  Whether this is true is not very important, because the simple fact that she was married to a former ambassador is more than enough to make any foreign government cautious around her.

So what damage was actually done?  She was linked by name to her picture, which would certainly prevent her from ever working undercover.  But Novak didn't run her picture.  It was Wilson and Plame who ensured that her picture ran in the media.  It's hard to claim that the publicity might endanger either Wilson or Plame, when the two have been so eager to be in the spotlight.

[J. J.]

So you support people who commit grand treason?

Do you mean "high treason?"

Ah has been pointed out to JFRAUD in the past, there isn't a crime of "grand treason," (except prehaps rattling around in his own brain) nor in the US one of "High Treason."  It's a British offense. There is one of "treason," but it doesn't apply in this case.

As to a less treasonous violation of statute, there are a whole bunch of qualifications.  She has to be undercover, the CIA must "actively" trying to protect that cover, she must have been out of the country (working) at some point over the last five years.  We don't really have a good idea if Ms. Palme is covered by the statute.

Assuming that she is covered, the release must be with the intent of damaging her ability to serve undercover and the releaser much be aware that she is undercover.  From what has surfaced, Rove's comments indicated that Wilson was not sent by Cheney or Tennent, which actually cleared up some misinformation in the press.  The evidence, so far, is that the intent wasn't there.  Wilson's trip was known and was reported in the press, so he wasn't revealing a secret there.

It's a weak to non-existent case, so far.

[Smash255]

People, you can't be put in jail for saying someone's wife works for the CIA....get a grip.

Umm,  the law doesn't say you have to actually name the peron.  What the law states is ANY INFORMATION regarding an covert CIA operative, ANY INFORMATION

[Jake]

People, you can't be put in jail for saying someone's wife works for the CIA....get a grip.

Umm,  the law doesn't say you have to actually name the peron.  What the law states is ANY INFORMATION regarding an covert CIA operative, ANY INFORMATION

So, if you were commenting to someone about your friend's wife and they happened to be a CIA covert operative and you didn't know this, would you support your own prosecution.

[Blue Rectangle]

People, you can't be put in jail for saying someone's wife works for the CIA....get a grip.

Umm,  the law doesn't say you have to actually name the peron.  What the law states is ANY INFORMATION regarding an covert CIA operative, ANY INFORMATION

So, if you were commenting to someone about your friend's wife and they happened to be a CIA covert operative and you didn't know this, would you support your own prosecution.

It's not just "any information".  The information must identify the covert agent:

You must be logged in to read this quote.

There are no indications yet that Rove knew Plame was a covert agent.  In addition, Rove had to know that the U.S. was taking "affirmative measures to conceal" Plame's relationship to the U.S.  It's not clear that the U.S. was taking those measures, let alone that Rove knew about them.

It doesn't seem to me that Rove's info identified Plame in such a way that blew her cover.  Plame was known to be Wilson's wife, so what difference would it make to any foreign intelligence service that she actually worked for the CIA?  All U.S. diplomats and their relatives are generally treated by foreign intelligence as if everything they know is reported directly to the CIA, because in most cases, it is.  Presumably, when (if) Valerie Plame was covert, she didn't identify herself as "Valerie Plame, wife of a U.S. ambassador".

[Smash255]

People, you can't be put in jail for saying someone's wife works for the CIA....get a grip.

Umm,  the law doesn't say you have to actually name the peron.  What the law states is ANY INFORMATION regarding an covert CIA operative, ANY INFORMATION

So, if you were commenting to someone about your friend's wife and they happened to be a CIA covert operative and you didn't know this, would you support your own prosecution.

It's not just "any information".  The information must identify the covert agent:

You must be logged in to read this quote.

There are no indications yet that Rove knew Plame was a covert agent.  In addition, Rove had to know that the U.S. was taking "affirmative measures to conceal" Plame's relationship to the U.S.  It's not clear that the U.S. was taking those measures, let alone that Rove knew about them.

It doesn't seem to me that Rove's info identified Plame in such a way that blew her cover.  Plame was known to be Wilson's wife, so what difference would it make to any foreign intelligence service that she actually worked for the CIA?  All U.S. diplomats and their relatives are generally treated by foreign intelligence as if everything they know is reported directly to the CIA, because in most cases, it is.  Presumably, when (if) Valerie Plame was covert, she didn't identify herself as "Valerie Plame, wife of a U.S. ambassador".

Well him saying that it was his wife qualifies & she was a covert agent.  I will admit the legalities are still up in the air.  However the administartion has said that Rove was not involved in it & also has stated that they would fiire anyone involved, that hasn't happened & we do know for a fact Rove was involved

[MODU]

Well him saying that it was his wife qualifies & she was a covert agent. 

I have not seen anything yet showing Rove said Plame was a covert agent.  Reading the e-mails released to the public, there is nothing there other than Wilson received the mission from his wife, who was a CIA (note: nothing indicating covert) agent.

[Smash255]

Well him saying that it was his wife qualifies & she was a covert agent. 

I have not seen anything yet showing Rove said Plame was a covert agent.  Reading the e-mails released to the public, there is nothing there other than Wilson received the mission from his wife, who was a CIA (note: nothing indicating covert) agent.

Point I'm making is that at this point their is no question regarding if she was a covert agent, some people are suggesting she might not have been, thats false.  She was a covert agent period.  Now wheter Rove did anything technically illegalis still up in ther air, although I think he tiptoed the line at the least.  Not to mention what was said about Rove not being involevd at all, which we know to be false

[ATFFL]

Well him saying that it was his wife qualifies & she was a covert agent. 

I have not seen anything yet showing Rove said Plame was a covert agent.  Reading the e-mails released to the public, there is nothing there other than Wilson received the mission from his wife, who was a CIA (note: nothing indicating covert) agent.

Point I'm making is that at this point their is no question regarding if she was a covert agent, some people are suggesting she might not have been, thats false.  She was a covert agent period.  Now wheter Rove did anything technically illegalis still up in ther air, although I think he tiptoed the line at the least.  Not to mention what was said about Rove not being involevd at all, which we know to be false

Technically, Rove says she is "apparently" with the CIA.  He found that out, according to his attorney, from a reporter asking him for comment. 

I would like someone to ask Mr. Rove who his source was.

[Smash255]

Well him saying that it was his wife qualifies & she was a covert agent. 

I have not seen anything yet showing Rove said Plame was a covert agent.  Reading the e-mails released to the public, there is nothing there other than Wilson received the mission from his wife, who was a CIA (note: nothing indicating covert) agent.

Point I'm making is that at this point their is no question regarding if she was a covert agent, some people are suggesting she might not have been, thats false.  She was a covert agent period.  Now wheter Rove did anything technically illegalis still up in ther air, although I think he tiptoed the line at the least.  Not to mention what was said about Rove not being involevd at all, which we know to be false

Technically, Rove says she is "apparently" with the CIA.  He found that out, according to his attorney, from a reporter asking him for comment. 

I would like someone to ask Mr. Rove who his source was.

His attorney is obviosuly going to try & put the best face on this whole situation, we will see what happens, but the bottom line is he did release information regarding an undercover CIA agent & that goes against what the administration was syaing prior to this revelation

[J. J.]

Technically, Rove says she is "apparently" with the CIA.  He found that out, according to his attorney, from a reporter asking him for comment. 

I would like someone to ask Mr. Rove who his source was.

His attorney is obviosuly going to try & put the best face on this whole situation, we will see what happens, but the bottom line is he did release information regarding an undercover CIA agent & that goes against what the administration was syaing prior to this revelation

No, from what can be determined, so far, he thought that Palme might have been with the agency.  He didn't know her status or tell any the Time reporter that she was with the agency.

I seriously wondering if Joe Wilson might not have tipped someone off.

[ATFFL]

I seriously wondering if Joe Wilson might not have tipped someone off.

I wonder who talked to the NYT reporter.  Rove has repeatedly said anyoen he talked to does not need to protect him as a confidential source.  He has even signed documents releasing them from any confidentiality agreements.

So, who told the New York Times?

[??????????]

Hang Rove for High treason if he's guilty. The queen would be proud. lol

[MODU]

His attorney is obviosuly going to try & put the best face on this whole situation, we will see what happens, but the bottom line is he did release information regarding an undercover CIA agent & that goes against what the administration was syaing prior to this revelation

She was not undercover at the time she sent her husband to Africa, but rather an analyst for the CIA on WMDs.  She had worked undercover in the 1990s.

[○∙◄☻¥tπ[╪AV┼cVê└]

His attorney is obviosuly going to try & put the best face on this whole situation, we will see what happens, but the bottom line is he did release information regarding an undercover CIA agent & that goes against what the administration was syaing prior to this revelation

She was not undercover at the time she sent her husband to Africa, but rather an analyst for the CIA on WMDs.  She had worked undercover in the 1990s.

She was absolutely under-cover when she was outed.

[MODU]

His attorney is obviosuly going to try & put the best face on this whole situation, we will see what happens, but the bottom line is he did release information regarding an undercover CIA agent & that goes against what the administration was syaing prior to this revelation

She was not undercover at the time she sent her husband to Africa, but rather an analyst for the CIA on WMDs.  She had worked undercover in the 1990s.

She was absolutely under-cover when she was outed.

She was undercover while working in Langley as an analyst?  I don't think so.  Unless CIA undercover agents make a habbit of hiding in the CIA headquarters . . . which might explain why we have a hard time getting good intelligence these days.

[Blue Rectangle]

His attorney is obviosuly going to try & put the best face on this whole situation, we will see what happens, but the bottom line is he did release information regarding an undercover CIA agent & that goes against what the administration was syaing prior to this revelation

She was not undercover at the time she sent her husband to Africa, but rather an analyst for the CIA on WMDs.  She had worked undercover in the 1990s.

She was absolutely under-cover when she was outed.

You must be logged in to read this quote.

Joe Wilson has, from the very beginning, insisted that Rove named his wife.  There is still no indication that he did.  It is also curious that Wilson immediately named Rove as the source of the leak.  What information about the leak did Wilson have when the story broke?

Wilson's statement above is an argument that "doesn't stand the smell test".  Is he actually claiming that his wife's cover identity consisted of her taking her husband's name when she married him?  If so, then MODU is right, no wonder we have such intelligence problems!

[minionofmidas]

His attorney is obviosuly going to try & put the best face on this whole situation, we will see what happens, but the bottom line is he did release information regarding an undercover CIA agent & that goes against what the administration was syaing prior to this revelation

She was not undercover at the time she sent her husband to Africa, but rather an analyst for the CIA on WMDs.  She had worked undercover in the 1990s.

She was absolutely under-cover when she was outed.

She was undercover while working in Langley as an analyst?  I don't think so.  Unless CIA undercover agents make a habbit of hiding in the CIA headquarters . . . which might explain why we have a hard time getting good intelligence these days.

And whose fault is that? The administation's.